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How much does aesthetics play into the GOAT debates?

Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:27 pm
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
162190 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:27 pm
Example - plenty of people will say Barry Sanders is the greatest RB of all time. And you could certainly make statistical arguments to place him squarely in the top 5 at worst (imo)

But I think if we're being honest a lot of it has to do with how entertaining or aesthetic his highlight reel is.

Some similar observations - Hakeem was very fun to watch and statistically you could make arguments that he is the greatest center to ever play (and again he's probably easily top 5 especially when you look at career blocks and how center focused a lot of the elite teams were during his run. He schooled guys like Shaq, Ewing, Robinson in important post season games to be certain)

I'm sure there are countless other examples you could come up with where guys are very easily top 5 or top 10 that might get elevated because they were so fun to watch (MJ certainly benefits from this and I don't think a person on the planet would argue that he is outside the top 3 at worst and most believe he is the greatest)

Curry is certainly elevating his status as well for this reason. Definitely the best 3 point shooting guy that has handles that we've ever seen. You could make an argument that some might be better 3 point shooters but they don't typically score in other ways and don't have the ball skills he has.

Anyway I think most would agree here. Who are some other greats in your opinion that benefit from being so fun to watch?

Oddly what prompted this thread was I was watching a highlight video of sweetness and his running style was very fun to watch.
Posted by Bunk Moreland
Member since Dec 2010
52923 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:29 pm to
This was big in the tennis GOAT debates for a while with Federer.
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
162190 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:31 pm to
I haven't kept up with tennis the last decade but I could definitely see that translating to that sport as much as any other
Posted by Caymus
Houston
Member since Jul 2015
1134 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:31 pm to
Look good, feel good, play good...
Posted by KosmoCramer
Member since Dec 2007
76449 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:35 pm to
Brady makes plays but not with style like Mahomes or Rodgers.

And Brady is the first and away clear GOAT. He is 2nd on the GOAT of GOATs only behind Gretzky.


But to answer your question, some people have the opinion that Ozzie Smith is the GOAT shortstop of all time, and he doesn't even deserve to be in the Hall of Fame.
This post was edited on 8/16/22 at 2:37 pm
Posted by MusclesofBrussels
Member since Dec 2015
4447 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:39 pm to
quote:

And Brady is the first and away clear GOAT. He is 2nd on the GOAT of GOATs only behind Gretzky.


Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
162190 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:40 pm to
quote:


But to answer your question, some people have the opinion that Ozzie Smith is the GOAT shortstop of all time, and he doesn't even deserve to be in the Hall of Fame.


Baseball is probably one of the sports where there might only be a handful of examples. And it's almost exclusively related to infield play. The rest of it is so statistical there isn't much you can do to elevate yourself.
Posted by McVick
Member since Jan 2011
4466 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:45 pm to
Posted by wildtigercat93
Member since Jul 2011
112195 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:48 pm to
quote:

. You could make an argument that some might be better 3 point shooters


You could?
Posted by KosmoCramer
Member since Dec 2007
76449 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:51 pm to
quote:




Why the mate?
Posted by PeteRose
Hall of Fame
Member since Aug 2014
16820 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 2:54 pm to
In general people are biased in choosing GOAT players. People generally pick players that they saw playing as GOAT because people want to be a part of GOAT time period. No one ever want to say "The 3rd best player of all time played when I was watching the game".
Posted by StrongOffer
Member since Sep 2020
4283 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 3:08 pm to
quote:

Barry Sanders is the greatest RB of all time
Jim Brown was better.

quote:

Hakeem was very fun to watch
Almost nobody puts him ahead of Shaq which is contrary to your point

quote:

Curry is certainly elevating his status as well for this reason.
Nobody puts Curry ahead of Lebron, Durant, Giannis, Kobe from this era.

All great players are fun to watch. Except Harden.
Posted by diremustang
Member since Oct 2017
2287 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 3:19 pm to
quote:

Kobe
did you mean to post the best possible example for the position you seem to be trying to counter?
Posted by mizzoubuckeyeiowa
Member since Nov 2015
35423 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 3:30 pm to
quote:


And Brady is the first and away clear GOAT. He is 2nd on the GOAT of GOATs only behind Gretzky.


So you're saying Brady was so TRANSCENDENT, so otherwordly, so MUCH better than then entire league combined...

That he was bigger a GOAT than Ruth? Did Brady play bothways as well?

Or MJ?
This post was edited on 8/16/22 at 3:31 pm
Posted by ManBearTiger
BRLA
Member since Jun 2007
21827 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 10:13 pm to
quote:

Ruth


Lol

Good lord
Posted by Boomshockalocka
Member since Feb 2004
59687 posts
Posted on 8/16/22 at 10:20 pm to
In todays NBA it is Devin booker for sure. # have never been really close to elite but many will put them in their top 10 or whatever because of how it looks. Kobe benefits from this too.
Posted by mizzoubuckeyeiowa
Member since Nov 2015
35423 posts
Posted on 8/17/22 at 4:59 am to
quote:

quote:
Ruth


Lol

Good lord


Huh? Are you high?

Ruth was the best pitcher in the AL and then out hit the entire AL.

Did Tom Brady play linebacker too?

Ruth could've entered the HOF as a pitcher alone.
This post was edited on 8/17/22 at 5:00 am
Posted by SportsGuyNOLA
New Orleans, LA
Member since May 2014
16930 posts
Posted on 8/17/22 at 8:53 am to
quote:

And Brady is the first and away clear GOAT. He is 2nd on the GOAT of GOATs only behind Gretzky.


You misspelled Babe Ruth
Posted by lsupride87
Member since Dec 2007
94825 posts
Posted on 8/17/22 at 8:56 am to
Ruth- statistically dominant of his peers and titles

MJ- statistically dominant of his peers and titles

Wayne- statistically dominant of his peers and titles

Brady-statistically in line or slightly behind some peers with titles

One of those isn’t the same

The first three are the GOAT of GOATS because their statistical dominance stands on its own, and the titles are the cherry on top. For Brady, his stats are good, but he has three peers with as good or better stats. His titles aren’t his cherry, they are his bowl of ice cream
This post was edited on 8/17/22 at 9:02 am
Posted by lsupride87
Member since Dec 2007
94825 posts
Posted on 8/17/22 at 9:09 am to
quote:

Lol Good lord
Ruth had a 183 WAR and 1.16 OPS

He is a fricking unicorn man
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