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TrueTiger
LSU Fan
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
8870 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

ummmm...5th Rights are not applicable to Third-Party protection


IF that is what was done, it is illegal and I have a WORSE view of her.




This is where you did an immunity deal and get her singing.






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doubleb
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
4952 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

I love Alan Dershowitz, however in this case he is outnumbered (Duane, Kasimar, Brand, off hand) and appears to be wrong. He has made two mistakes... first he seems to forget that Lerner was not a defendant but a witness, who can rightfully invoke the Fifth at just about any point in a trial or hearing. Second, what Lerner did speak at the hearing was a broad plea of innocence; she didn't open up any factual line of questioning, as Dershowitz says. After much reading on the matter I'm confident a judge will not see it Dershowitz's way. Now, this leads me to a separate question: why is it that all you sheep who constantly cry "tyranny!", "my liberty is being violated!", "the Second Amendment!" blah blah blah all of a sudden want to deny Ms. Lerner her Fifth Amendment rights? Like I've said, I'm no fan of Lois Lerner. I would have fired both her and David Shulman days ago, before yesterday's hearing. She is, though, entitled to justice, and any ambiguity in the law or in case precedent, whatsoever, should defer to her rights. I'm disappointed in Dershowitz; he should know better.


I'm not a legal scholar so I'll let the lawyers argue, that's what they are trained to do.

But I agree 100% with your last two paragraphs.
All of our amendments are equal and need to be protected, and these corrupt IRS officials need to be fired and the truth discovered as to what was going on and how many were directly and indirectly involved.

I'm glad you can see that Rex because if the POTUS, whethe rit be from my party or yours can use government to attack his politica enemies the way Nixon did; then we are all going to lose the rights we have. That is clear to me.

I think we need a special prosecutor and let him/her investigate and then let the chips fall where they may.






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Rex
LSU Fan
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
52409 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

ummmm...5th Rights are not applicable to Third-Party protection

Where'd you come up with that notion?






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BlackHelicopterPilot
LSU Fan
Top secret lab
Member since Feb 2004
30659 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

I don't dress up my dogs on a regular basis.


Just to be clear..he said that YOU dress up AS a dog on a regular basis.

I have no direct knowledge of the veracity of that statement, either. But, your reply was not congruent with his allegation.







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memphis tiger
LSU Fan
Memphis, TN
Member since Feb 2006
4140 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

she didn't open up any factual line of questioning, as Dershowitz says.


She may have when she confirmed the paper statement Issa asked about.






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BlackHelicopterPilot
LSU Fan
Top secret lab
Member since Feb 2004
30659 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

Where'd you come up with that notion?







I cannot claim 5th Rights to protect YOU from incrimination.


If my testimony may tend to incriminate Rex, BHP cannot invoke it even if BHP works for Rex






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Rex
LSU Fan
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Member since Sep 2004
52409 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

I'm glad you can see that Rex because if the POTUS, whethe rit be from my party or yours can use government to attack his politica enemies the way Nixon did; then we are all going to lose the rights we have.

Of course.
quote:

I think we need a special prosecutor and let him/her investigate and then let the chips fall where they may.

These hearings are already having the opposite effect of what Darrell Issa and the GOP hoped for. Even when it has become apparent that Democrats on the committee and elsewhere are not rushing to their defense these witnesses are not implicating the White House. A special prosecutor would be a waste of time and money, but inasmuch as Washington wastes time and money on more trivial matters all the time, sure, why not.






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Rex
LSU Fan
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Member since Sep 2004
52409 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

Just to be clear..he said that YOU dress up AS a dog on a regular basis.

Oops, yes, sorry. Still groggy.

I don't dress up as a dog on regular basis, either.






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Drew Orleans
LSU Fan
Member since Mar 2010
18379 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


I'm sorry... Is a socialist, progressive liberal really talking about,
quote:

a waste of time and money

?

No way I read that correctly...






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Rex
LSU Fan
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
52409 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

I cannot claim 5th Rights to protect YOU from incrimination. If my testimony may tend to incriminate Rex, BHP cannot invoke it even if BHP works for Rex

That's not what Lerner did.






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doubleb
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
4952 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

These hearings are already having the opposite effect of what Darrell Issa and the GOP hoped for. Even when it has become apparent that Democrats on the committee and elsewhere are not rushing to their defense these witnesses are not implicating the White House. A special prosecutor would be a waste of time and money, but inasmuch as Washington wastes time and money on more trivial matters all the time, sure, why not.


In your mind Issa isn't fair and in my mind Holder isn't fair; who do we all trust to find out the truth as to how bad this IRS thing really is?

A special prosecutor, right?

That gets the pols out of it and puts it where it can be investigated by a professional.






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BlackHelicopterPilot
LSU Fan
Top secret lab
Member since Feb 2004
30659 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

That's not what Lerner did.


grrrr....I KNOW!!

The poster I replied to made a comment to the effect that she "took the 5th only to protect the 'bosses'"


THAT is the genesis of my response. That, if she were to do that, she would be incorrect.


ETA:

This is the post I replied to:

quote:

but she might have taken the 5th to protect the Obama administration and not herself.



This post was edited on 5/23 at 9:25 am


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Rex
LSU Fan
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
52409 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

She may have when she confirmed the paper statement Issa asked about.

That's a real stretch. I recall that all Issa asked her to do is confirm that those were her previous items of testimony. She didn't open up any line of factual questioning.

Let a judge sort it out. Just because Issa attempts to recall her will not mean he was correct.






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Rex
LSU Fan
Here, there, and nowhere
Member since Sep 2004
52409 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


Well, I'd love to stay and chat but I have some errands to run, chores to do.






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Drew Orleans
LSU Fan
Member since Mar 2010
18379 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


Red Rocket, eh?





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CajunAngele
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2012
11168 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

Well, I'd love to stay and chat but I have some errands to run, chores to do.



Hey Rex, before you run off, go read towards the bottom of page 7 of this thread and the link below.

LINK






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BBONDS25
LSU Fan
Member since Mar 2008
15372 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

These hearings are already having the opposite effect of what Darrell Issa and the GOP hoped for


You are correct here. Issa and the GOP hoped for the truth. NOt surprising you don't wan't the truth and think Lerner was brilliant in "out-foxing" Issa. Shameful.

Oh....and I chuckled at your solid legal analysis of the situation...There are very good arguments on both sides of this thing...problem is, you didn't mention any of them.






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UncleFestersLegs
Columbia MO
Member since Nov 2010
976 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

Now, this leads me to a separate question: why is it that all you sheep who constantly cry "tyranny!", "my liberty is being violated!", "the Second Amendment!" blah blah blah all of a sudden want to deny Ms. Lerner her Fifth Amendment rights?

The same reason all the leftist bedwetters see no problem with the IRS targeting political opponents or the DOJ declaring war on journalists?

See: petard
Also: hoist






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cwill
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Jan 2005
22827 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


Yay, let's play retributive politics by diminishing the 5th! Yay!





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CptBengal
USA Fan
BR Baby
Member since Dec 2007
35848 posts

re: Lerner lost her rights!


quote:

Yay, let's play retributive politics by diminishing the 5th! Yay!



she waived her rights. That isnt diminishing anything but her and her lawyer's intelligence.






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