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How concerned should we be with the Preseason performance?
Posted on 10/11/18 at 9:37 am
Posted on 10/11/18 at 9:37 am
Disclaimer: I have only watched about 5 minutes of one preseason game on my phone and not another second.
Disclaimer 2: I'm fully aware that the only thing more worthless than NFL preseason is NBA Preseason.
ok. Looking at statsheets and game logs and etc...how concerned should we be about this team? By all accounts they have looked pretty bad, and really bad defensively all preseason. Randle has looked pretty good apparently, as has Miller, but everyone else has seemed pretty listless.
Those who have watched or have dug deeper into the numbers...thoughts?
Disclaimer 2: I'm fully aware that the only thing more worthless than NFL preseason is NBA Preseason.
ok. Looking at statsheets and game logs and etc...how concerned should we be about this team? By all accounts they have looked pretty bad, and really bad defensively all preseason. Randle has looked pretty good apparently, as has Miller, but everyone else has seemed pretty listless.
Those who have watched or have dug deeper into the numbers...thoughts?
6
Posted on 10/11/18 at 9:58 am to Fun Bunch
I've watched about half of 3 of the games.
Liked what I saw from Randle. Liked Payton's ability to get to the rim. Jrue looks assertive. Miller looks confident.
They look like they had zero interest in playing defense, and have been getting annihilated in points in the paint in all 4 games.
Last year we were bottom 5 in the league in giving up points in the paint, but we were first in scoring points in the paint. We have a -16 average margin through these 4 worthless games.
The Celtics and Warriors are both 1-3, so there's that.
I"m not going to worry about it now. If they come out in the first 2 or 3 games and you see the shitty lackluster defense, i'll be concerned.
Liked what I saw from Randle. Liked Payton's ability to get to the rim. Jrue looks assertive. Miller looks confident.
They look like they had zero interest in playing defense, and have been getting annihilated in points in the paint in all 4 games.
Last year we were bottom 5 in the league in giving up points in the paint, but we were first in scoring points in the paint. We have a -16 average margin through these 4 worthless games.
The Celtics and Warriors are both 1-3, so there's that.
I"m not going to worry about it now. If they come out in the first 2 or 3 games and you see the shitty lackluster defense, i'll be concerned.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:02 am to Fun Bunch
Concerns: Diallo, Hill, and 'on ball' Frank Jackson
In an optimists world, Hill would have been a spot starter in certain situations this year and a 21-27 mpg quality defender regardless. Diallo would have taken another small step and given you 10-14mpg so that the other three bigs could not put too many miles on their legs. He would also let you feel okay when a big had to miss a week with an ankle injury.
Also, I have not liked how often they have played Frank Jackson on the ball as a point guard. To me, he needs to be off the ball and going downhill all the time. He shouldn't be bringing it up trying to get the team into their offense. Maybe its just a preseason experiment, but I don't like it.
The positives: Jrue looks EVEN BETTER than last postseason. I have seen a top 15 player. Randle is a beast when he puts his head down and goes to the bucket and Niko isn't hitting his 3's but has so many creative ways to score. When he does start hitting, look out. Also, not only are Miller's shots going in, but he looks extremely confident.
Overall, I have no worries about this team when fully healthy. But a big injury occurs, or even if Moore goes down for a month, then you will have to play some awful player for too many minutes. Thats when I worry. Thats when I start to wonder if they should make a deal now as opposed to waiting
In an optimists world, Hill would have been a spot starter in certain situations this year and a 21-27 mpg quality defender regardless. Diallo would have taken another small step and given you 10-14mpg so that the other three bigs could not put too many miles on their legs. He would also let you feel okay when a big had to miss a week with an ankle injury.
Also, I have not liked how often they have played Frank Jackson on the ball as a point guard. To me, he needs to be off the ball and going downhill all the time. He shouldn't be bringing it up trying to get the team into their offense. Maybe its just a preseason experiment, but I don't like it.
The positives: Jrue looks EVEN BETTER than last postseason. I have seen a top 15 player. Randle is a beast when he puts his head down and goes to the bucket and Niko isn't hitting his 3's but has so many creative ways to score. When he does start hitting, look out. Also, not only are Miller's shots going in, but he looks extremely confident.
Overall, I have no worries about this team when fully healthy. But a big injury occurs, or even if Moore goes down for a month, then you will have to play some awful player for too many minutes. Thats when I worry. Thats when I start to wonder if they should make a deal now as opposed to waiting
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:06 am to Crewz
I'd gladly welcome Bazemore today.
Send them Solo and Diallo, and go get either Okafor back or Corey Brewer.
Send them Solo and Diallo, and go get either Okafor back or Corey Brewer.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:06 am to Fun Bunch
- AD and Jrue need to bring it every night.
