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re: DOJ & IRS going after users of Cryptocurrency. They want their "fair share"!

Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:00 am to
Posted by wutangfinancial
Treasure Valley
Member since Sep 2015
11068 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:00 am to
quote:

we can always create artificial events to justify taxation


They did this a few years ago with tax sheltered accounts forcing liquidation after transferring the assets to your spouse at death
Posted by CelticDog
Member since Apr 2015
42867 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:01 am to
quote:

Those who transact with cryptocurrency must meet their tax obligations like any other taxpayer.”



you got a problem with expecting drug dealers and pot growers to pay taxes?
Posted by Ross
Member since Oct 2007
47824 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:04 am to
quote:

Sucked into another crypto thread



The subject matter is addicting to me.

Apparently you as well
Posted by TS1926
Alabama
Member since Jan 2020
5735 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:05 am to
quote:

Bidens America... people "wanted" him, and get what they asked for. Lots of young people love them some crypto


Yeah I posted this link on the cryptocurrency forum I frequent for the idiot Trump haters there. They are silent. I wonder why?
Posted by jclem11
Neoliberal Shill
Member since Nov 2011
7758 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:06 am to
quote:

They did this a few years ago with tax sheltered accounts forcing liquidation after transferring the assets to your spouse at death


Yea. This rule is retarded and purely meant to expediate revenue collection.

We have clients that have these every year and they don't need or want to take out the money but are forced to.

Roth conversions seem like the most prudent path forward as rates are only going up.
This post was edited on 5/8/21 at 9:40 am
Posted by SlowFlowPro
Simple Solutions to Complex Probs
Member since Jan 2004
421355 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:08 am to
quote:

You don’t agree

it's not that i don't agree as much as i'm saying it's really not as different as fiats in terms of manipulation at this point, and there is a lot fewer reasons to trust cryptos over solid fiat currencies

i think an issue you have is thinking i'm celebrating fiats when i'm not. i'm much more saying cryptos have been somewhat ruined longterm

it's an amazing tech with lots of potential that became way too popular and commoditized too early and it destroyed the ultimate potential of the tech. that's a common theme with tech that's beyond what society is ready for, especially if some aspect of the potential of the tech can be sold as a commodity
Posted by SlowFlowPro
Simple Solutions to Complex Probs
Member since Jan 2004
421355 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:09 am to
quote:

Are we only going to tax labor and wages then?

i mean that sounds wonderful

but it's a different set of transactions if you're taking money that's already been through the tax grinder and investing and money earned from labor, as you never had that money before.

quote:

We ain't going back to small, limited central government of the founding.

it doesn't really matter at this point because we're well past the point of no return and we're fricked
Posted by JLivermore
Wendover
Member since Dec 2015
1415 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 9:52 am to
I'm always curious, to what extent have rogue countries etc been able to bypass economic sanctions by using crypto? Has it been a major effective way to bypass, or has the success been embellished? I don't love sanctions, but I prefer them to be effective so that more extreme methods, like invasions and nukes, don't have to be used instead.

I'm not so bullish that this global decentralization from America trend = peace and prosperity. In fact I think it'll be the exact opposite for most, especially Americans. War, poverty, and more instability for people and countries that aren't used to it. But it looks like it's rolling in that direction even faster now, and instead of fearing it, we'll be cheering it on via crypto price appreciation.


Posted by Hayekian serf
GA
Member since Dec 2020
2498 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 10:59 am to
quote:

anything you have of any value belongs to the government and they will always find a way to confiscate it


We will make another one.
Then another one
Then another one

Posted by Penrod
Member since Jan 2011
39094 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 11:00 am to
quote:

Want people to get ahead? Stop taking their money.

This is an argument against all federal taxes, not just capital gains. I think income taxes should be much lower, including capital gains, but to completely eliminate the federal income tax, with nothing to take its place is a radical and foolish idea. We would be speaking Chinese five years later.
Posted by jmarto1
Houma, LA/ Las Vegas, NV
Member since Mar 2008
33848 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 11:01 am to
That is a major driving force of Biden wanting to raise capital gains. They know we made a lot of money and they need to keep us under their heel
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
67635 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 11:04 am to
quote:

Cryptocurrency, as generally defined, is a digital representation of value.


Exactly, it is a substitute for a chicken or a bushel of corn.

The government is deathly of a barter economy because it can't be taxed.

