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“We overreacted” vs “it worked”

Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:47 pm
Posted by Bjorn Cyborg
Member since Sep 2016
26639 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:47 pm
There seems to be this incorrect thought that there will be some tug-of-war between two factions of people pushing the idea that they were right.

This is wrong.

Flattening the curve should not significantly reduce the amount of infections or deaths, but rather spread them out over time.

So, when this ends it will be obvious who was right.

Posted by CheEngineer
Louisiana
Member since Aug 2019
4234 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:49 pm to
Flattening the curve is the same as telling kids to duck and cover for a nuke it is just a buzz word. Lock downs stop the spread.
Posted by TigerDoc
Texas
Member since Apr 2004
9894 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:51 pm to
quote:

Flattening the curve should not significantly reduce the amount of infections or deaths, but rather spread them out over time.


It should spread out infections and deaths in older and sicker people for whom adequate medical care would not typically save. It should also reduce deaths attributable to lack of access to potentially life-saving supportive medical care. Delaying cases also “buys time” for development of better testing to catch cases sooner or find helpful treatments, which might enlarge the number of survivors in the old/sick cohorts.
This post was edited on 3/28/20 at 9:05 pm
Posted by LSUnation78
Northshore
Member since Aug 2012
12049 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:51 pm to
This is not correct.

Flattening the curve has a specific purpose - slow rate of spread so that number of severe respiratory cases at any given time does not overwhelm the healthcare system's ability to care for them.

# of deaths can vary between the two scenarios, it is not the same # either way.
This post was edited on 3/28/20 at 8:52 pm
Posted by Bjorn Cyborg
Member since Sep 2016
26639 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:52 pm to
Stops the spread until when?

I’m not taking a side. I’m just saying it will be obvious which side was right.
Posted by Jyrdis
TD Premium Member Level III
Member since Aug 2015
12788 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:56 pm to
In this scenario, are we considering the number of people who commit suicide as a result of the economic outcome? Do we consider people who lose everything because of the resulting economic conditions? Do we consider those who just reached retirement only to see a large chunk of their nest egg disappear? Or are we just saying we need to reduce the amount of “runs” on hospitals vs we need to save the economy?
Posted by Bjorn Cyborg
Member since Sep 2016
26639 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 8:56 pm to
Correct. Yes, there would be lives saved by not overwhelming the healthcare system.

But it shouldn’t affect the overall number of infections, and thus the number of serious cases
Posted by elprez00
Hammond, LA
Member since Sep 2011
29361 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:04 pm to
quote:


Flattening the curve is the same as telling kids to duck and cover for a nuke it is just a buzz word. Lock downs stop the spread.

For me it’s simple. New Orleans has a problem. Louisiana does not. Lock down New Orleans. Don’t wreck the entire state just because you don’t have the balls to highlight the inept leadership down there because Racism.
Posted by deuceiswild
South La
Member since Nov 2007
4165 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:04 pm to
The CDC operates in a vacuum. They have limited objectives... to slow the spread, And to find a vaccine. If we acted solely on their recommendations, we'd need to invoke martial law. Obviously no one wants that.

Any reasonable person should be able to see that at some point the cure will indeed be worse than the disease. When will that be? Maybe Easter, maybe not.

It's Trumps job to determine where the two lines will intersect.
Posted by cave canem
pullarius dominus
Member since Oct 2012
12186 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:04 pm to
quote:


But it shouldn’t affect the overall number of infections, and thus the number of serious cases


Depends on what we come up with in the next few months
Posted by CheEngineer
Louisiana
Member since Aug 2019
4234 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:06 pm to
quote:

Stops the spread until when?

I’m not taking a side. I’m just saying it will be obvious which side was right.


Basically you try to contain it let it run its course while you develop treatment (promising) and vaccines (9+months away). You make the public more aware and cautious. There is not much more you can do. My guess is we have the country on lock down for a few more weeks to get a handle on it. I do fully expect more lock downs in communities across the country going forward to help control it.
Posted by CheEngineer
Louisiana
Member since Aug 2019
4234 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:12 pm to
quote:

For me it’s simple. New Orleans has a problem. Louisiana does not. Lock down New Orleans. Don’t wreck the entire state


I agree 100% with this and that is what I expect to see more of in coming months. Things will reopen but as cases spring up there will be more community lock downs
Posted by Flats
Member since Jul 2019
21678 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:32 pm to
We do basically nothing for the flu outside some PSAs. If this doesn’t kill 4-5 times the number a bad flu season kills it’ll be painfully obvious that we overreacted and caused a lot of damage for very little in return.
Posted by gthog61
Irving, TX
Member since Nov 2009
71001 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:43 pm to
$2.2 million dollars per death if there are a million deaths

and that is only fed gov dollars
Posted by crewdepoo
Hogwarts
Member since Jan 2015
9580 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:47 pm to
Our hospitals are already overcrowded so overreacted isn’t an option
Posted by FlexDawg
Member since Jan 2018
12812 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 9:48 pm to
quote:

So, when this ends it will be obvious who was right.


Yes the media causing a panic, raiding of grocery stores, shutting down businesses, people losing jobs, etc definitely isn’t overreacting. It’s all about flattening the curve
Posted by Flats
Member since Jul 2019
21678 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 10:03 pm to
quote:

Our hospitals are already overcrowded so overreacted isn’t an option


“Our”? Like, all of them? A buddy of mine is a doc in Savannah and they furloughed half their support staff because it’s pretty much Kung Flu only and they don’t have enough business.
Posted by Scoob
Near Exxon
Member since Jun 2009
20305 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 10:19 pm to
quote:

If this doesn’t kill 4-5 times the number a bad flu season kills it’ll be painfully obvious that we overreacted and caused a lot of damage for very little in return.


I'd say that if this doesn't have a big death toll, then it could show we DID do the right thing. Meaning, we were able to contain it enough to not have extreme mortality.

Regarding flattening the curve, very simple analogy:
let's say you have 20 people, and can treat 5.

If all 20 get it at once, then... the weakest will show the effects first, and they will take the treatment slots. A couple may be so weak that they will die anyway.

Meanwhile, it then begins to create serious problems for the next 5, who were stronger and fought it off more.
These folks would likely do well with treatment, but since those slots are already filled, they have to do without. And you get a few deaths from that group as a result.

If you can slow the spread, odds are better that there are still slots available for treatment, when people get sick. And you use that time to add more slots, and treat better.

It's not quite that simple, but in the bigger picture that's basically the plan.
Posted by crewdepoo
Hogwarts
Member since Jan 2015
9580 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 10:25 pm to
quote:

Our”? Like, all of them?
New Orleans is. Baton Rouge is getting there
Posted by Kickadawgitfeelsgood
Lafayette LA
Member since Nov 2005
14089 posts
Posted on 3/28/20 at 10:29 pm to
quote:

For me it’s simple. New Orleans has a problem. Louisiana does not. Lock down New Orleans.


Where would you start?

I can’t wait to see this
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