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xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Didn't LeBron's team win 66 games that season and possess HC advantage and the no. 1 seed the entire time?

Correct. Way better than Jordan ever did with so little help.


ThePTExperience1969
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2016
9507 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Didn't LeBron's team win 66 games that season and possess HC advantage and the no. 1 seed the entire time?


quote:

Correct.


Then why did they lose with all those advantages then?


Rep520
Arizona Fan
Member since Mar 2018
5255 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Despite that Ray Allen and Kyrie Irving saved LeBron's legacy in two Finals 


John Paxson and Steve Kerr both hit as many Finals series clinching shots for the Bulls as MJ did.

The selective logic always blows me away. When Kerr or Paxson hits the shot, you don't think it's bailing MJ out. When Allen or Kyrie hit the shot...

I never understand why it's so hard to say that LeBron and MJ are both incredible and it's a close debate as to who's best.


Boomshockalocka
Houston Fan
Clutch City
Member since Feb 2004
49185 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
They are both incredible but it is not really close. Lebron more likely to drop than he is to move up on the all time rankings.
This post was edited on 7/10 at 1:09 pm


xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Then why did they lose with all those advantages then?
Lebron lost in the later rounds so many times for the same reason Jordan failed to get past the first round so many times: he didn’t have enough help.

Literally everything you say favors Lebron.


Rep520
Arizona Fan
Member since Mar 2018
5255 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

They are both incredible but it is not really close. Lebron more likely to drop than he is to move up on the all time rankings.


I'm comfortable being on the opposite side of a debate as you.


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xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Lebron more likely to drop than he is to move up on the all time rankings.
This is true for literally everything that’s is #1.


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ThePTExperience1969
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2016
9507 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Lebron lost in the later rounds so many times for the same reason Jordan failed to get past the first round so many times: he didn’t have enough help.


But they won 66 games and secured HC advantage and the no. 1 overall seed that season, I thought LeBron had that killer instinct you keep talking about

Take your L


xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

I thought LeBron had that killer instinct you keep talking about
Nah, the “killer instinct” thing is a Jordan stan talking point that I use against them since Lebron had a killer instinct by 22, while Jordan openly admits today that he didn’t have a killer instinct until he was 26. Furthermore, Lebron has two kills (2013 Spurs, 2016 Warriors) that are bigger than anything Jordan ever faced, much less killed. Add to that that Lebron has much more of a competitive fire than Jordan, which can be seen plainly when you consider that Lebron never retired for seasons on end multiple times and has been more consistently available to his team than Jordan was in his active years.


ThePTExperience1969
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2016
9507 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Add to that that Lebron has much more of a competitive fire than Jordan


Yeah that competitive fire was totally on display in the Mavs Finals and last year's Finals game 1 OT when he shut down and didn't score a point


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xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Yeah that competitive fire was totally on display in the Mavs Finals and last year's Finals game 1 OT when he shut down and didn't score a point
Right. Retiring is more competitive.

Lebron was 25 when that happened btw. Jordan had one playoff series win at that age. Killer instinct. Competitive spirit.
This post was edited on 7/10 at 1:54 pm


ThePTExperience1969
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2016
9507 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

Lebron was 25 when that happened btw.


On a stacked superteam, HC advantage for the series, and Finals favorites with LeBron submitting a great regular season and playoff performance to that point in time

quote:

Jordan had one playoff series win at that age


Averaged 45-5-5 on 56% FG that series too


xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

On a stacked superteam
with Eric Snow, Larry Hughes, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, and Drew Gooden.
quote:

Averaged 45-5-5 on 56% FG that series too
...with Craig Ehlo guarding him.

Literally everything you say makes Lebron look better.
This post was edited on 7/10 at 2:34 pm


ThePTExperience1969
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2016
9507 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

John Paxson and Steve Kerr both hit as many Finals series clinching shots for the Bulls as MJ did.


Both occurred in game 6's with the Bulls possessing 3-2 series leads, wasn't do or die facing elimination like Kyrie and Ray Allen

quote:

When Kerr or Paxson hits the shot, you don't think it's bailing MJ out.


They'd still play a game 7 if they didn't, you think a killer like MJ's gonna lose a game 7? LOLOL

quote:

When Allen or Kyrie hit the shot...


I mean LeBron did squander the 2013 game 6 comeback he led with his late quarter turnovers that placed the Heatles in that predicament. As far as Kyrie is concerned, just further establishes how he was the closer of that team like he is generally.


ThePTExperience1969
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2016
9507 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

On a stacked superteam


quote:

with Eric Snow, Larry Hughes, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, and Drew Gooden.


Do you know how to read or recall things accurately?

Me:
quote:

Yeah that competitive fire was totally on display in the Mavs Finals and last year's Finals game 1 OT when he shut down and didn't score a point


You:
quote:

Lebron was 25 when that happened btw.


LOLOL


xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
Ok my bad, let’s go back to when they were 22.

Lebron: Finals
Jordan: no playoffs


Salamander_Wilson
Member since Jul 2015
4041 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
I actively rooted against the Bulls as a kid...

...and I still liked Jordan.

I don’t remember anyone in the 90s ever saying Jordan was a douche or a bitch or anything of the sort.

People were in awe of him...respecting him even when you hoped the Bulls didn’t win.


buckeye_vol
Ohio State Fan
Member since Jul 2014
31763 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

I don’t remember anyone in the 90s ever saying Jordan was a douche or a bitch or anything of the sort.
I think a lot of this has to do with the lack of the internet and social media which has allowed us to be able to know so many details of one’s behaviors, thoughts, etc. which limits the asymmetry of information about players that teams/players/brands were able to control.


buckeye_vol
Ohio State Fan
Member since Jul 2014
31763 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
quote:

I mean LeBron did squander the 2013 game 6 comeback he led with his late quarter turnovers that placed the Heatles in that predicament.
They were down by 12 with 10 seconds left in the third, then Lebron scored 15 points and assisted on 6 more until his first turnover in the 4th (offensive file with 3:18 remaining) as they were down by 3. And while he has 2 more turnovers in the last couple minutes, he made a crucial 3 with 20 seconds remaining to get it back within 1 possession.

So in the last 12 minutes and 10 seconds of regulation, LeBron scored 18 points, shooting 63.6% from the field (68.2% EFG%), 75% from the line, with a TS% of 70.5%, had 2 assists that contributed to 6 more points, accounting for 75% of the 32 points scored, plus a couple rebounds, and the team overcame a 12 point deficit. And while he has 3 turnovers, that doesn’t negate the rest of that at all.
This post was edited on 7/10 at 9:27 pm


xiv
LSU Fan
#FreeVOR
Member since Feb 2004
35361 posts

re: In depth debate on who the GOAT is. Lebron? MJ?
Awkward


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