- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Do You Believe in Absolute Morality?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:17 am to beerJeep
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:17 am to beerJeep
quote:
Absolutely. But I’m talking more Katrina type survival stealing. Like, breaking into an abandoned store to steal food. Not stealing food out of another’s mouth.
Even here, I can apply my same standard.
I'll give you an anecdote. I used to be a grocery manager at a major supermarket back in the late 80s. Catching people stealing was common. Frankly, most of the time, they were stealing stupid shite. But occasionally, that wasn't the case.
I once noticed a couple come in to our store. It was mild outside, but both had long coats on and looked a shade disheveled. I kinda lost em because I was busy, but, I ended up catching the male as he put something under his coat.
As the couple attempted to leave, we stopped them. They didn't put up any real argument and, honestly, just seemed humiliated.
When they took out what they'd stolen, it was all baby shite. Diapers ripped from a carton and shoved in their jackets. Many jars of baby food. Formula and other similar stuff.
I knew I was wrong(from the company perspective) when I did it, but I paid for their shite that day and then, I asked them to please never come to my store again. Took their photos and told them it would be in our front office.
So, even in Katrina type stealing............it may not always be possible as a 3rd party to know the necessary details.............but, there's still right and wrong. The applicability of "what would I hope for in terms of treatment of me" still applies.
0
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:36 am to Perfect Circle
quote:
Wrong" doesn't change to "right" just because of the circumstance.
Then you may as well jump into the oblivion of moral relativism if you need to constantly do "wrong" things daily to survive.
This post was edited on 11/13/18 at 11:38 am
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:36 am to Perfect Circle
quote:
So, there is no "right and "wrong"?
There is no objective "right and wrong." Correct.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:39 am to Ebbandflow
read it again, salty Sally. OP said murder was wrong, not killing.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:41 am to TigerCoon
quote:
OP said murder was wrong, not killing.
In the eyes of the killer, he never murders.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 11:45 am to NYNolaguy1
Huh? What?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:07 pm to Perfect Circle
quote:
The knowledge of right and wrong is part of our being. How did it get there? What is its source?
Natural selection. It's not objective though and morality depends on culture and context.
Morality is only a thing when resources are abundant.
This post was edited on 11/13/18 at 12:10 pm
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:10 pm to Rex
quote:
, no.
Morality is a notion, a mental construct that doesn't exist outside of sentient beings.
You sure do engage in a lot of condemnation for such an amoral person.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:13 pm to bmy
quote:Sure, because it's cool to steal, rape, and murder when resources are scarce.
Morality is only a thing when resources are abundant.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:15 pm to Rex
Well, well. Look who's back.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:26 pm to bmy
quote:
Natural selection.
So a mindless, method less "process" is the source of our morality? Kind of hard for me to get on board with that. Also can't see our sense of "right and wrong" as being the product of thousands of years of behavioral consequences.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:42 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Sure, because it's cool to steal, rape, and murder when resources are scarce
You're misinterpreting what he said.
He's saying that our innate sense of morality, imbued to us via natural selection, loses it's grip when resources are scarce.
Hypothetical example:
I see myself as a very moral person; I've never stolen a thing in my life, and have no desire to do so.
Yet if I was in a post-apocalyptic scenario and my family were starving, I wouldn't think twice about stealing to save them.
E.G., my supposed strong sense of, and adherence to, morality that exists when resources are abundant disappears when they aren't. This also makes sense within the framework of natural selection, if you think about it.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:45 pm to Perfect Circle
quote:
So a mindless, method less "process" is the source of our morality?
Yes.
quote:
Also can't see our sense of "right and wrong" as being the product of thousands of years of behavioral consequences.
Why? It makes perfect sense that, in our history as a tribal species, bands of humans that were more altruistic and adhered to a "I scratch your back, you scratch mine" mentality would have a better chance of survival and, thus, a better chance to pass on their genes. How is this hard to comprehend?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:48 pm to HeyHeyHogsAllTheWay
gee, you dont see lying as a problem? especially when you r the so called leader of the free world? seem hypocritical to you?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:50 pm to Perfect Circle
quote:
everyone agrees certain actions are "right" and certain actions are "wrong."
Unfortunately this isn't the case. God said 'thou shalt not murder.' Communist atheists said 'thou shalt not murder, except for political convenience.' National socialists said '...except for Jews.'. Muslims said '... except for infidels'.
That's just for murder. When you set aside Biblical morality and take a long and broad view of history, you'll find precious little agreement on what is right and wrong on a wide variety of subjects from slavery to cannibalism and on.
Heck, 30% of our own citizens can't even properly define what constitutes a man and a woman.
