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Started By
Message
I dont understand how anybody can not like Cooks for Butler.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 3:39 pm
Posted on 3/16/17 at 3:39 pm
Unless you think that Butler wont be good here. That is the only reason a person could not like this trade.
1.Cooks had to go. He had already burned his bridge to staying here. He wanted out.
2.We were never getting a mid first round pick for him. He's just not worth it.
3. Butler will be more ready to play than any corner we would have gotten in the late first round and maybe the entire first round.
4. Recievers are less valuable to the Saints than a corner. Brees has proven to be able to succeed with an array of different recievers.
1.Cooks had to go. He had already burned his bridge to staying here. He wanted out.
2.We were never getting a mid first round pick for him. He's just not worth it.
3. Butler will be more ready to play than any corner we would have gotten in the late first round and maybe the entire first round.
4. Recievers are less valuable to the Saints than a corner. Brees has proven to be able to succeed with an array of different recievers.
This post was edited on 3/16/17 at 4:09 pm
14
Posted on 3/16/17 at 3:43 pm to LakeViewLSU
I like the Saints trading Cooks for Butler more than them actually using the 32nd pick in the draft. The last time the Saints did that trading Jimmy Graham and getting the Seahawks C Unger and then drafting their 32nd pick for LB Stephone Anthony hasn't paned out very well. For Anthony that is, not Unger. Unger's a beast.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 3:43 pm to LakeViewLSU
quote:
1.Cooks had to go. He had already burned his bridge to staying here. He wanted out.
he could have kept burning bridges, yet he was under contract for 2 more years for cheap and he was going to be productive.
quote:
2.We were never getting a mid first round pick for him. He's just not worth it.
yup
quote:
3. Butler will be more ready to play than any corner we would have gotten in the late first round and maybe the entire first round.
agreed, but people are mad because we could have signed bouye/gilmore who are the same or maybe a step below butler without giving up cooks/1st/whatever
Posted on 3/16/17 at 3:47 pm to LakeViewLSU
because people like doing mock drafts and the more picks, the more fun. You take away 32 and people lose a talking point.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 3:55 pm to LakeViewLSU
It is because the team could have pursued a FA CB for probably a similar contract that they will have to pay Butler and STILL gotten value for Cooks if they wanted to trade him.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 4:16 pm to NOSHAU
quote:
It is because the team could have pursued a FA CB for probably a similar contract that they will have to pay Butler
Same ability to compliment that salary?
quote:
STILL gotten value for Cooks if they wanted to trade him.
Able to (potentially) sign Butler to a long term deal for the cost of a draft pick and a 5'-10" WR that doesn't go over the middle to a team that will probably use him exclusively in the middle? I loved Cooks during his time here, but he was never a Colston, Horn or even MT13 type to me.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 4:16 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
because people like doing mock drafts and the more picks, the more fun. You take away 32 and people lose a talking point.
Yeah, this is a reason.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 4:19 pm to whodatfan
it sounds stupid, but it's a big part. It makes people over value that pick, for sure.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 4:54 pm to LakeViewLSU
The answer is right in front of you.
1) The Patriots sign Gilmore for no draft picks. They then trade a player they will lose in a year for a player they will have for 5 years cheap. SMART
2) The Saints trade Cooks and a 4 for a 1 and 3. If we sign Butler for 32nd pick. We in effect traded Cooks in return for moving from the 11th pick in the 4th round to the last pick in the 3rd round. So Cooks went for 12 draft slots. NOT SMART
Butler can be had for no picks next year. Smart teams wait, get him in a year AND have the 32nd pick.
3) This draft is deep in the positions we need. Incompetence in drafting is not a valid excuse for not being smart.
1) The Patriots sign Gilmore for no draft picks. They then trade a player they will lose in a year for a player they will have for 5 years cheap. SMART
2) The Saints trade Cooks and a 4 for a 1 and 3. If we sign Butler for 32nd pick. We in effect traded Cooks in return for moving from the 11th pick in the 4th round to the last pick in the 3rd round. So Cooks went for 12 draft slots. NOT SMART
Butler can be had for no picks next year. Smart teams wait, get him in a year AND have the 32nd pick.
3) This draft is deep in the positions we need. Incompetence in drafting is not a valid excuse for not being smart.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 4:56 pm to LakeViewLSU
i am happy with it
cooks was laniappe
butler is needed
cooks was laniappe
butler is needed
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:10 pm to LakeViewLSU
quote:
Unless you think that Butler wont be good here. That is the only reason a person could not like this trade.
This is my reasoning and it's not that I don't think he'll be good as just not worth a huge contract and worth a first rd pick for. Outside of Talib who is just a great talent in general and a year or so of welker with manning, I can't think of many players who played as well or improved for the team they left the patriots for. There may be others, I just can't think of any. The patriots have a great ability to let a guy go a year or two at most before their play starts to really decline. Now if we get him for a team friendly price I'll feel a lot different but I'm aftraid we're giving up and 1st and 10+ million a year for him.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:13 pm to LakeViewLSU
Cooks was drafted with a 1st and a 3rd, Butler was an undrafted free agent.
