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Started By
Message
A little bit of first hand knowledge of Beirut ...
Posted on 10/1/24 at 12:03 pm
Posted on 10/1/24 at 12:03 pm
I was an exchange student in the mid-seventies, while attending tUSC. Four Lebanese Christians, one Dubai Christian and I became lifelong friends.
I spent seven weeks in Beirut with Antoine's, Fadi's, Kamal's and Nadhem's family ... and three weeks in Dubai with Walid's family.
Lebanon was having problems at the time with the Palestinians, having been driven out of Israel, constantly warring aganst Native Christian and Muslim Lebanese. But still, Beirut was the jewel of the region, full of great people, great night clubs and restaurants, great venues for sight seeing, etc.
Dubai was incredible and Walid's Father owned the Hilton there ... one of the best times of my life.
All of them were students at tUSC, all of them graduated with honors. Antoine and his brother Fadi are both Engineers living in Lebanon, TN. Kamal owns a number of Subway Sandwich locations in Central SC. Nahdem owns a large foreign auto repair outfit in Columbia that services Porsche, Mercedes and BMW.
My wife and I visited Beirut in 2004. It was a shell of its old self. Totally Muslim except for a few small pockets, run down, a shithole on the magnitude of the Bronx, Southside Chicago, Revere, Mass, etc.
The people where we stayed in Lebanon in 2004 were, for the most part okay ... although there were more American haters there than most places we visited during that Middle Eastern summer.
The country is in constant turmoil because of the Palestinians. We had to have armed security with us at all times.
The tanker ship blowing up there a couple of years ago sent the city over the edge. It's never recovered. It's basically been a shite hole for four decades (except in small pockets).
There's a huge African population there ... think Congo, Somalis, etc. They're only allowed to live and work there if they practice Islam and work at slave wages.
It's a shame. It used to be an absolute paradise.
A lot of people are going to be caught in the crossfire with nowhere to go when Israel lays siege. All those tall buildings, all those old luxury hotels, are going to be impossible to clear ... MOUT is a bitch as any combat engineer or infantryman knows and this could end up being a much rougher and tougher fight than even Faluja was for our guys.
However, this is waaaaaaay past due, it's past time. This was inevitable since the 70s .... it was bound to happen sooner or later. The government of Lebanon, especially in Beirut, is as inept and corrupt and under control of radical terrorists (sic: PLA, Hezbollah, Hamas, Iran) as you could possibly imagine.
This thing is dangerous for the world beyond most people's understanding.
I've also spent a lot of time in Tel Aviv. I went to Israelis Jump School there in the early 80s. My wife and I have vacationed there a half dozen times in the past 25 years and had planned to go back next summer.
Everything that happens between Tel Aviv and Beirut over the course of the next few weeks, (I'm talking about that specific stretch of land), will reverberate, not only throughout the Middle East but, throughout the world.
And I'll finish with this. Bibi Netanyahu has said since he was a soldier that this was going to have to happen eventually. He's always been looking for a reason ... 7 October gave him that reason. He just had to clear Gaza first.
This is going to be interesting to watch from afar.
************
The perfect storm is happening.
China is poised to take Taiwan the moment we get seriously involved in the Middle East.
Ukraine is going to use NATO missiles to counterattack Russia ... no telling where that might go.
Turkey has put its army on alert ... and they have a serious army. I spent time there training with them. You would be shocked to know how many American trained, duel American-Turkish citizens fight for Turkey and they are very well capable of making things tough on Israel.
Iran is going to be hit regardless.
We're in the throws (sp?) of a Presidential election with idiots currently in charge and our military is a mess, worse than most realize.
Economy issues. 10s of 1000s of military aged men are now in our country with sleeper cells everywhere. Our infrastructure and grid is vulnerable. Confidence is our society and government is waning.
Any early 20th Century history buffs already know that this is all very reminiscent of the pre-WWII days. Different names and places but it's still the same, only worse.
Anyways TL:DR .... still no power here, although I am fortunate to have generators and fuel. Had some time and thought I'd share some thoughts fwiw.
I spent seven weeks in Beirut with Antoine's, Fadi's, Kamal's and Nadhem's family ... and three weeks in Dubai with Walid's family.
Lebanon was having problems at the time with the Palestinians, having been driven out of Israel, constantly warring aganst Native Christian and Muslim Lebanese. But still, Beirut was the jewel of the region, full of great people, great night clubs and restaurants, great venues for sight seeing, etc.
Dubai was incredible and Walid's Father owned the Hilton there ... one of the best times of my life.
All of them were students at tUSC, all of them graduated with honors. Antoine and his brother Fadi are both Engineers living in Lebanon, TN. Kamal owns a number of Subway Sandwich locations in Central SC. Nahdem owns a large foreign auto repair outfit in Columbia that services Porsche, Mercedes and BMW.