Crypto just makes the barter economy easier.
Posted by wutangfinancial
Treasure Valley
Member since Sep 2015
11068 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 11:30 am to
quote:

I'm not so bullish that this global decentralization from America trend = peace and prosperity. In fact I think it'll be the exact opposite for most, especially Americans. War, poverty, and more instability for people and countries that aren't used to it. But it looks like it's rolling in that direction even faster now, and instead of fearing it, we'll be cheering it on via crypto price appreciation.


So this is the part of the crypto story that I'm extremely interested in. You should go listen to Mike Green on this subject. He's in the camp that all the bad actors are the ultimate benefactors of crypto and a new monetary system has only come to fruition via hot war and the de-dollarization will lead to a highly volatile world. Typically the bulls have accepted that the US government is just as bad of an actor as the CCP, Russians, Iranians etc...
This post was edited on 5/8/21 at 11:31 am
Posted by Konkey Dong
Member since Aug 2013
2163 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 12:00 pm to
Run it through tornado cash, deposit to coinbase, cash out to your wallet, claim long term capital gains
Posted by southdowns84
Member since Dec 2009
1449 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 2:43 pm to
quote:


It isn’t something they can stop.

If they start cracking down on our ability to use exchanges, just use a decentralized exchange like Uniswap that can’t be targeted.

They can’t stop this thing.


You gonna deposit all the cash you make into a decentralized exchange like Uniswap?
Posted by BarberitosDawg
Lee County Florida across causeway
Member since Oct 2013
9914 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 2:45 pm to
This is why I will never invest one % of a cent in that shite.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
259875 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 2:48 pm to
quote:

This is an argument against all federal taxes


They all suck.

But taxing people on crypto is ridiculous. The government does not need more money. They need to spend less money.

The government wants to control crypto. frick em. Not everything needs to be taxed and overly regulated.
This post was edited on 5/8/21 at 2:49 pm
Posted by BarberitosDawg
Lee County Florida across causeway
Member since Oct 2013
9914 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 2:51 pm to
If you are going to start one base it in Canada that’s the only country in the world that won’t comply with Obama’s directive to allow the USA to search and seize your shite.
Posted by Ross
Member since Oct 2007
47824 posts
Posted on 5/8/21 at 7:02 pm to
quote:

i think an issue you have is thinking i'm celebrating fiats when i'm not. i'm much more saying cryptos have been somewhat ruined longterm


I don’t think you are celebrating fiats. I think we share a lot of the same concerns about fiat but we definitely diverge on cryptos because I think the idea that the technology has been compromised by speculators or that it has similar problems to fiat to be mostly nonsense. I couldn’t even hasten a guess what the M2 money supply is going to look like in 20 years. I can tell you exactly how much Bitcoin has been mined and will be mined at any point in the future. I can also rest easy knowing this number or Bitcoin in circulation is capped so I don’t risk debasement via inflation. Additionally, I can tell you exactly how much custodians hold, thanks to the transparency of the blockchain. In my opinion, this system fosters more trust than fiat could ever dream of.

What you are being overly critical of is the short term role of speculation during this price discovery phase of this young asset. Sure, there are long and short liquidations regularly right now and whales can move markets by taking advantage of fools buying on margin, but volatility is decreasing with time and I’m comfortable saying we are simply on the tail end of hypermonetization and price discovery due to accelerating adoption.

All of the variables that dictate asset price will eventually converge down to two: Metcalfe’s Law and value of the underlying fiat currency. The rest of the price fluctuations are just temporary noise created by speculators that lose more and more of their influence as adoption increases and their share of the market grows smaller and as those entering in the market don’t succumb to their whalish games because we believe this technology is the answer to a lot of terrible monetary policy.
This post was edited on 5/8/21 at 11:54 pm
Posted by Syntax
FL390
Member since Aug 2020
964 posts
Posted on 5/9/21 at 8:36 am to
quote:



but if this happens, the bigger issue with crypto is going to be the completely unstable electrical and telecom industries

i'm discussing normal, every day life similar today. the government is REALLY good at making you declare wealth, especially if you plan on spending it. they've been fine tuning this via the WOD for 40 years now.


And this here exactly is where the governments of the world, except China, will control crypto. Power and telecom limits will hamstring the entire ecosystem and it will happen when it becomes a great to the world monetary markets. And it should. It's a BS fad that's got some minimal value but should never ever replace common currency.
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