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Started By
Message
'Universal' health care will NEVER work
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:21 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:21 am
Now that ANOTHER insurer has left obamascam, Anthem, it is getting closer to its true intent & design, to fail utterly, cause misery and suffering and have the lemmings clamoring for 'universal' health care.
Universal H/C has never ever worked despite what the left has told us. In countries where there is this alleged UHC, it has been a HUGE HUGE failure.
In all comes down to the basic economic axiom,the law of supply and demand: Unlimited demand for limited resources.
First of all, there are over 324 million people in the US. Many are obese, overweight eating unhealthy diets. Diabetes has reached historic levels.
Half the people in this country do NOT even work or hold down some sort of job.
Of that half who actually work, they pay little or NO federal taxes, in fact many get 'refunds' in the form of EITC or some sort of government handout.
For UHC to even have a 'chance' many tens of millions of people in the US are going to have to have a tax rate of 60-70%, and that is just on the federal level. This does NOT include the state or local levels.
Do you actually think that is going to fly with the American people?
obama-scam is a mess, a huge bureaucratic monster that is destined to get even larger, see this chart:
LINK
Now think about this 'universal' health care system that the left wants to cram down our throats.
Look at the VA, it has over 320,000 employees. And they still can't deliver appropriate health care to our veterans. Many vets with the means do not even bother with the VA. Many, however, do not have that option.
And to think that this would be our system nation wide?
A new UHC would require millions of faceless, and many time USELESS, government employees on the federal payroll welfare trough.
OK sorry if TL
Universal H/C has never ever worked despite what the left has told us. In countries where there is this alleged UHC, it has been a HUGE HUGE failure.
In all comes down to the basic economic axiom,the law of supply and demand: Unlimited demand for limited resources.
First of all, there are over 324 million people in the US. Many are obese, overweight eating unhealthy diets. Diabetes has reached historic levels.
Half the people in this country do NOT even work or hold down some sort of job.
Of that half who actually work, they pay little or NO federal taxes, in fact many get 'refunds' in the form of EITC or some sort of government handout.
For UHC to even have a 'chance' many tens of millions of people in the US are going to have to have a tax rate of 60-70%, and that is just on the federal level. This does NOT include the state or local levels.
Do you actually think that is going to fly with the American people?
obama-scam is a mess, a huge bureaucratic monster that is destined to get even larger, see this chart:
LINK
Now think about this 'universal' health care system that the left wants to cram down our throats.
Look at the VA, it has over 320,000 employees. And they still can't deliver appropriate health care to our veterans. Many vets with the means do not even bother with the VA. Many, however, do not have that option.
And to think that this would be our system nation wide?
A new UHC would require millions of faceless, and many time USELESS, government employees on the federal payroll welfare trough.
OK sorry if TL
23
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:26 am to Reubaltaich
Its only about priorities.
You can do it if you try.
More guns. $54 billion extra for military. You that scared?
You can do it if you try.
More guns. $54 billion extra for military. You that scared?
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:28 am to CelticDog
Oh Otto. You are so silly.
This post was edited on 3/31/17 at 6:28 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:44 am to Reubaltaich
Pandora's box......cannot be closed
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:45 am to Reubaltaich
quote:
Half the people in this country do NOT even work or hold down some sort of job.
What?
quote:
Now that ANOTHER insurer has left obamascam, Anthem, it is getting closer to its true intent & design, to fail utterly, cause misery and suffering and have the lemmings clamoring for 'universal' health care.
And it has worked in many places
quote:
First of all, there are over 324 million people in the US. Many are obese, overweight eating unhealthy diets. Diabetes has reached historic levels.
That BMI metric is complete bull shite. A 6'1 195lb person is considered overweight by that scale.
quote:
Look at the VA, it has over 320,000 employees. And they still can't deliver appropriate health care to our veterans. Many vets with the means do not even bother with the VA. Many, however, do not have that option.