Butler got smoked by numerous number 1 receivers this year.
"Arizona’s Larry Fitzgerald lit up the Pats with eight catches for 81 yards and two touchdowns in Week 1, Miami’s Jarvis Landry hauled in 10 balls for 135 yards in Week 2, Buffalo’s Robert Woods had seven catches for 89 yards in Week 4, Cincy’s A.J. Green had six catches for 88 yards in Week 6, and Antonio Brown had seven grabs for 106 yards in Week 7."
We have had terrible luck trading and signing CB/S free agents in the past.
We drafted Cooks because we had no one that could take the top off and he had proven he can.
That said I am kinda OK with the trade, even at 32.
Butler got smoked by numerous number 1 receivers this year.
"Arizona’s Larry Fitzgerald lit up the Pats with eight catches for 81 yards and two touchdowns in Week 1, Miami’s Jarvis Landry hauled in 10 balls for 135 yards in Week 2, Buffalo’s Robert Woods had seven catches for 89 yards in Week 4, Cincy’s A.J. Green had six catches for 88 yards in Week 6, and Antonio Brown had seven grabs for 106 yards in Week 7."
We have had terrible luck trading and signing CB/S free agents in the past.
We drafted Cooks because we had no one that could take the top off and he had proven he can.
That said I am kinda OK with the trade, even at 32.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:14 pm to Spelt it rong
quote:Yes. I consider Gilmore and Bouye the same ability and neither would have cost any draft picks or players. Ryan is not too far behind either. So, I would have preferred signing one of them instead of giving up a #1 pick for the right to negotiate with Butler.
quote:quote:Same ability to compliment that salary?
It is because the team could have pursued a FA CB for probably a similar contract that they will have to pay Butlerquote:Able to (potentially) sign Butler to a long term deal for the cost of a draft pick and a 5'-10" WR that doesn't go over the middle to a team that will probably use him exclusively in the middle? I loved Cooks during his time here, but he was never a Colston, Horn or even MT13 type to me.
STILL gotten value for Cooks if they wanted to trade him.
This post was edited on 3/16/17 at 5:16 pm
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:14 pm to LakeViewLSU
quote:
1.Cooks had to go. He had already burned his bridge to staying here. He wanted out.
Still think is overblown. In a vacuum I'd still want him here.
quote:
2.We were never getting a mid first round pick for him. He's just not worth it.
I think if we weren't in an extreme rush to ship him out to avoid the bonus then maybe. But maybe not as well.
quote:
3. Butler will be more ready to play than any corner we would have gotten in the late first round and maybe the entire first round.
Agreed. Considering we all know we need a CB why not just give the 32 back and get one of top currently playing.
quote:
4. Recievers are less valuable to the Saints than a corner. Brees has proven to be able to succeed with an array of different recievers.
Yes...to an extent. Before we rebuilt our WR corp the last year or two it was pretty painful. I mean yeah Brees is gonna throw for his yards, but we weren't having 3 1000 yard receivers like we did last year.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:14 pm to t00f
quote:
We have had terrible luck trading and signing CB/S free agents in the past.
We haven't had good DB play since 2013. I'll take my chances.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:16 pm to mitchleger
A)There is no guarantee they'd get Butler next year
B)New England could tag him next season
C)Corner is the hardest position to draft. Butler is top 10 at the position
D)Butler fills a position of need
E)They need to win now while Brees is still a high level
B)New England could tag him next season
C)Corner is the hardest position to draft. Butler is top 10 at the position
D)Butler fills a position of need
E)They need to win now while Brees is still a high level
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:17 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:
We haven't had good DB play since 2013. I'll take my chances.
Lot of injuries, ranked number one this last year with 32 players on the IR alone.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:17 pm to St Augustine
quote:
I'm aftraid we're giving up and 1st
Could be, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if it is for less
quote:
10+ million a year for him
This will definitely happen. Gillmore got 13 per year.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:21 pm to CocoLoco
Expecting him to get 10-12 pretty easily.
Butler, Breaux, Williams, Vaccaro, Bell could be a very good secondary if they all stay healthy.
Butler, Breaux, Williams, Vaccaro, Bell could be a very good secondary if they all stay healthy.
Posted on 3/16/17 at 5:32 pm to LakeViewLSU
Hmmmm...
Saints get butler
#33 from Cleveland
#52 from Cleveland
Pats get
#11 from Saints
#12 from Cleveland
2018 1st Round Cleveland
Browns get
Garrapilo
2018 2nd from Pats
2018 2nd from Saints
Saints get butler
#33 from Cleveland
#52 from Cleveland
Pats get
#11 from Saints
#12 from Cleveland
2018 1st Round Cleveland
Browns get
Garrapilo
2018 2nd from Pats
2018 2nd from Saints
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