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2
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:07 pm to Lsupimp
Come over to Texas baw, where the highways, food, women, and economy are second to none
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:15 pm to link
quote:
Weird, right? All the clamoring over needing something to get done, all the bitching and moaning, all the thread starting and upvoting at how corrupt and incompetent everyone else is...but when presented with an idea, the public comes out in full force protesting all the public meetings, yelling at DOTD and yelling at the engineers that this route "is gone take muh pawpaw's land", putting up "NO LOOP" signs in their yard, making t-shirts and holding up posterboards to "save alligator bayou!!1", and writing their congressman.
That all sounds so incredibly coordinated doesn't it? It's almost as if all of that uproar was an astroturf movement created by a few people backed by donations and outside money who paid a few dozen people to protest on tv and show up at meetings to create the illusion of a large, outraged majority that didn't exist? It's almost as if it was done in a way to give some kind of excuse for not building the project. I bet those people protesting were highly tied to someone who owned a different tract of land that was an alternative route for the loop and would stand to gain financially from the loop going to a different location.
It's amazing what a little guerrilla politicking can accomplish. If people show up to a council meeting in matching t-shirts chanting slogans opposing something that you would have otherwise suspected was widely supported, odds are, those people are paid protesters and in no way are representative of public sentiment. Those who cave to that "pressure" are often in on the con and are actively involved in recruiting these paid protestors because they need "pressure" to have a political excuse not to support such a blatantly good proposal.
Their goal is to prevent government money from being spent on actual needs that the public supports so that the money being taken to pay for those things can instead be laundered to politicians, their friends, and relatives through unnecessary jobs and government contracts to perform unnecessary functions.
This post was edited on 3/27/19 at 12:17 pm
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:16 pm to Ed Osteen
technically it was the word "LOOP" with a circle and line through it
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:17 pm to xiv
quote:
I’m actually hoping to be able to help out a good bit with the Abraham campaign
sweet!
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:29 pm to yessir
quote:
All of that still bottlenecks at the bridge.
Airline takes you directly to the 190 bridge north of town. It is perfect if you are traveling to go north on I-49.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:30 pm to kingbob
bob, we need to get to the bottom of this shite
this is part of the environmental study:
https://www.brloop.com/pdf/02_Baton%20Rouge%20Loop%20Tier%201%20FEIS%20Volume%202%20Part%201%20-%20Appendix%20A%20thru%20F.pdf
Go to page A-12. Huge support for the project initially.
Where did the support go? Who's pulling the strings here? What did Kip know, and when did he know it?
this is part of the environmental study:
https://www.brloop.com/pdf/02_Baton%20Rouge%20Loop%20Tier%201%20FEIS%20Volume%202%20Part%201%20-%20Appendix%20A%20thru%20F.pdf
Go to page A-12. Huge support for the project initially.
Where did the support go? Who's pulling the strings here? What did Kip know, and when did he know it?
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:38 pm to link
I don't think Kip has anything to do with the resistance against the Loop. Kip is a forward thinking guy that always seems to put the interests in growing BR first. At the time the Spanish Lake Route was nixed, it was already the northern-most route still being considered. The only reason Kip would have opposed it would have been the fact that the crossing wasn't in EBR, but none of the other crossings were in EBR either. I think Kip was as blindsided as everyone else was that it failed.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:39 pm to Ed Osteen
quote:
I've seen you posting here for over a decade and somehow never realized you're an idiot until now. So thanks for that I guess
Agreed
This post was edited on 3/27/19 at 12:40 pm
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:47 pm to CarRamrod
quote:
We are one of the highest taxed states with one of the shittiest infrastructures because misappropriation of funds and plain old over spending and lining family members and doners pockets.
It is all that, but it's not just that. Understand that federal Highway funds are going to come to the state is a bloc and then it is up to the executive branch to doll out the money to where the executive department wants....sooooo even though say BR NEEDS the money, JBE may decide that he NEEDS to take care of a road in St. Helena to make a particular Rep happy( for example)
Also, do not underestimate the power of the NIMBY.....they seem to be concentrated in Louisiana
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:48 pm to link
Here's how this works:
1. have a project that everyone wants but contain possible versions of that project that are both sensible and nonsensical.
2. Use political mechanizations and bureaucratic reasons to eliminate the most reasonable options without actually going to the people while also causing costs to balloon or the completion timescale for the project to increase substantially for no apparent reason. (they nixed the loop routes which would have had the bridge near Brightside or Gardere)
3. Make the other alternatives so unworkable that the public won't possibly support them. They did this by having the other options be the ridiculous southern loops that connect with the Sunshine Bridge. These routes go so far out of the way that they don't save time or add capacity.
4. Use paid protesters or a law suit to block the only remaining options that make any sense (near Plaquemine).
5. Use fake polls to claim that public perception has shifted against the project as a whole and use that to abandon it without a vote.
This is how they killed the loop 10 years ago. This is how they kill anything that is a good idea. They kill good ideas by bait and switch, forcing you to vote against the boondoggle they replace that good idea with.
Don't forget that 20 years before that, Burbank/Sherwood was supposed to be the loop with the new bridge going near Brightside.
1. have a project that everyone wants but contain possible versions of that project that are both sensible and nonsensical.