It's never that simple
Posted on 3/31/17 at 6:49 am to Reubaltaich
(no message)
This post was edited on 6/5/20 at 7:54 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 7:04 am to Reubaltaich
quote:
Universal H/C has never ever worked despite what the left has told us. In countries where there is this alleged UHC, it has been a HUGE HUGE failure.
every single first world country, besides the USA, has UHC
and youre suggesting, in every single first world country, their systems are failures?
too much rush limbaugh man -
Posted on 3/31/17 at 7:14 am to The_Duke
quote:
The Duke
You're completely wrong. And I'll break it down piece by piece
1. Politifact is proven to be 100% biased against Trump. Trump has made statements that they have ruled inaccurate, when other people have made the same statement and ruled it as factual. The current unemployment standards are also completely wrong, and they rule out a large number of people that should not be automatically ruled out any more. The politifact break down of that number is heavily biased and inaccurate
2. Most democrats have admitted that obamacare is not working. Anyone who says otherwise is only doing that to try to save face. Forbes is also not a legitimate source for anything other than economics topics
3. BMI is accurate except when you have large amounts of muscle mass. It's proven by most medical boards. And overweight is not the same as obese. Overweight means you are carrying extra weight. That 6'1 195 guy is overweight unless he has an abnormal amount of muscle mass
4. And the VA has been proven by many studies to be ineffective, and most veterans have to use private medicine. Go look up a survey and you'll see it
This post was edited on 3/31/17 at 7:35 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 7:54 am to Upperdecker
quote:
1. Politifact is proven to be 100% biased against Trump. Trump has made statements that they have ruled inaccurate, when other people have made the same statement and ruled it as factual. The current unemployment standards are also completely wrong, and they rule out a large number of people that should not be automatically ruled out any more. The politifact break down of that number is heavily biased and inaccurate
So fake website since they have ruled Trump to be inaccurate. Gotcha. And unemployment metrics are not legit when Obama was president but since Trump is president they are valid and "very real now" according to Spicer.
quote:
2. Most democrats have admitted that obamacare is not working. Anyone who says otherwise is only doing that to try to save face. Forbes is also not a legitimate source for anything other than economics topics
Never said anything about Obamacare not working or working. In fact, never mentioned Obamacare. OP stated that this was always some larger conspiracy to get everyone to want universal healthcare and that universal healthcare has always failed. none of that is true.
quote:
3. BMI is accurate except when you have large amounts of muscle mass. It's proven by most medical boards. And overweight is not the same as obese. Overweight means you are carrying extra weight. That 6'1 195 guy is overweight unless he has an abnormal amount of muscle mass
Well if that's the case then BMI is not accurate. How can you not account for muscle mass? It's a shite set of standards that attempts to lump everyone into a specific bracket. Not taking into account race, age, underlying health conditions, or mental stresses. I know there is a difference between overweight and Obese. Lebron James is listed as 6'8 250 he's borderline obese. When he's 45 yrs old and put on a couple more pounds he'll be considered obese.
quote:
And the VA has been proven by many studies to be ineffective, and most veterans have to use private medicine. Go look up a survey and you'll see it
and the VA is what it is. There is a multitude of underlying problems with the VA and just to say "hey it sucks because of long wait times because it's run by the government" is short sighted. All docs have long wait times--they just don't have the metrics on them to compare.
This post was edited on 3/31/17 at 7:55 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:00 am to The_Duke
quote:
First of all, there are over 324 million people in the US. Many are obese, overweight eating unhealthy diets. Diabetes has reached historic levels.quote
quote That BMI metric is complete bull shite. A 6'1 195lb person is considered overweight by that scale.
I reckon you don't ever shop at WalMart.
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:02 am to The_Duke
quote:
That BMI metric is complete bull shite. A 6'1 195lb person is considered overweight by that scale.
Did you really just defend the obesity epidemic and blame it on BMI measurements?
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:03 am to Reubaltaich
Universal health care works in every other OECD country in the world.
I'm sure we're smart enough to figure it out, so long as the obstructionist Republicans get out of the way.
I'm sure we're smart enough to figure it out, so long as the obstructionist Republicans get out of the way.
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:04 am to RCDfan1950
Lolz he's right. Americans are not grossly overweight due to calorie-rich diets, lack of exercise, and lack of accountability for their own health care.
They're too damned muscular!
They're too damned muscular!
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:08 am to BamaAtl
"Works" is a relative term.
