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Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021
Posted by death valley driver on 8/21/20 at 8:42 am162
quote:
I’m saving the best for last, though, because I do think there is one trade in particular that makes a ton of sense, and it connects again to that 2013 draft. Besides the shocking Bennett pick, the other highlight of that night was the beginning of The Process, when Sixers GM Sam Hinkie sent Jrue Holiday to New Orleans for the sixth overall pick and a future first.
Could we see a repeat?
No, I mean literally – could we see Holiday get traded for two firsts again on draft night?
The angles line up. He’s on the last year of his deal before he can opt out and become a free agent in 2021, which would leave the Pelicans with nothing. New Orleans itself fell a bit short of its ambitious goals for this season and, in a West that figures to be absolutely loaded next year, would probably be better off taking a step back to build around Zion Williamson and Brandon Ingram.
Meanwhile, the Pelicans might struggle to find other suitors who can give them enough compensation for their star. Denver was probably rumored to be the closest this February, but the Nuggets will be picking in the 20s for the foreseeable future, capping the value of any draft equity they could offer. Meanwhile, most of the other contenders already spent their draft capital in trades last summer.
Enter Golden State. What if the Warriors made New Orleans a Godfather offer: We’ll give you the second overall pick this year and the Minnesota pick in 2021. But there’s a catch: You have to take Wiggins and Looney, and send us Holiday and J.J. Redick while you’re at it.
New Orleans walks away with two high firsts but has three years of paying Wiggins on unfriendly terms ($100 million. Egads). The Pelicans can probably handle that – his number comes off their books just as Williamson would be hitting his rookie extension.
And the Pelicans walk away with an ugly contract, yes, but also a lower payroll and two very valuable draft picks. Reuniting the Ball brothers probably isn’t the cards, but if Edwards is the guy at number 2, he fits very well with Ingram and Williamson.
DRIVEMAN OUT
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Galactic Inquisitor on 8/21/20 at 8:45 am to death valley driver
quote:
And the Pelicans walk away with an ugly contract, yes
You can't overstate how ugly that contract is.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by touchdownjeebus on 8/21/20 at 8:47 am to death valley driver
Unless the NYKs are gonna take Wiggins, frick no.
If we can flip that pick and Wiggins for a lot of the Knicks’ draft capital and some more friendly contracts, sure.
If we can flip that pick and Wiggins for a lot of the Knicks’ draft capital and some more friendly contracts, sure.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Fun Bunch on 8/21/20 at 8:48 am to death valley driver
Don’t love it but yeah it’s definitely something that we need to at least consider.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Galactic Inquisitor on 8/21/20 at 8:49 am to Fun Bunch
Just so we're all clear:
$29,542,010
$31,579,390
$33,616,770
16.4 PER (14.7 career)
0.2 VORP
33.2 3P%
-1.9 +/-
Everything in his portfolio screams league average, but his salary screams All-Star....
$29,542,010
$31,579,390
$33,616,770
16.4 PER (14.7 career)
0.2 VORP
33.2 3P%
-1.9 +/-
Everything in his portfolio screams league average, but his salary screams All-Star....
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by CP3forMVP on 8/21/20 at 8:50 am to Galactic Inquisitor
I would much rather see if we could get a team like the Knicks to take Lonzo for #8.
Get rid of our 2 best vets, one of which is our best 3 point shooter and bench scorer? Oh an also take on a terrible contract for the next 3 years and get a trash big man lol. yeah nah. I mean if the goal is to lose more games but get a higher pick then yeah sure
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Fun Bunch on 8/21/20 at 8:53 am to Galactic Inquisitor
I know what the numbers are. Wiggins is a better player than people give him credit for, but his contract is totally outrageous for his level of production. Insane.
I'm just saying that Golden State WILL be coming after Jrue, people just need to get used to the rumors.
FWIW, I am NOT arguing for this, only the reality that there will be some level of discussion and GSW could sweeten the pot enough or get another team involved for us to consider it.
I'm just saying that Golden State WILL be coming after Jrue, people just need to get used to the rumors.
FWIW, I am NOT arguing for this, only the reality that there will be some level of discussion and GSW could sweeten the pot enough or get another team involved for us to consider it.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by TigerinATL on 8/21/20 at 8:56 am to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
You can't overstate how ugly that contract is.
