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ShamelessPel
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Metairie
Member since Apr 2013
10914 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
Dude you don’t cut bait on a prospect you’ve invested a ton of time on just as he starts turning a corner. Unlike Ajinca, Diallo does some things extremely well in spurts. I’m sure people would have laughed at giving Aminu literally anything, yet he became a SF we would have loved the last 3-4 years.

It’s a risk to give him a slight deal larger than the minimum. You’re betting on him. Some of y’all are being obtuse and borderline moronic when acting like 4 fricking million is some crazy number. That’s a very friendly number where you could potentially have a player, who could outperform his deal easily, locked down for incredible value.

Having a 15 minute high energy rebounder and defender who comes in and does his job on both ends of the floor is easily worth 4 million. Let’s not forget his extremely efficient, yet still raw/unproven offensive game. This current Diallo is worth slightly more the way he’s playing. I’m buying low on a prospect who could easily outperform a deal. You’re acting like an irrational fan. The Ajinca comment is proof of that. Ajinca did very little at even an above average level. He was mediocre at best or worst in so many areas.

The guy is 22 years old and we knew when we drafted him that it would take time. But yeah, let’s cut bait because he was really tough to watch for the first couple of years.

So much hyperbole and emotional stupidity.
This post was edited on 3/5 at 10:06 am


Soggymoss
Member since Aug 2018
894 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
The thing is you have him as a RFA for another year.. Why pay him more when you dont really have to, and it could end up being a great deal, but theres a far bigger chance it's a bad deal..

Now if you would change it to a 3/7.5 or 2/6 then I'm sure alot more people would be on board with that, because his value will probably never be much more if any above 2.5-3 a year


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BetOnIt
Member since Feb 2019
125 posts
 Online 

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
But when has he ever done anything good when this team was actually trying to win games and opponents were gearing up for us?

Doesn't it concern you that he just starts putting up stats now when the season is over? Or that a 92 year old Emeka Okafor got his minutes last year when the Pelicans were making a push for the playoffs?

Personally, I think the guy is fools gold, and I wouldn't spend any money or real resources on him. I find it very unlikely that we would let him go and regret it in any meaningful way. And the only reason anybody regretted Aminu is because they signed Solomon Hill. If Dell would have used that money to sign a real SF or actually kept a draft pick and drafted one, nobody would be longing for Aminu and his 12.4 PER since he has been in Portland. And yes, that is actually lower than the 12.7 PER he produced here.



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TeddyPadillac
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Dec 2010
12881 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
If you recall, when AD would hurt his vagina every 5 games or so and sit, Ajinca would come in and be serviceable. His Per36 stats were good, and almost identical to Diallo's. he was nothing special, and a fouling machine, but he had no problem scoring when given the opportunity, just like Okafor. Doesn't change the fact that neither of them are good players on a good team. What you are thinking about Diallo, is exactly what Dell thought about Ajinca before giving him that deal. No $4M isn't some crazy number, but it's 200% more than he's worth and what he brings to the court. Again, why would you pay someone $4M to do something someone that makes $1.5M can do? You assume that i think Ajinca was somehow a decent deal at the time, which it wasn't. I'm simply pointing out that your thinking of Diallo, is exactly what Dell thought of Ajinca, and you are allowing your recency bias of both ajinca and Diallo to not allow you to see the striking similarities.

What could Diallo do to outperform a 3/$12 deal? He has no offensive game. He gets' hustle points, that's it. He is an unintelligent defender, and extremely undersized to play down low. He's effecient b/c he isnt' asked to do anything but hustle. His raw/unproven offense, is what it is, and always will be. He has developed a mid range jumper and that's the extent of his offensive game outside of hustle points, and it always will be. The only thing i can see him improving on is learning when and how to make himself available in passing lanes, and i think he's too dumb to ever get that and doesn't possess the natural instincts for that.
What are you expecting him to improve upon offensively?