For the vast majority of Americans, a single payer system is going to provide inferior care to what they are already getting at an equal or higher price. This is just the realities of socialism, and you're ignorant if you argue otherwise. This will all be for the (perceived) public good.
For the vast majority of Americans, a single payer system is going to provide inferior care to what they are already getting at an equal or higher price. This is just the realities of socialism, and you're ignorant if you argue otherwise. This will all be for the (perceived) public good.
This post was edited on 3/31/17 at 8:09 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:08 am to Blob Fish
Or Americans are just naturally larger than ppl in other nations. Look at our Athletes compared to others. We live in the land of plenty here in America. Some of the side effects are larger ppl--Vertically and horizontally.
Also, science tells us that different races have different averages for height, weight, and health. So why do we have a one size fits all standard that determines who is obese when it's just natural for a black male to be much larger than a Vietnamese male?
Also, science tells us that different races have different averages for height, weight, and health. So why do we have a one size fits all standard that determines who is obese when it's just natural for a black male to be much larger than a Vietnamese male?
This post was edited on 3/31/17 at 8:22 am
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:12 am to Blob Fish
quote:
For the vast majority of Americans, a single payer system is going to provide inferior care to what they are already getting at an equal or higher price.
This is untrue and shows a profound lack of understanding about health care.
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:17 am to Reubaltaich
Solid assessment, R. The 'elephant in the room' re Universal Care.
That said - and given that access to health care for the poor has become a political axiom in the debate - the 'fix' is going to be a Government supported System of small, local clinics (I go to one, it's good) for the poor...and a larger private Market where folks that can pay for superior treatment.
The VA is a perfect example wherein even the most untalented politician can point out the kinds of CORRUPTION and utter INCOMPETENCE that can NOT be tolerated in a Government System. And ride it to victory. Who would argue against clearly defined (as a pre-requisite for employment)and mandatory high standards for employees in a System that they are likely to use. Answer...nobody. This is a piece of cake when the people hear it.
My Doctor at that small clinic told me that they get paid according to their SUCCESS in managing patients. I asked him if that meant he got more money if I lost my extra pounds...and he said yes, in a sense. He is active in State Politics re Healthcare, at a high level. He is a good and smart guy. I trust him.
Guidelines and mandatory standards and expectations of maintaining those standards by those who are employed is the key. Not rocket science. The practice of hiring healthcare individuals as a matter of political/cultural engineering has got to go. Won't be easy, and the SJW Dems will scream, but a high profile and honest argument can win the battle.
That said - and given that access to health care for the poor has become a political axiom in the debate - the 'fix' is going to be a Government supported System of small, local clinics (I go to one, it's good) for the poor...and a larger private Market where folks that can pay for superior treatment.
The VA is a perfect example wherein even the most untalented politician can point out the kinds of CORRUPTION and utter INCOMPETENCE that can NOT be tolerated in a Government System. And ride it to victory. Who would argue against clearly defined (as a pre-requisite for employment)and mandatory high standards for employees in a System that they are likely to use. Answer...nobody. This is a piece of cake when the people hear it.
My Doctor at that small clinic told me that they get paid according to their SUCCESS in managing patients. I asked him if that meant he got more money if I lost my extra pounds...and he said yes, in a sense. He is active in State Politics re Healthcare, at a high level. He is a good and smart guy. I trust him.
Guidelines and mandatory standards and expectations of maintaining those standards by those who are employed is the key. Not rocket science. The practice of hiring healthcare individuals as a matter of political/cultural engineering has got to go. Won't be easy, and the SJW Dems will scream, but a high profile and honest argument can win the battle.
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:21 am to BamaAtl
Oh, really? I provide health care for all you kind people.
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:21 am to Blob Fish
quote:
"Works" is a relative term.
For the vast majority of Americans, a single payer system is going to provide inferior care to what they are already getting at an equal or higher price. This is just the realities of socialism, and you're ignorant if you argue otherwise. This will all be for the (perceived) public good.
Your cost statement is simply untrue. We spend more for healthcare per capita than any other country in the world, in some cases, more than double. And our outcomes are worse than most developed countries (realize that is driven by lifestyle factors and not only quality of care)
Posted on 3/31/17 at 8:24 am to dpd901
And you think government rationing of care is going to be more cost-effective?
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