My wife and I visited Beirut in 2004. It was a shell of its old self. Totally Muslim except for a few small pockets, run down, a shithole on the magnitude of the Bronx, Southside Chicago, Revere, Mass, etc.
The people where we stayed in Lebanon in 2004 were, for the most part okay ... although there were more American haters there than most places we visited during that Middle Eastern summer.
The country is in constant turmoil because of the Palestinians. We had to have armed security with us at all times.
The tanker ship blowing up there a couple of years ago sent the city over the edge. It's never recovered. It's basically been a shite hole for four decades (except in small pockets).
There's a huge African population there ... think Congo, Somalis, etc. They're only allowed to live and work there if they practice Islam and work at slave wages.
It's a shame. It used to be an absolute paradise.
A lot of people are going to be caught in the crossfire with nowhere to go when Israel lays siege. All those tall buildings, all those old luxury hotels, are going to be impossible to clear ... MOUT is a bitch as any combat engineer or infantryman knows and this could end up being a much rougher and tougher fight than even Faluja was for our guys.
However, this is waaaaaaay past due, it's past time. This was inevitable since the 70s .... it was bound to happen sooner or later. The government of Lebanon, especially in Beirut, is as inept and corrupt and under control of radical terrorists (sic: PLA, Hezbollah, Hamas, Iran) as you could possibly imagine.
This thing is dangerous for the world beyond most people's understanding.
I've also spent a lot of time in Tel Aviv. I went to Israelis Jump School there in the early 80s. My wife and I have vacationed there a half dozen times in the past 25 years and had planned to go back next summer.
Everything that happens between Tel Aviv and Beirut over the course of the next few weeks, (I'm talking about that specific stretch of land), will reverberate, not only throughout the Middle East but, throughout the world.
And I'll finish with this. Bibi Netanyahu has said since he was a soldier that this was going to have to happen eventually. He's always been looking for a reason ... 7 October gave him that reason. He just had to clear Gaza first.
This is going to be interesting to watch from afar.
************
The perfect storm is happening.
China is poised to take Taiwan the moment we get seriously involved in the Middle East.
Ukraine is going to use NATO missiles to counterattack Russia ... no telling where that might go.
Turkey has put its army on alert ... and they have a serious army. I spent time there training with them. You would be shocked to know how many American trained, duel American-Turkish citizens fight for Turkey and they are very well capable of making things tough on Israel.
Iran is going to be hit regardless.
We're in the throws (sp?) of a Presidential election with idiots currently in charge and our military is a mess, worse than most realize.
Economy issues. 10s of 1000s of military aged men are now in our country with sleeper cells everywhere. Our infrastructure and grid is vulnerable. Confidence is our society and government is waning.
Any early 20th Century history buffs already know that this is all very reminiscent of the pre-WWII days. Different names and places but it's still the same, only worse.
Anyways TL:DR .... still no power here, although I am fortunate to have generators and fuel. Had some time and thought I'd share some thoughts fwiw.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 12:22 pm to scrooster
quote:
Kamal owns a number of Subway Sandwich locations in Central SC.
There's stereo types for a reason...
Posted on 10/1/24 at 12:26 pm to scrooster
Thanks scrooster for the history and background and info. I'm afraid you are correct on all of it. I wouldn't doubt of Oct 7 was allowed to happen so they could cull the radicals and those that have kept the middle east a s-hole place.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 1:16 pm to scrooster
quote:
China is poised to take Taiwan the moment we get seriously involved in the Middle East.
No they aren't. In order to pull that off they will need to have everything staged across the Strait. Gazillions of boats and ships especially.
We wouldn't be able to miss that and if it was there, we'd put troops on Taiwan ahead of it.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 1:52 pm to scrooster
I was with a Lebanese Christian friend over the weekend. He talked about how Christians are like 35% of the country and are hoping this shite finally happens right this time.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:00 pm to scrooster
One of the most thoughtful and well-thought-out posts I've ever read here.
I am curious, IYO, at what point and to what degree do we get involved before and after the election? (Assuming Trump wins, no "gotchas")
I am curious, IYO, at what point and to what degree do we get involved before and after the election? (Assuming Trump wins, no "gotchas")
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:01 pm to Big Scrub TX
Lebanese Christians in the US are some of the best people I've ever met
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:04 pm to scrooster
Also, prayers for you and yours!
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:07 pm to scrooster
quote:
Antoine and his brother Fadi are both Engineers living in Lebanon, TN.
That part made me
Good post Scrooster. Hope you get your power back soon.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:07 pm to Captain Rumbeard
quote:
No they aren't. In order to pull that off they will need to have everything staged across the Strait. Gazillions of boats and ships especially.
