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Posted on 7/19/14 at 8:24 pm to Zach
I remain at a loss for words. Debate used to show mental agility and quick thinking.
One used to argue both sides of a debate during the debate. And the judges would disregard the garbage that was thrown out there in this debate.
This does absolutely nothing to showcase any useful skill.
If this is what debate is now then I would lose every time.
Time for people to start different debate leagues. Leagues where rules are followed and structured arguments win over nonsense.
One used to argue both sides of a debate during the debate. And the judges would disregard the garbage that was thrown out there in this debate.
This does absolutely nothing to showcase any useful skill.
If this is what debate is now then I would lose every time.
Time for people to start different debate leagues. Leagues where rules are followed and structured arguments win over nonsense.
Posted on 7/19/14 at 8:42 pm to thetempleowl
I wish this was ruled a no-contest.
Posted on 7/19/14 at 8:51 pm to thetempleowl
quote:
This does absolutely nothing to showcase any useful skill.
Racist
quote:
Time for people to start different debate leagues. Leagues where rules are followed and structured arguments win over nonsense.
Creating racist institutions
Posted on 7/19/14 at 9:13 pm to thetempleowl
What, you think going back to straight policy would make CX debate "educational" or something? You think the policy kids understand half the shite they spread? That they are engaging the material, carefully considering who John Yoo or Eric Posner are, what they're saying about war powers, the historical context and implications of their arguments? In short, you think anyone gives a frick about the logic? Hell no, they know someone found something in a summer camp that says "strong president good" and that it goes in their "strong president good" folder to break out when someone runs a "strong president bad" aff/CP.
Who is actually reading the cards? I don't mean spreading them, I mean reading them. Tab judges don't care. Even if they did, asking them to weigh the evidence is a mug's game unless you luck into one that's learned in the topic. Opponents can ask for cards but they only have so much prep time and with spreading, you need to spend most of that matching "X good" with "X bad," not engaging the material. And unless a card is objectively being misused by selective quoting, in-round it's tough to establish the relative credibility of sources, especially obscure ones.
Policy can get every bit as far up its own arse. Non-topical affs full of cherry-picked FX-T evidence because FX-T is rarely a voting issue? They got 'em. D/As with extremely tenuous links to triple apocalypsocaust-scale impacts because you have to outweigh everything? They got 'em. Saying debate has to be "logical" assumes that in policy the cards are being thrown together with a view towards building a coherent, logical whole that would exist outside the realm of debate and not "screw the other team." I hate to break it to you but Ks have a lot of company out there in la-la-land.
CX didn't suddenly become a cynical game because some black kids discovered Foucault and Lacan. It was a cynical game long before that.
Who is actually reading the cards? I don't mean spreading them, I mean reading them. Tab judges don't care. Even if they did, asking them to weigh the evidence is a mug's game unless you luck into one that's learned in the topic. Opponents can ask for cards but they only have so much prep time and with spreading, you need to spend most of that matching "X good" with "X bad," not engaging the material. And unless a card is objectively being misused by selective quoting, in-round it's tough to establish the relative credibility of sources, especially obscure ones.
Policy can get every bit as far up its own arse. Non-topical affs full of cherry-picked FX-T evidence because FX-T is rarely a voting issue? They got 'em. D/As with extremely tenuous links to triple apocalypsocaust-scale impacts because you have to outweigh everything? They got 'em. Saying debate has to be "logical" assumes that in policy the cards are being thrown together with a view towards building a coherent, logical whole that would exist outside the realm of debate and not "screw the other team." I hate to break it to you but Ks have a lot of company out there in la-la-land.
CX didn't suddenly become a cynical game because some black kids discovered Foucault and Lacan. It was a cynical game long before that.
Posted on 7/19/14 at 9:15 pm to Tigerlaff
quote:
What in the actual frick did I just witness?
Progressive debating.
Posted on 7/19/14 at 9:47 pm to Iosh
quote:
Saying debate has to be "logical" assumes that in policy the cards are being thrown together with a view towards building a coherent, logical whole that would exist outside the realm of debate and not "screw the other team." I hate to break it to you but Ks have a lot of company out there in la-la-land.
at least tehy are addressing the topic at hand, and not delving into random topics that literally have nothing to do with what it supposed to be debated. that is a true sign of an inability to even discuss the topic, let alone debate it
quote:
CX didn't suddenly become a cynical game because some black kids discovered Foucault and Lacan. It was a cynical game long before that.
race has nothing to do with it and just because some black parties use race as a crutch doesn't make it legitimate
Posted on 7/19/14 at 10:05 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:That is exactly what they are doing. If your issue with this style is topicality then you've got a lot bigger problems than some racism Ks
at least tehy are addressing the topic at hand, and not delving into random topics that literally have nothing to do with what it supposed to be debated
Posted on 7/19/14 at 10:13 pm to BeYou
From now on when I get into an argument that I can't win, I'm just going to pull this trump card:
quote:
The more pressing issue, they argued, is how the U.S. government is at war with poor black communities.