2. Use political mechanizations and bureaucratic reasons to eliminate the most reasonable options without actually going to the people while also causing costs to balloon or the completion timescale for the project to increase substantially for no apparent reason. (they nixed the loop routes which would have had the bridge near Brightside or Gardere)
3. Make the other alternatives so unworkable that the public won't possibly support them. They did this by having the other options be the ridiculous southern loops that connect with the Sunshine Bridge. These routes go so far out of the way that they don't save time or add capacity.
4. Use paid protesters or a law suit to block the only remaining options that make any sense (near Plaquemine).
5. Use fake polls to claim that public perception has shifted against the project as a whole and use that to abandon it without a vote.
This is how they killed the loop 10 years ago. This is how they kill anything that is a good idea. They kill good ideas by bait and switch, forcing you to vote against the boondoggle they replace that good idea with.
Don't forget that 20 years before that, Burbank/Sherwood was supposed to be the loop with the new bridge going near Brightside.
This post was edited on 3/27/19 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:57 pm to xiv
quote:So maybe there is hope for you to understand why some people might choose to live in a certain place.
Home ain’t a downgrade. xivelle is from here, too. We missed it.
quote:Every single person who bothered to respond to you said that your suggestion is not in any way feasible for the vast majority of people, but you continue to poke and prod the people who have a legit complaint about how ineffective our government has been. You went so far as to say everyone can do it if they'd just think outside the box. That is simply not true for a wide variety of reasons.
I’m not the one starting all these threads. All I’m doing is showing a page in the xiv playbook that completely solves one’s traffic problem. You decide if it’s for you. Have a great day.
So, we have considered your "solution" and discarded it. Thanks.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 2:32 pm to LSUTigersVCURams
quote:
You ever driven through Beaumont?
Are you referring to the traffic slowdowns that come from improving their highway system and widening the bridge over their major river?
Do we not want that in Baton Roodge?
Posted on 3/27/19 at 2:49 pm to Korkstand
quote:I poked and prodded you because you were being a prick to me, so I decided to have fun with it during my non-commute time.
but you continue to poke and prod
And it’s feasible for everyone if they want it enough.
Bridge sure does look backed up from here....
Posted on 3/27/19 at 3:52 pm to link
quote:
All the clamoring over needing something to get done, all the bitching and moaning, all the thread starting and upvoting at how corrupt and incompetent everyone else is...but when presented with an idea, the public comes out in full force protesting all the public meetings, yelling at DOTD and yelling at the engineers that this route "is gone take muh pawpaw's land", putting up "NO LOOP" signs in their yard, making t-shirts and holding up posterboards to "save alligator bayou!!1", and writing their congressman.
This is why roads and bridges get the frick BUILT in totalitarian countries. We could use fricking Saddam Hussein right now in Louisiana.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 3:58 pm to Ed Osteen
quote:
Not being a dick but these actually existed?
I easily saw a sign in Watson years ago.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 4:01 pm to xiv
quote:
xiv
I think you are 100% right in this thread, FWIW. the masses decided to move to Prairieville/Denham so they can live in houses that cost 1/2 as much as the similar house I live in close to work in BR proper. Obviously an unpopular opinion, but I don't sit in traffic. If it is that bad for my normal 2 minute commute, I'll ride my bike or walk to work.
That said, the city needs to get its shite together and fix the problem. It is frustrating as hell to have to read all of these traffic threads everyday.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 4:09 pm to Motorboat
Not only does the home in EBR cost twice as much, but their children can walk to the end of their driveway to catch the bus to a public school where they won’t get shanked without having to pay an extra $12k to send their kids to private school. Those people didn’t just abandon BR on a whim. The school situation all but forced them out financially.
This post was edited on 3/27/19 at 4:10 pm
Posted on 3/27/19 at 5:10 pm to Lsupimp
97% of LA citizens fall into one of two camps.
1) People who constantly have their hand out and expect some other group (mainly, the feds) to pay for all of our needed solutions. This, despite the fact we already get more federal benefit in LA than tax dollars we send to the feds.
2) People who believe we pay "enough" in taxes (despite having the 45th-lowest state and local tax burden) and who believe if we just "cut spending" then there would magically be billions of dollars appear to fix our roads and other problems.
The entire rest of the country has figured out that the only way to fix road problems are:
A) Build new highways with tolls. But... we refuse to even consider tolls as an option.
B) Raise gas taxes to pay for local roads. But, again, "we pay too many taxes".
1) People who constantly have their hand out and expect some other group (mainly, the feds) to pay for all of our needed solutions. This, despite the fact we already get more federal benefit in LA than tax dollars we send to the feds.
2) People who believe we pay "enough" in taxes (despite having the 45th-lowest state and local tax burden) and who believe if we just "cut spending" then there would magically be billions of dollars appear to fix our roads and other problems.
The entire rest of the country has figured out that the only way to fix road problems are:
A) Build new highways with tolls. But... we refuse to even consider tolls as an option.
B) Raise gas taxes to pay for local roads. But, again, "we pay too many taxes".
Posted on 3/27/19 at 5:12 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
People who believe we pay "enough" in taxes (despite having the 45th-lowest state and local tax burden
JBE fixed that baw. We aren't even close to 45.
We are #27 now
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