We wouldn't be able to miss that and if it was there, we'd put troops on Taiwan ahead of it.
I respectfully disagree.
China hitting Taiwan will be like us hitting Mexico (which will also inevitably happen one day). It's a hop, skip and a jump for China, IF that. They already have 1000s of operatives there and 100s of puppets in key, strategic, positions of power. China all but control two of the four major news outlets there and they have communist sympathizers scattered all throughout the bureaucracy.
China doesn't have to stage squat. They've got the equivalent of two of our Corps sitting in Putian and Fuzhou not to mention their 3rd SF Marines in Xiamen alongside their fleet of fast attack delivery boats that can speed out of that port and onto Taiwanese shores inside of 3 hrs in bad seas.
That strait is barely 100 miles across .... China could damn near build a floating bridge with corks to their insertion point between Changhua and Taibao which is where EVERYONE knows is going to be their landing spot.
Let's note one more interesting parallel as of this past 24 hrs.
While BiBi is literally quoting Old Testament Biblical scripture as his forces hit Lebanon and .... about to be Iran. And Iran's mullahs are twiddling their tongues and screaming crazy Muhammed and Allah made up stuff ...
Xi is quoting ancient written claims while holding up 2000 year old scrolls claiming Taiwan belongs to the mainland.
All the while Putin is giving speeches to his masses about Russia's legal claim to the Donbas, as recognized by the rest of that region (and the world for that matter) under Catherine the Great and Grigory Potemkin in the mid-late 18th Century.
There's an overriding theme here that's undeniable.
China taking Taiwan will be an afterthought and this current administration will not lift one frickin' finger to stop it other than some minor adolescent sword rattling.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:10 pm to Big Scrub TX
quote:It wasn't that long ago when it was damn near 50%.
I was with a Lebanese Christian friend over the weekend. He talked about how Christians are like 35% of the country and are hoping this shite finally happens right this time.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:12 pm to scrooster
I have a friend who was in the Marine barracks in 1983, He survived and spent the next several days pulling maimed and dead Marines out of the rubble. Many being his close friends.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:13 pm to scrooster
Since I began interest in MENA things, I'd always heard of Lebanese Christians' grudging appreciation or neutrality toward Hezbollah. I've spoken to a couple of people about it over the years in passing who may or may not have held that view personally but seemed to confirm it wasn't an uncommon position.
Thoughts on that idea vs. this mantra we see in the West (especially in recent weeks) of non-Muslims welcoming Israeli action at long last as liberators, etc.?
Thoughts on that idea vs. this mantra we see in the West (especially in recent weeks) of non-Muslims welcoming Israeli action at long last as liberators, etc.?
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:15 pm to Big Scrub TX
Lebanon is between a rock and a hard place. They can't act against Hezbollah because they'll be at war with Syria and yet their inaction results in being routinely bombed by the Israelis. And Lebanese women are absolutely .
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:53 pm to scrooster
The USC ? Fight on, the southern cal song girls
This post was edited on 10/1/24 at 2:54 pm
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:58 pm to scrooster
Nah. They aren't moving enough men across that strait in anything like a surprise attack. Which would be absolutely necessary or they'll all drown or be killed on the beach. You're right about where they have to come ashore. I just wonder why you believe that those beaches aren't secured? These people have an underground runway and caves all over the place.
They're ready. If China wants to do their first modern amphibious assault they've ever done on that Island, it's not going to go how they imagine it.
They're ready. If China wants to do their first modern amphibious assault they've ever done on that Island, it's not going to go how they imagine it.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 2:59 pm to Hangover Haven
quote:
There's stereo types for a reason...
I've always been a Sony man myself, but I can't discount panasonic back in the day.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 3:24 pm to jrobic4
quote:
I am curious, IYO, at what point and to what degree do we get involved before and after the election? (Assuming Trump wins, no "gotchas")
We shouldn't get involved with ground troops. We're more likely to throw some weight around in the Red Sea and the Persian Gulf. Iran only has about a 200 km missile strike range ... we'll shut that down via surface to air countermeasures, but otherwise we should sit back and let Israel do their thing.
Our current assclown administration and military will continue to plead for diplomatic solutions but BiBi is beyond that and so are 70% of his people after the latest attack by Iran.
Once Beirut is conquered, BiBi is going after Iran.
Posted on 10/1/24 at 4:07 pm to Captain Rumbeard
quote:
If China wants to do their first modern amphibious assault they've ever done on that Island, it's not going to go how they imagine it.
You happen to catch the coordinated show of 10,000 drones they put on a few days ago?
You think that’s just art or entertainment?
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