Posted on 11/13/18 at 12:54 pm to Perfect Circle
With morality comes accountability. One absent of the other begets chaos.
Some ponder the thought of a government free land with a peaceful prosperous society and our current state of affairs shows the fallacy of the idea. Our DNA is programmed to overcome. No matter how many givers there are, they will always be outnumbered by takers. Compromise never truly exists.
My instincts are telling me something is not right with the way our current state of affairs are playing out. Overlooking the obvious, I believe things are not what they seem. I believe the Nations social behavior is being tested for something much larger than America. The idea of globalist control and One world rule is not as ludicrous as most believe and I think we are witnessing the final stages play out in front of our eyes.
Currently every large nation has some form of civil unrest and foreign economies can be as unstable as the wind. Plays have been happing all around the world in some shape or for testing the social tolerance of unmoral accountability of the populace of nations. I believe testing/affecting The United States of America is the final test/goal. The nation is divided not just on several main issues but anything deemed different is forbidden. The unlimited possibilities of division coupled with progressive ideology are foolish alone but together represents imperfection is eminent and fool and his thoughts are a threat to humanity
Complacency and ignorance “Oh Gracious Tempest, immortal is thy grasp”!
Some ponder the thought of a government free land with a peaceful prosperous society and our current state of affairs shows the fallacy of the idea. Our DNA is programmed to overcome. No matter how many givers there are, they will always be outnumbered by takers. Compromise never truly exists.
My instincts are telling me something is not right with the way our current state of affairs are playing out. Overlooking the obvious, I believe things are not what they seem. I believe the Nations social behavior is being tested for something much larger than America. The idea of globalist control and One world rule is not as ludicrous as most believe and I think we are witnessing the final stages play out in front of our eyes.
Currently every large nation has some form of civil unrest and foreign economies can be as unstable as the wind. Plays have been happing all around the world in some shape or for testing the social tolerance of unmoral accountability of the populace of nations. I believe testing/affecting The United States of America is the final test/goal. The nation is divided not just on several main issues but anything deemed different is forbidden. The unlimited possibilities of division coupled with progressive ideology are foolish alone but together represents imperfection is eminent and fool and his thoughts are a threat to humanity
Complacency and ignorance “Oh Gracious Tempest, immortal is thy grasp”!
Posted on 11/13/18 at 1:01 pm to Boatshoes
This discussion reminds me of a classroom incident in college.
The topic was situational ethics. The prof gave this scenario:
"You go into a store and at checkout you owe $15. You give the cashier a $20. Instead of giving you a $5 bill in change she mistakenly gives you a $10 and moves to the next customer.
Do you a) correct her mistake
b) keep the 10?
Raise your hands if you just keep the $10?"
Half of the hands went up to keep the 10. The other half stayed down. The two groups eyed each other with surprise.
Hands up: "Why would you give the money back? The store has lots of money."
Hands down: 'It's theft.'
It was then I realized that people in the same culture, environment and educational level still possess widely different amounts of honesty. From that day on every time I heard the cliche 'Ah, everybody does it'. I say 'Nope. Some do it and some do not.'
The topic was situational ethics. The prof gave this scenario:
"You go into a store and at checkout you owe $15. You give the cashier a $20. Instead of giving you a $5 bill in change she mistakenly gives you a $10 and moves to the next customer.
Do you a) correct her mistake
b) keep the 10?
Raise your hands if you just keep the $10?"
Half of the hands went up to keep the 10. The other half stayed down. The two groups eyed each other with surprise.
Hands up: "Why would you give the money back? The store has lots of money."
Hands down: 'It's theft.'
It was then I realized that people in the same culture, environment and educational level still possess widely different amounts of honesty. From that day on every time I heard the cliche 'Ah, everybody does it'. I say 'Nope. Some do it and some do not.'
Posted on 11/13/18 at 1:11 pm to Strophie
quote:
He's saying that our innate sense of morality,
imbued to us via natural selection, loses its grip when resources are scare.
So morals become more subjective depending on the deterioration of the situation, and improves as the situation becomes better?
Like murder and robbery are justified in certain circumstances? But if those circumstances change, it's not?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 1:24 pm to The Great McGinty
quote:
Our DNA is programmed to overcome.
So, our sense of morality is, in part, genetic? Not sure I don't disagree. Who did the programming?
Posted on 11/13/18 at 1:28 pm to Perfect Circle
quote:
Murder is wrong.
You must define it. Lots of legal killings have happened throughout history.
quote:
Stealing is wrong.
You must define it. For instance, taxes are stealing to some people, but yet perfectly legal.
quote:
Lying and deceit are wrong.
Hypothetical: Is lying to your child about their terminal illness wrong?
Page 5 of 8
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News