I'm not saying to cut bait with him. I'm not saying to not keep him. I like Diallo, and i'd love to keep him, but why would you offer some long term deal when no one else in the league would?
I've said it many times over the last 2 years that he should play more. His hustle running the floor creates space as crazy as that sounds. As a team that pushes the pace, he gets that started by making the defense adjust to him running the floor and helps create confusion and mismatches elsewhere.

You think i'm being moronic, and i feel the same exact way about your rationale on this.


and i don't want to hear anything about Aminu. He was a 27% 3 point shooter who was a good defender and hustler for us for 3 years. Nothing special about that. He goes to Portland and someone learns how to shoot and becomes a 36% 3 point shooter for 3 years. Who saw that coming from his moonball shot?
This post was edited on 3/5 at 10:45 am


ShamelessPel
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Metairie
Member since Apr 2013
10914 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
quote:

If you recall, when AD would hurt his vagina every 5 games or so and sit, Ajinca would come in and be serviceable. His Per36 stats were good, and almost identical to Diallo's. he was nothing special, and a fouling machine, but he had no problem scoring when given the opportunity, just like Okafor. Doesn't change the fact that neither of them are good players on a good team. What you are thinking about Diallo, is exactly what Dell thought about Ajinca before giving him that deal. No $4M isn't some crazy number, but it's 200% more than he's worth and what he brings to the court. Again, why would you pay someone $4M to do something someone that makes $1.5M can do? You assume that i think Ajinca was somehow a decent deal at the time, which it wasn't. I'm simply pointing out that your thinking of Diallo, is exactly what Dell thought of Ajinca, and you are allowing your recency bias of both ajinca and Diallo to not allow you to see the striking similarities


So much of this is just wrong. There’s not very many similarities between Ajinca and Diallo. They’re not even close to similar players. I’m not going to argue Ajinca vs Diallo because for one, the deal I’m proposing isn’t even comparable...for two, there’s very little similarities unless you want to simplify it to the bare bones averages. And only then do certain things stick.

quote:

I'm not saying to cut bait with him. I'm not saying to not keep him. I like Diallo, and i'd love to keep him, but why would you offer some long term deal when no one else in the league would? I've said it many times over the last 2 years that he should play more. His hustle running the floor creates space as crazy as that sounds. As a team that pushes the pace, he gets that started by making the defense adjust to him running the floor and helps create confusion and mismatches elsewhere. You think i'm being moronic, and i feel the same exact way about your rationale on this.


Again, comparing a 4/20 with a 58 million cap to a 3/12 with a 109 cap is just disingenuous. There’s plenty of reason to lock him up for twice the minimum. If this improvement isn’t a mirage, you have him under contract on a very team friendly deal. But fine, let him go, or make him sign the QO and bolt in free agency. It’s really not a make or break issue, but acting like this is some whacky and crazy idea is kind of stupid and uninformed, especially with the dumbass Ajinca comparison you keep throwing around.


TeddyPadillac
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Dec 2010
12881 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
quote:

They’re not even close to similar players


I agree. Doesn't change the fact that they both were backup bigs that have good PER36 numbers and have had games where they played really well, mostly in games that didn't matter on teams that weren't going to the playoffs.


quote:

Again, comparing a 4/20 with a 58 million cap to a 3/12 with a 109 cap is just disingenuous.

58 million cap?
It was $70M, and they new it was jumping to near $100M the next year which is why so many stupid arse long term deals were given out that year.




Tell me specifically what he does on offense and defense that warrants above the minimum? I explained what i thought his game was specifically. You keep saying he can improve and outperform his contract. Explain to me in basketball terms how he's going to do that in your eyes. You've yet to do that, and if you want to convince me, or anyone else out there he deserves a ridiculous deal like that, be specific in what you see him becoming. I can be convinced to change my mind, but you need to do a much better job at it.


TigerinATL
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Feb 2005
50060 posts
 Online 

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
There is no reason to be pre-emptive or proactive here. Pretty much all but the obvious Max Level RFAs have to go through the same process. Their agent tries to get an offer sheet for their team to match before they accept a lower offer than they were hoping for.