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:12 pm to Iosh
quote:
That is exactly what they are doing.
addressing the topic?
what does a discussion on being an "authentic ni--a" or "White culture" have to do with war powers?
or frick, one of those guys was just doing a tupac song. what does that have to do with war powers?
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:16 pm to Iosh
quote:
Ks
are you signing your posts or is this an acronym for something?
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:29 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
addressing the topic?
No, you idiot. Can you even keep your own pronouns straight? Here, let me quote the entire argument together so your dumb arse can keep up
quote:
Saying debate has to be "logical" assumes that in policy the cards are being thrown together with a view towards building a coherent, logical whole
quote:
at least tehy are addressing the topic at hand, and not delving into random topics that literally have nothing to do with what it supposed to be debated.
quote:What does "they" refer to? Policy teams. What aren't these debaters? Policy teams. And policy teams go off-topic just as much as non-policy teams.
That is exactly what they are doing.
Have you ever seen a "standard" CX round? Do you even know what CX debate is? Since you're asking what a K is I'm guessing the answer to both is no. Conclusion: you're watching a small part of a video depicting a game, the rules of which you don't understand, and asserting with absolutely no knowledge or experience that the players are doing it wrong. Gosh I wonder where this unearned sense of superiority stems from.
This post was edited on 7/19/14 at 11:36 pm
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:33 pm to Iosh
quote:
You're watching a small part of a video about a game you don't understand and telling the players they're doing it wrong
it doesn't take insight or an encyclopedic knowledge of debate to understand that discussing being an authentic black person has nothing to do with war powers.
that argument from authority is weaksauce
and yes, i took a while to finish a movie and there was a slight confusion. i'm asking simple questions, though
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:42 pm to Iosh
I suppose yelling "frick the time!" when time is up is just some part of debate rules that i dont understand
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:49 pm to Zach
I'm going to try this debate style...
Hu hu...
The white structure reduces the ability of the African stick horse
Hu hu...
To maligate the ionosphere of the black glider pilot
Hu hu
Unfortunately the malterment of the stir crazy popcorn popper
Hu hu
Mitigates the maltreasance of the Nubian knuckle ball pitcher
Hu hu
White doses of manatee dopamine combined with Sherman Helmsley
Hu Hu
Only contributes to the reaction of the deviance of synonyms
Hu hu
Minecraft holes be dug in the heart of the black slave
Hu hu
Redeem the muffler that sells it's soul to Chuck Woolery
Hu hu
Perchance a malleable patriarchy born from majestic blackness
Hu hu
But is blackness retroactive to the derision of the turtle eggs
Hu hu
Mic drop
Hu hu...
The white structure reduces the ability of the African stick horse
Hu hu...
To maligate the ionosphere of the black glider pilot
Hu hu
Unfortunately the malterment of the stir crazy popcorn popper
Hu hu
Mitigates the maltreasance of the Nubian knuckle ball pitcher
Hu hu
White doses of manatee dopamine combined with Sherman Helmsley
Hu Hu
Only contributes to the reaction of the deviance of synonyms
Hu hu
Minecraft holes be dug in the heart of the black slave
Hu hu
Redeem the muffler that sells it's soul to Chuck Woolery
Hu hu
Perchance a malleable patriarchy born from majestic blackness
Hu hu
But is blackness retroactive to the derision of the turtle eggs
Hu hu
Mic drop
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:55 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:No, it doesn't. What does take insight into debate, or at least watching a sample size greater than 1, is that topicality is a joke, and a great many policy teams end up focusing on issues that are just as non-topical.
it doesn't take insight or an encyclopedic knowledge of debate to understand that discussing being an authentic black person has nothing to do with war powers.
Posted on 7/19/14 at 11:58 pm to Iosh
quote:
and a great many policy teams end up focusing on issues that are just as non-topical.
if you present that example to me, i would mock it the same. i've seen many articles written on this issue, and they don't describe the situation as you are describing it. hell schools were going to form a new league that was more traditional, and then claims of "racism" (the ultimate crutch) emerged
and i'm not doubting your sincerity, but people who are at the top of some historic groups are explaining things differently than you are
Posted on 7/20/14 at 12:48 am to Iosh
They made a movie about this
Posted on 7/20/14 at 1:21 am to GeauxLSUGeaux
quote:
GeauxLSUGeaux
quote:
They made a movie about this
Except they didn't debate Harvard and were avoided by black colleges to debate not white, and the characters were fictitious, there was no contact with a lynch mob, nobody got arrested, no ginning union formed, were never national champions of debate, the first woman on a debate team was long gone in 1935 as she was on the 1930 Wiley team, but yes they indeed did make a movie about this.
Posted on 7/20/14 at 1:23 am to Iosh
quote:
Iosh
You seem knowledgeable on the subject, maybe you can answer a question for me.
How does a team of women who are spouting out nonsense you can't even understand with the exception of the "N" word win a national debate competition? And the runner up was a couple of Rastafarians singing Tupac! A gifted rapper and linguist. These people obviously have intellectual skills that us normal boring folk can't comprehend.
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