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Kino74
LSU Fan
Denham springs
Member since Nov 2013
3606 posts

ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
I dont knowing this has been covered here yet but if not, let's talk about it.

The current ATF ruling is the lower receiver is the "gun" and requires an FFL to buy from. This ruling is being challenged which may or may not be good for gunowners.

ABC - AR15 reciever
quote:

But some defense attorneys have recently argued that the part alone does not meet the definition in the law. Federal law enforcement officials, who have long been concerned about the discrepancy, are increasingly worried that it could hinder some criminal prosecutions and undermine firearms regulations nationwide.


quote:

Federal regulations define a firearm's “frame" or "receiver” as the piece considered to be the gun itself. But in an AR-15, the receiver is split into upper and lower parts — and some of the components listed in the definition are contained in the upper half. That has led judges to rule that a lower receiver alone cannot be considered a gun.


This article had a lengthy report in it and is worth reading. My concern and while I'm cautious to fairly suspicious is if the lower reciever can not be the "gun" then what would the ATF then make a ruling as to what is one? Would they make both receivers have to be serialized and treated as a firearm? That is perhaps my biggest concern as that would really put a hurting in gunowners swapping different uppers out like we do now.

For instance you might have a 5.56 upper and want to swap it out for a 6.5 grendel upper. Would we be faced with buying that upper as a firearm? Would we have to have matching upper serial numbers so have a buy a set as a gun?

One thing is for sure a change will be coming and the ATF isn't known for making life easier on gunowners. In my lifetime I can think of only 1 thing they have done that is relaxing the requirement to have a CLEO approve of a NFA transaction. Everything else has been from harsh to downright stupid.

Your thoughts?



YF12
Alabama Fan
Ottobaan
Member since Nov 2019
1154 posts
 Online 

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
ATF is a disgrace and what they say today is totally fine can be a 20 year prison sentence tomorrow

An absolute piece of shite example of everything that is wrong with government

Dont worry. Next Dem president will just make lowers machine guns and you are out of luck, cant register them now sorry!


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290
upgrayedd
Lamar Fan
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
101482 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
The ATF will not stop until all guns are outlawed.

They purposely slow roll NFA items because they want to restrict legal access as much as possible.


Wtodd
Missouri Fan
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
49737 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
I think they'll clarify the law and keep the lower as "the gun"


upgrayedd
Lamar Fan
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
101482 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
I keep waiting to get the notice that all arm braces will be illegal and punishable by 20 years in jail


Philippines4LSU
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since May 2018
8725 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
Hopefully SCOTUS will do its job if the ATF attempts to infringe.


TigerFanInSouthland
LSU Fan
Louisiana
Member since Aug 2012
25495 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

Federal law enforcement officials, who have long been concerned about the discrepancy, are increasingly worried that it could hinder some criminal prosecutions and undermine firearms regulations nationwide.


When the jack booted thugs are worried about something undermining their unconstitutional power, an angel gets its wings.


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60
YF12
Alabama Fan
Ottobaan
Member since Nov 2019
1154 posts
 Online 

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

Hopefully SCOTUS will do its job if the ATF attempts to infringe.


Its coming up on 12 years since the common use language of Heller and the Supreme Court has done absolutely nothing to protect the most common rifle in the United States

They are absolutely DC bubble pieces of shite on this topic

Good luck with that


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70
Damone
Colorado State Fan
FoCo
Member since Aug 2016
19271 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
I'm just glad the controversy didn't start due to some a-hole busybody writing a letter to the ATF asking them a question.


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70
Damone
Colorado State Fan
FoCo
Member since Aug 2016
19271 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

I keep waiting to get the notice that all arm braces will be illegal and punishable by 20 years in jail

I have a few pistol lowers gathering dust on the off chance that they get declared illegal.


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YF12
Alabama Fan
Ottobaan
Member since Nov 2019
1154 posts
 Online 

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

I have a few pistol lowers gathering dust on the off chance that they get declared illegal.


Everyone should at least have a box of poverty ponies stashed away somewhere


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30
Wtodd
Missouri Fan
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
49737 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

I have a few pistol lowers gathering dust on the off chance that they get declared illegal.

You've been fortunate enough to never have had a boat accident


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70
TideCPA
Alabama Fan
Member since Jan 2012
3637 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms should be a convenience store, not a government agency.


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130
troyt37
Arkansas Fan
Member since Mar 2008
6777 posts
 Online 

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

Your thoughts?


I think in a country that holds the phrase "the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed" as the supreme law of the land, the ATF exists as an unconstitutional agency, and should be abolished, along with any and all regulations and/or laws which have been created by it, or any other branch of government.


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30
Kino74
LSU Fan
Denham springs
Member since Nov 2013
3606 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

I think they'll clarify the law and keep the lower as "the gun"


That's probably our best hope but as we all know the ATF truly acts like they are all 3 branches of government with a supreme mandate rolled up in 1 agency.

I've said this before we need SCOTUS to start hearing cases. All we have right now is Heller saying we have a right but gun control advocates has pushed every restriction without consequence. We need scrutiny cause if we don't we will be down to owning single and double barreled long arms and pistols that hold 1 or 2 rounds. None of that is suitable for self defense let alone anything necessary to a free state.


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10
Kino74
LSU Fan
Denham springs
Member since Nov 2013
3606 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

I keep waiting to get the notice that all arm braces will be illegal and punishable by 20 years in jail


No kidding. Yall remember the old Zastava M91? ATF allowed importation of these rifles yet later ruled them illegal as they had a 3rd axis hole at 1 point and that's a no no for the ATF. Owners had to either surrender them or have them demilled into parts kits. That's why you may still see Yugo "dragunov" style parts kits in 8mm mauser for sale.

Those of us with "pistols" should be wary. The ATF came down on 5.45 steel core ammo after ak pistols in 5.45 started becoming popular. Cheap 5.45 military surplus went bye bye. Today I'm worried that braces will go the way of NFA regulations. The ATF wants the $200 but at same time doesn't want to process the transaction.


C
Atlanta Falcons Fan
Houston
Member since Dec 2007
25874 posts
 Online 

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
ATF is the first organization I get rid of to reduce the budget. The most corrupt organization there is.


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Big4SALTbro
Member since Jun 2019
1859 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
I’m sure they are itching to murder some citizens over again, it’s been about 25 years since they spilt some blood


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upgrayedd
Lamar Fan
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
101482 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
quote:

Those of us with "pistols" should be wary. The ATF came down on 5.45 steel core ammo after ak pistols in 5.45 started becoming popular. Cheap 5.45 military surplus went bye bye

Why did they do that? I remember hearing something about 5.45 getting scarce but never knew why.


CaptSpaulding
Alabama Fan
Member since Feb 2012
2921 posts

re: ATF and AR15 lower receiver controversy
ATF should be the name of a convenience store, not a government agency.


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