- Randle will be a nice spark off the bench but will struggle with turnovers if Gentry wants him handling the ball
-Solomon Hill is still hot garbage
- Randle will be a nice spark off the bench but will struggle with turnovers if Gentry wants him handling the ball
-Solomon Hill is still hot garbage
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:10 am to TeddyPadillac
They could do the following trade today if they wanted:
Solo, Ajinca, Diallo and a protected first for Baze and Dedmon
I get not wanting to do it because a Barnes or a Porter or maybe a Middleton could be there if everything breaks right down the line. But getting two guys who can play for three non players is so hard to pass up
Solo, Ajinca, Diallo and a protected first for Baze and Dedmon
I get not wanting to do it because a Barnes or a Porter or maybe a Middleton could be there if everything breaks right down the line. But getting two guys who can play for three non players is so hard to pass up
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:18 am to Crewz
Is that the best trade available to us 'today'?
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:21 am to Crewz
they should absolutely do that.
I would think it would be easier to trade someone Bazemore than Solo. Only have to wait 60 days to use him in a multi player trade, and you'd have Dedmon's expiring.
Are they really holding out for the chance at Barnes/Porter/Middleton? Why would this deal hinder that chance?
I would think it would be easier to trade someone Bazemore than Solo. Only have to wait 60 days to use him in a multi player trade, and you'd have Dedmon's expiring.
Are they really holding out for the chance at Barnes/Porter/Middleton? Why would this deal hinder that chance?
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:21 am to Pelefraan 1
By far. Nothing else is really on the table besides small little edges things
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:22 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Why would this deal hinder that chance?
Giving up the pick would probably hinder it.
But getting rid of deadweight for players that can play is a move you probably have to make in a "make or break" type of season.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:23 am to Fun Bunch
I don't think there's a pick being exchanged in this trade. We are saving Atlanta a ton of money by doing it, both this year and next, $6M this year and $6M next year.
This post was edited on 10/11/18 at 10:25 am
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:27 am to TeddyPadillac
No, Atlanta won't do it without the first. They don't care about saving a little bit of money for one season in which they don't plan on going after a big FA anyway. The only way they do it is for a pick .... which is why it hasn't been done.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:37 am to Crewz
If they want our 1st, then I want Bembry, or I want their 2nd round pick. Atlanta has their own 1st, which will be top 3, they have Cleveland's (top 10 protected), the Mavs 1st, and they have the Hornets 2nd, and another 2nd from either Minny or LAL.
They have zero interest in winning right now.
I'd be hesitant to trade that 1st today for simply Bazemore, while getting rid of Solo, but Solo looks terrible, and we can't have his $12M eating up space the next 2 years. I don't see the point of holding onto it just for a chance at Porter/Barnes/whatever. Other teams want those guys, and have better assets than us, even if we had our 1st.
They have zero interest in winning right now.
I'd be hesitant to trade that 1st today for simply Bazemore, while getting rid of Solo, but Solo looks terrible, and we can't have his $12M eating up space the next 2 years. I don't see the point of holding onto it just for a chance at Porter/Barnes/whatever. Other teams want those guys, and have better assets than us, even if we had our 1st.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:44 am to TeddyPadillac
Thats awesome that you want some sweeteners. So does Dell. But when Atlanta comes back and says, "Nope, thats the deal." - do you say yes or do you go into the season with what you have and hope they change the deal in a few months or that something else comes available that you like more?
Dell has decided on the latter, and I get it. But the more I watch Solo play, the more tempting it is for me to make the deal.
Dell has decided on the latter, and I get it. But the more I watch Solo play, the more tempting it is for me to make the deal.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:46 am to Fun Bunch
I think the biggest nugget to hold on to is that this will be the healthiest team we have started the season with in years. Hopefully that is enough to keep us away from our traditional terrible starts
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:52 am to Fun Bunch
I mentioned this in the others thread. But the team looked very flat and uninspired last night. Hopefully it was just bc its a preseason game.
Randle looked solid on offense but overall lacked effort. Poor effort on the glass and some lazy passing. However I'm not too worried about him for the season because if there's one thing I've heard about him, its that Randle is a passionate player.
Niko's 3's aren't falling but he's still scoring like MM said. He's looked great & I think he'll be better this year than last.
I'm worried about Solo. But that's no surprise. I have very low expectations and would be frustrated if he plays more than 5-10 mpg.
Darius looking real aggressive from 3. 10 for 13 from 3 in 2 games. 6.5 shots 3PT shot per game. That's been one of the knocks on him since he was drafted, not putting up enough 3 pointers. We need that.
Diallo is a glorified hype man, his biggest contribution is energy (which we do need). We just cannot play him very long. Jahlil & Diallo are the same age and Jahlil is far away a better player.
Speaking of Jahlil, I actually think he will be a really solid contributor this season. He'll add some needed scoring to the bench unit. I'm excited to watch him.
FJ is not a PG. Right now, he is a high-energy scoring guard. But I think FJ will be a decent contributor this year. Really excited about his athleticism, competitiveness, & fearlessness.
My biggest concern even over the SF position, is PG. At least at SF we can stick Moore, Miller, maybe Niko or AD. I am very nervous about Payton. Only starter with a negative plus/minus in every preseason game (-10 against CHI, -6 against ATL, -13 against NYK, -11 against MIA). While one stat doesn't tell the full story, watching him last night certainly doesn't inspire confidence either. His man got past him consistently on defense and the offense just doesn't move smoothly with him either.
