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re: Libertarian presidential candidate Jo Jorgensen's platform is VERY appealing.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:13 pm to GEAUXmedic
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:13 pm to GEAUXmedic
People still think Libertarianism is a thing?
0
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:14 pm to Tiguar
I’ll even go a step further and say the government is the only god damn thing in their way right now.
They would fire white people and hire brown people openly and blatantly if discrimination laws didn’t exist.
They would fire white people and hire brown people openly and blatantly if discrimination laws didn’t exist.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:16 pm to Tiguar
They'll call white people the oppressive majority until the last white person is dead.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:16 pm to GEAUXmedic
Yeah, no.
Ending deficit spending simply means more taxes to democrats, and many republicans.
Bringing home the troops. Okay, but is it done intelligently, or are we just creating a power vacuum for the Russians, Chinese, Iranians, Germans, or Saudis to step into? Do you understand the ramifications of that?
Eliminate trade barriers and tariffs. Right, unilaterally dropping all protections for US producers, farmers, and manufacturers will certainly cause the rest of the world to do the same, right? Right?
Reform immigration. Is that before or after you stop hundreds of thousands from simply walking across our border? Is that before or after you remove the hundreds of thousands abusing their visa privileges? Is that before or after you end childbirth tourism, birthright citizenship, and tax remittances at 50%?
End the drug war. Go ahead, but at the same time, let’s end the bilking of taxpayers to support and enable irresponsible drug addicts. Make it easier to take abused kids from addicted parents, and force deadbeat parents to financially support their offspring, whether they have custody or not, and whether they are gainfully employed or not.
Sure, reduce government, but not by making Americans less safe and secure. Reduce the bureaucracy by 40% before you start cutting the military.
Eliminate victimless crime. Sure. Just know that drug use and addiction are almost never victimless crimes.
Ending deficit spending simply means more taxes to democrats, and many republicans.
Bringing home the troops. Okay, but is it done intelligently, or are we just creating a power vacuum for the Russians, Chinese, Iranians, Germans, or Saudis to step into? Do you understand the ramifications of that?
Eliminate trade barriers and tariffs. Right, unilaterally dropping all protections for US producers, farmers, and manufacturers will certainly cause the rest of the world to do the same, right? Right?
Reform immigration. Is that before or after you stop hundreds of thousands from simply walking across our border? Is that before or after you remove the hundreds of thousands abusing their visa privileges? Is that before or after you end childbirth tourism, birthright citizenship, and tax remittances at 50%?
End the drug war. Go ahead, but at the same time, let’s end the bilking of taxpayers to support and enable irresponsible drug addicts. Make it easier to take abused kids from addicted parents, and force deadbeat parents to financially support their offspring, whether they have custody or not, and whether they are gainfully employed or not.
Sure, reduce government, but not by making Americans less safe and secure. Reduce the bureaucracy by 40% before you start cutting the military.
Eliminate victimless crime. Sure. Just know that drug use and addiction are almost never victimless crimes.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:17 pm to Smokeyone
quote:
The problem with libertarians is they don’t have a party
It's hard to find cohesion in a bunch of individualists.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:17 pm to GEAUXmedic
Another nut.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:17 pm to Tiguar
Those social media companies wield their influence and dominate all potential competitors because of protections given them by government.
Big corporations that endorse cancel culture all use big government to destroy their competitors.
Government creates oligarchies through contracts, regulations, and licensing requirements. Oligarchies have the power to dictate society through their ability to collude rather than compete. Libertarianism eliminates government contracts, regulations, and licensing requirements opening up markets controlled by oligarchies to greater competition. With more competition in the market, “woke” corporate culture won’t be able to have such a strong influence as market share is diminished. Consumers will have more non “woke” firms to do business with as well.
Big corporations that endorse cancel culture all use big government to destroy their competitors.
Government creates oligarchies through contracts, regulations, and licensing requirements. Oligarchies have the power to dictate society through their ability to collude rather than compete. Libertarianism eliminates government contracts, regulations, and licensing requirements opening up markets controlled by oligarchies to greater competition. With more competition in the market, “woke” corporate culture won’t be able to have such a strong influence as market share is diminished. Consumers will have more non “woke” firms to do business with as well.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:18 pm to G The Tiger Fan
quote:
eliminate trade barriers & tariffs
So we get to go back to other countries fricking us in trade deals again?
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:20 pm to kingbob
The country was originally libertarian.
There were no alphabet agencies and no central banks. There were no licensing agencies. There was nothing.
That society slowly eroded to what we have now. Unless you are hard right, you slowly become left. That is the reality of the situation.
“And one day, for no reason at all....”
There were no alphabet agencies and no central banks. There were no licensing agencies. There was nothing.
That society slowly eroded to what we have now. Unless you are hard right, you slowly become left. That is the reality of the situation.