I don't want to take on Wiggins' contract, I don't even want to keep Lonzo because I think he'll get over paid. But the Pels are technically at the beginning of a rebuild. If they didn't already have 2 cornerstones in place we'd be itching for a deal where you get #2 and future 1sts for taking on a bad contract.
The problem is, how do they both pay us for our cap space and Jrue? That's going to need a lot of future picks.
Golden state is going for embiid. He fits with them and is more tradable than Jrue. They’re a mess over there.
I really don’t want to lose our vets especially when they are still producing at a high level. We need a mixture of both. I want to see a competent coach. Look at Memphis, Heats, Celtics, Raptors and Suns, they are a mixture of both vets and young guys. None of these draft guys this year are generational players.
I really don’t want to lose our vets especially when they are still producing at a high level. We need a mixture of both. I want to see a competent coach. Look at Memphis, Heats, Celtics, Raptors and Suns, they are a mixture of both vets and young guys. None of these draft guys this year are generational players.
This post was edited on 8/21 at 8:58 am
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re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Soggymoss on 8/21/20 at 8:59 am to death valley driver
I'd do it in a heartbeat.
We would be able to find someone to take Wiggins into cap space without having to give up any assets
We would be able to find someone to take Wiggins into cap space without having to give up any assets
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by saints5021 on 8/21/20 at 9:06 am to Soggymoss
Knowing we will have to overpay Jrue again in a year, I am fine with sending him out. I really don't want Wiggins, but the #2 and the Minny pick are nothing to scoff at.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Soggymoss on 8/21/20 at 9:09 am to saints5021
From some things I've read, Wiggins advanced metrics had him at almost all star level, but only when playing the 2.
Those kind of stats make me believe someone like Phoenix,NYK etc will take him into cap space for the potential alone.
Those kind of stats make me believe someone like Phoenix,NYK etc will take him into cap space for the potential alone.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by bugafor6 on 8/21/20 at 9:14 am to saints5021
Id absolutely take it. Wiggins is better than anything coming off our bench and you’d have the chance to add a guy like Deni who is a perfect fit for the team. Then that Min pick will be valuable next year
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by OrganizedChaos on 8/21/20 at 9:20 am to Soggymoss
So a 3 team deal where someone else takes Wiggins 90 mil contract for free and the Warriors pay assets for jrue?
I would def do that. I highly doubt Phoenix would want him. I could only see Knicks, Hornets, and maybe the Pistons who might take Wiggins for free.
Of course if your the GM of those teams you should be asking something for that contract.
I would def do that. I highly doubt Phoenix would want him. I could only see Knicks, Hornets, and maybe the Pistons who might take Wiggins for free.
Of course if your the GM of those teams you should be asking something for that contract.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Baron on 8/21/20 at 9:22 am to saints5021
quote:
Minny pick are nothing to scoff at.
You’re right that there is a chance that the Minny pick turns into the best asset, but I think people have been spoiled for years after that Nets future picks debacle helped Boston so much. If you look at the trading of future 1st’s history, that Nets/Celtics trade was definitely the exception and not the rule. History has clearly shown that teams play different and exceed expectations much more often than not whenever they know that their win/loss totals doesn’t affect their immediate draft future vs. whenever it does. Go look at the last trade BOS made that netted future 1sts from bad teams. A future Kings 2019 pick and Grizzlies 2020 pick turned into the 14th overall pick in each draft. Or whenever the Pels took the future Minny pick that turned into the 10th (Austin Rivers). It’s not a coincidence that the only time the T-wolves were somewhat respectable in years was in a season where they knew they were losing their pick.
Personally, I would probably end up taking some form of this trade, but my only point is to be careful not to overvalue future 1sts.
quote:Unless I'm missing something, I hate it.
Don’t love it but yeah it’s definitely something that we need to at least consider.
We trade Jrue to latch on to an even bigger contract in terms of salary and years?
#2 is fine, but greatly devalued in this draft where it's just not top heavy at all.
I'm not sure where the better deal for Jrue is out there, but I hate the idea of taking on Wiggins' contract. I know he's not as bad as many make him out to be, but I still view him/his contract as a negative value altogether.
re: Hollinger: Jrue + JJ for Wiggins, Looney, #2, Minn 2021Posted by Pelefraan 1 on 8/21/20 at 9:31 am to shel311
If Minny had have made that last year a team option for Wiggins I'd have a closer look at it
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