Randle looked solid on offense but overall lacked effort. Poor effort on the glass and some lazy passing. However I'm not too worried about him for the season because if there's one thing I've heard about him, its that Randle is a passionate player.
Niko's 3's aren't falling but he's still scoring like MM said. He's looked great & I think he'll be better this year than last.
I'm worried about Solo. But that's no surprise. I have very low expectations and would be frustrated if he plays more than 5-10 mpg.
Darius looking real aggressive from 3. 10 for 13 from 3 in 2 games. 6.5 shots 3PT shot per game. That's been one of the knocks on him since he was drafted, not putting up enough 3 pointers. We need that.
Diallo is a glorified hype man, his biggest contribution is energy (which we do need). We just cannot play him very long. Jahlil & Diallo are the same age and Jahlil is far away a better player.
Speaking of Jahlil, I actually think he will be a really solid contributor this season. He'll add some needed scoring to the bench unit. I'm excited to watch him.
FJ is not a PG. Right now, he is a high-energy scoring guard. But I think FJ will be a decent contributor this year. Really excited about his athleticism, competitiveness, & fearlessness.
My biggest concern even over the SF position, is PG. At least at SF we can stick Moore, Miller, maybe Niko or AD. I am very nervous about Payton. Only starter with a negative plus/minus in every preseason game (-10 against CHI, -6 against ATL, -13 against NYK, -11 against MIA). While one stat doesn't tell the full story, watching him last night certainly doesn't inspire confidence either. His man got past him consistently on defense and the offense just doesn't move smoothly with him either.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 10:55 am to Crewz
If they were adamant about that being the deal, i'd likely say no and wait.
I know Solo looks terrible, but is 29 year old Bazemore worth a 1st? I always look at our trades where we give 1st round picks away and say, what were the chances we draft a guy at our likely spot in the draft and he be as good as the guy we traded for. They answer has been not very likely almost every time, even the Asik trade.
I would be ecstatic if we drafted a player with the 20th pick and he turned into Bazemore. The likelihood of that happening is probably under 20%.
In our current situation, we are holding this pick in the hopes of using it to get a better player than Bazemore, and I just think that is extremely wishful thinking.
I know Solo looks terrible, but is 29 year old Bazemore worth a 1st? I always look at our trades where we give 1st round picks away and say, what were the chances we draft a guy at our likely spot in the draft and he be as good as the guy we traded for. They answer has been not very likely almost every time, even the Asik trade.
I would be ecstatic if we drafted a player with the 20th pick and he turned into Bazemore. The likelihood of that happening is probably under 20%.
In our current situation, we are holding this pick in the hopes of using it to get a better player than Bazemore, and I just think that is extremely wishful thinking.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 11:04 am to TeddyPadillac
Agreed Teddy. I have to think Dell & AD have had the conversation about using assets for immediate help vs waiting and making calculated moves that can actually push the needle.
Question though. Would Baze's $18 mil expiring be a trade asset next season?
Question though. Would Baze's $18 mil expiring be a trade asset next season?
Posted on 10/11/18 at 11:07 am to TeddyPadillac
My argument would be that keeping AD is worth a first.
IF I were to believe that if I don't make the trade, I get out to a poor start that makes it hard for me to get better than a 7 or 8 seed and a playoff exit... but conversely, if I do make the trade, I am in the running for home court and eventually get to the second round and get to 6 or 7 games, then I would make the trade.
Because I think AD asks for a trade in the former and re-signs in the latter scenario.
Thats what this all comes down to. And I get Bazemore and Dedmon now. A definite upgrade at THREE spots. Obviously at SF and 4th big. But also, Moore goes back to backup SG and I upgrade significantly there.
Or.... I can wait until February and hope that its a smooth transition in the middle of the year. Which its usually not. Niko struggled to work his way in. The practices down the stretch are few and far between.
Because of the AD decision looming, I would be tempted because a 3-4 game difference could mean keeping AD. It really could.
IF I were to believe that if I don't make the trade, I get out to a poor start that makes it hard for me to get better than a 7 or 8 seed and a playoff exit... but conversely, if I do make the trade, I am in the running for home court and eventually get to the second round and get to 6 or 7 games, then I would make the trade.
Because I think AD asks for a trade in the former and re-signs in the latter scenario.
Thats what this all comes down to. And I get Bazemore and Dedmon now. A definite upgrade at THREE spots. Obviously at SF and 4th big. But also, Moore goes back to backup SG and I upgrade significantly there.
Or.... I can wait until February and hope that its a smooth transition in the middle of the year. Which its usually not. Niko struggled to work his way in. The practices down the stretch are few and far between.
Because of the AD decision looming, I would be tempted because a 3-4 game difference could mean keeping AD. It really could.
Posted on 10/11/18 at 11:18 am to Crewz
quote:
I would be tempted because a 3-4 game difference could mean keeping AD. It really could.
100% agree. This is do or die time.
If the Pels aren't competitive and AT least in a 6-7 game 2nd round series, he is gone, at least in his mind.
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