“And one day, for no reason at all....”
This post was edited on 7/4/20 at 10:21 pm
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:20 pm to kingbob
Her platform is SUPPOSED to appeal to you (whichever side you’re on). Unfortunately I’m afraid it is intended to have the same effect Ross Perot’s candidacy did. Really the same effect (affect?) any third party candidate’s run does. To siphon votes away from the conservative (ok more conservative) candidate.
RP’s got Slick Willie elected. Let’s pray Dr. Jorgensen’s doesn’t have the same result.
RP’s got Slick Willie elected. Let’s pray Dr. Jorgensen’s doesn’t have the same result.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:21 pm to kingbob
quote:
Without a welfare state, wages are based entirely on labor supply and demand. People migrate purely based on economic prospects. As wages go down, the incentive to immigrate to the United States declines as well, resulting in fewer immigrants. If wages decline too much, people will emigrate elsewhere. Otherwise, you are just creating disparities which result in an illicit jobs and immigration market.
The problem with that (and many libertarian ideals) is that it ignores the bigger picture—in this case the fact that with border and trade barriers in place, the US is more of a closed system. We open everything up and we are a wide open system, and when water seeks it's own level like you described our system has no where to go but down, because we're already so far above so many of the systems that people would immigrate from.
In other words, working for $6 an hour is o.k. with people from Guatemala. They'll pile 12 people in a 2 bedroom apartment, split expenses, and send that $6 an hour back to G-Town and STILL have a higher standard of living than they would back there. Not so for Americans. When the labor market gets flooded here—and it wouldn't just be low-wage earners if we had completely open borders; you'd have skilled laborers and professionals coming over if that happened—our wages have no place to go but down. Economic disaster.
Not to mention the even bigger disaster it would be if we maintained the welfare state with open borders, and I don't see a viable way to get rid of it, for a couple of reasons.
Libertarianism sounds great philosophically. I was a card carrying member in my 20s and into my 30s, but eventually I figured out that many of the planks in the platform simply wouldn't work if we tried them in the real world.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:22 pm to Tiguar
quote:
Libertarianism is what brought us to this point.
A vote for the UniParty® is a vote for the left and right wing of the CIA.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:23 pm to Toomer Deplorable
Cute, you think I’m talking about parties and not ideologies
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:23 pm to Tiguar
quote:I've definitely noticed this. This seems even more true with social media. People who don't usually comment on politics but want to say something about a current event will usually start spewing leftist talking points in order to virtue signal to their friends and family.
Unless you are hard right, you slowly become left. That is the reality of the situation.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:27 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
Open borders is the biggest
That’s the reason people say that Libertarianism is idealistic and unworkable for country’s political platform? I mean I’m not sure I agree we should have unrestricted immigration but our country essentially did for much of its history, that’s how we became a melting pot in the first place. That doesn’t really seem like a good reason that libertarianism is unworkable, is that really the reason or is that just why you personally are against it?
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:27 pm to Tiguar
Up until the end of the guilded age, there were no regulatory agencies and no regulations at all. There were no licenses, so anyone could work any job so long as someone would pay them to do it. There were no building permits or zoning laws. If you owned the land, you could build whatever you wanted. There were no hunting or fishing licenses so you could harvest what you wanted as long as you owned the land or had permission from the landowner or were on government land/water. There were no age requirements to buy products, so if you had the coin, you could buy whatever you wanted. There was very little immigration restrictions. Unless you were blatantly contagiously sick, you were allowed in. If you were, you were put in quarantine until you weren’t, then allowed in. This libertarianism allowed America to double in population every 20 years and go from a colonial backwater to the largest economy on earth in 100 years, with a huge amount of that growth coming just between 1877 and 1907.
This post was edited on 7/4/20 at 10:29 pm
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:28 pm to DavidTheGnome
quote:
our country essentially did for much of its history
Absolutely not.
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:28 pm to DavidTheGnome
I love how you bring up the fact we’ve had basically unfettered immigration and think that means it works with libertarianism.
Why don’t you think really hard about where we are now as a country and then rethink your assertion?
Why don’t you think really hard about where we are now as a country and then rethink your assertion?
Posted on 7/4/20 at 10:31 pm to kingbob
Yeah, and then people slowly started wanting more government interference.
You seem to be misunderstanding me. I’m not saying libertarianism as a concept isn’t great, I’m saying it eventually cedes itself to stronger government ideologies simply because most people who are “libertarian” are individualists who want to be left alone. Literally the frog in the pot.
You seem to be misunderstanding me. I’m not saying libertarianism as a concept isn’t great, I’m saying it eventually cedes itself to stronger government ideologies simply because most people who are “libertarian” are individualists who want to be left alone. Literally the frog in the pot.
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