If Diallo gets an offer sheet, which I think is a big if, I only consider matching it if I respect the FO that made the offer. Remember that we ended up with Hill's contract because the Lakers were one of the teams interested in him too and drove his price up. We should have let them have him. That was the same Lakers that later grossly over paid Mozgov and Deng. Demps had all the evidence he needed to see he was on the wrong path.

If Pop or Carlisle wants Diallo, you should match. If it's another dumpster fire franchise they can have him.


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shel311
Nicholls St. Fan
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
68760 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
quote:

Crewz, this has to be the least subtle alter ever
I received a million downvotes when I said it, but this alter 100% proves every single thing about what I said about his desperation and that he'd be back in no time.


Yea, I'm taking my victory lap.


DeionDeion
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
New Orleans, LA
Member since Apr 2010
5006 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
I don't understand why so many are ready & willing to spend cap space this summer. That's what we did with AD and it left us lacking for ways to improve the roster. We have one of the best guards in the league in Jrue and potentially will have one of best up-and-coming SF's in the NBA in Jayson Tatum and a chance to build a squad around them. And the way some of yall want to do that is by signing FAs this summer like Vucevic or giving Diallo $4 mil/yr? I don't get it.

I'm not trying to be a jerk but I don't want this rebuild put on fast-forward. That's what messed us up with building around AD. I'd rather accumulate things we've never had: assets. Like acquiring bad contracts for picks. Or signing a good player to a short term deal so that we can trade him for a young player.


Because imo some of the rosters I'm seeing gets us to the 7th or 6th seed at best and that's where we cap out.

I think we try to not to repeat the mistakes of the past. Accumulate as much as we can a la the Brooklyn Nets model that way we don't waste another chance to build a contender around a young, budding talent
This post was edited on 3/5 at 11:25 am


TigerinATL
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Member since Feb 2005
50060 posts
 Online 

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
I completely agree. Hopefully the new GM will have a very cool seat to sit on and will have the freedom to be patient with the build. They need to add capable players to the mix without overpaying in either money or years until the core is settled.


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Philippines4LSU
LSU Fan
Lake Sebu, S. Cotabalo, Philippines
Member since May 2018
4227 posts
 Online 

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle

Double-tech on Shameless and Teddy for excessive jawing.


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DeionDeion
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
New Orleans, LA
Member since Apr 2010
5006 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
I hope so too. Being patient gives us a better opportunity to build a team and a culture that is sustainable long-term.


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LosLobos111
LSU Fan
Transcendent
Member since Feb 2011
38645 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
It'll be a little different because they'll likely have Memphis pick in 2020 and whatever picks in this years draft

Like I said in another thread they could probably easily trade 9-10 to a team that falls in love wth a guy and gain future assets

I'm not on board with signing vucevic or a middleton as that's unwise. I'm fine with signing Randle to 3/40-45 signing a shooter and bench big and calling it a day. Moving hill(possibly Moore too) gives them a ton of space even with the above move



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CP3forMVP
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Nov 2010
5174 posts
 Online 

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
Ok crewz


BetOnIt
Member since Feb 2019
125 posts
 Online 

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
You are like the third or fourth person to call my post a crewz. Can someone fill me in on the joke? What is wrong with my post?


Charlito
Tulane Fan
Member since Oct 2007
633 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
I’m curious bet on what?


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Pelibeast
Member since Jun 2017
46 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
The people saying to give Diallo anything but the minimum just never learn from our mistakes.

Honestly with a new GM, he will be lucky to get the minimum from us since there will be no sentimental value there. Great kid and hope the best for him but that’s the truth.


Aussie_Pelican
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Melbourne
Member since Oct 2016
616 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
No chance this is MM.
He would not want Randle part of the core.


Aussie_Pelican
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
Melbourne
Member since Oct 2016
616 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
He is a RFA.
If nobody counters that, then he will be a Pel for 1.931M next season.


Pelefraan 1
Member since Jan 2018
1578 posts

re: Jrue, Tatum, and Randle
Diallo will be a Pelican next season

Cheick at Buddy's age will be a good player
This post was edited on 3/5 at 4:10 pm


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