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Too many of you are getting caught up in 4-3 vs. 3-4 - its not that important (long)

Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:03 am
Posted by Tigerstark
Parts unknown
Member since Aug 2011
5972 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:03 am
Yes, there are many defensive gurus who believe that the odd man front is currently best against the spread offenses (mainly in that it gets just a bit more speed on the field), but there are still a good many successful 4 man fronts in todays game.

Whether you are running a 4-3 or 3-4, there are several things which are very important which we are currently struggling with -

1. Everyone must know their role/assignment, and be able to read their keys to achieve their assignment. We are struggling here big time. Simple motions confuse us. Crossing receivers, underneath routes, rubs, picks - if you can't do these simple things, you could have 13 players on the field and still not play good defense.

2. You have to be multiple - you have to show the offense different looks, make them look, confuse them. The moment the offense knows what you are doing, you are done. We are already having problems with this before we "simplified" the defense. Playing almost exclusively man is a bad recipe. MSU threw all over us. Auburn had several huge plays which were designed to work, and could only work against man. Look at all of the best defenses and they will throw lots of different coverages around, especially with pressure.

3. Passion and commitment - with the spread offenses, every single player must be playing hard every single down. The area each defender covers can be exploited if they are not fully engaged and doing their job. All it takes is one player not focused, not going 100%, and its a big play.

I'm of the opinion that Bo has routinely struggled against some spread teams, going back to his days at LSU. I don't know if its the style his defensive communicates, how his DBs switch off receivers, the man principals, the lack of adjustments, or the offense just knowing what he's going to do. Lots of good DCs have had bad games against spread offenses, so he's not alone. But it does seem that he has less good games than bad.
Posted by 225Tyga
Member since Oct 2013
15774 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:04 am to
quote:

4-3 vs. 3-4 - its not that important


yeah it actually is


/thread
Posted by Mithridates6
Member since Oct 2019
8220 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:05 am to
Pelini is a dinosaur. He was lucky bc SEC offenses in his first time here weren't creative at all and he had Suh and Amakamura in his first few years at Nebraska. His defenses at Nebraska sucked after that, same with Youngstown State
Posted by Stevo
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2004
11362 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:09 am to
Regardless of what you think of Pelini now, he was an outstanding DC when he served under Miles. So was Chief for that matter. Carry on.
Posted by Mithridates6
Member since Oct 2019
8220 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:12 am to
He was outstanding bc no one had an ounce of creativity back then. Got gashed by Arkansas' little wildcat stuff twice that teams with much less talent than us shut down easily as well as Florida's spread. Missouri held Arkansas to 7 after the Hogs had Nutted all over Pelini's ugly face in BR with the NC game on the line
Posted by tigerMike
Chapel Hill, NC
Member since Jan 2005
839 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:13 am to
It's important in the formation but more importantly personnel.
Posted by Ace Midnight
Between sanity and madness
Member since Dec 2006
89472 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 10:29 am to
quote:

Yes, there are many defensive gurus who believe that the odd man front is currently best against the spread offenses (mainly in that it gets just a bit more speed on the field), but there are still a good many successful 4 man fronts in todays game.


It still depends on if you're committed to rushing the passer, playing more bend-but-don't-break (depending on down and distance), and so forth, but, yes - if your designated pass rusher is a 6'4, 235 pounder who runs like a deer, he is going to be more capable of defending that back or TE if that's his read than a 6'6, 270 pound DE will be, all other things being equal.
Posted by tenderfoot tigah
Red Stick
Member since Sep 2004
10381 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 11:24 am to
OLB vs DE is the biggest difference. OLBs line up wider than DE stop all of this crap that's destroying us outside.

We are fine between the tackles.
Posted by YouKnowIt
New Orleans
Member since Jun 2005
453 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 11:37 am to
The number of linemen in a front doesn't matter. It's about understanding and executing gap responsibility.

For whatever reason -- this defense has failed to adjust from a two gap scheme to a more one gap and attack type scheme.
Posted by oreeg
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
5276 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 12:07 pm to
quote:

225Tyga


Enjoy your downvotes
Posted by Tiger Dominance
Bossier City, LA
Member since Oct 2007
487 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 12:17 pm to
I would rather see a 5-5 defense.
Posted by wwxww
Dulac, LA
Member since Dec 2019
589 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 12:24 pm to
We already have a 4-3 3-4 thread...you could have contributed to the information already given.
Posted by tilthatday
New Orleans
Member since Mar 2009
863 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 12:24 pm to
Granted, If you don’t know your assignment, it doesn’t matter what alignment you're in. That being said, there are real differences between the 4-3 and the 3-4. Not having a traditional off-season or preseason to make the change may have hurt us more than anticipated. There was also a change in coaching style and that may take time to sink in. None of this explains the disorganized, disinterested team we see on the field. The players don’t know their assignments and there is no passion. That’s on the staff. Entirely up to them to motivate the players, get them to buy in. If that had happened, the talent we have would take care of the rest of your criticisms/observations.
Posted by 225Tyga
Member since Oct 2013
15774 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 1:21 pm to
quote:

oreeg



Enjoy yours as well
Posted by ZydecoTigah
walker LA
Member since Sep 2010
447 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 3:10 pm to
It's not just the scheme, nor the missed assignments, it's the overly aggressive D cannot do to modern offenses what it did years ago! Even Aranda was struggling last year with all the wrinkles thrown at him. We need to look forward not backward in the search for our defense plans.
Posted by lsufball19
Franklin, TN
Member since Sep 2008
64461 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 3:16 pm to
quote:

Got gashed by Arkansas' little wildcat stuff twice that teams with much less talent than us shut down easily as well as Florida's spread.

Arkansas won the West in 2006 and averaged almost 300 rushing yards a game in 2007 along with 38 ppg. Not many teams shut them down. And no one shut down that Tebow and Florida offense. Not sure what you were watching, but I watched Florida win a national title in 2006 and 2008 and fall a game short of another national title in 2009.
quote:

Missouri held Arkansas to 7 after the Hogs had Nutted all over Pelini's ugly face in BR with the NC game on the line

And Pelini, meanwhile, shut down #1 OSU in the national title game. Despite his complete shitshow of a defense this year, it is intellectually dishonest to say he sucked his first stint here. Quite the opposite actually, which is why Nebraska hired him in the first place.
Posted by Mithridates6
Member since Oct 2019
8220 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 3:31 pm to
Tennessee and Mizzou snuffed out Arkansas' HS offense easily in 2007. Pelini was a stubborn idiot who didn't learn anything. Arkansas lost to every other good team they played that year. Pelini just sucked and played base defense against them. Auburn held Teblow and Florida to 17 points in 2017. 2007 Capital One bowl: Wisconsin farm boys snuff out the Arky HS offense
quote:

And Pelini, meanwhile, shut down #1 OSU in the national title game. Despite his complete shitshow of a defense this year, it is intellectually dishonest to say he sucked his first stint here. Quite the opposite actually, which is why Nebraska hired him in the first place.

Whoa, you're saying he shut down a Todd Boeckman-led Jim Tressel offense?
This post was edited on 11/3/20 at 3:36 pm
Posted by madddoggydawg
Metairie
Member since Jun 2013
6567 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 6:12 pm to
quote:

Got gashed by Arkansas' little wildcat stuff twice that teams with much less talent than us shut down easily
They had two 1,000 yard rushers on one team
Posted by Mithridates6
Member since Oct 2019
8220 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 6:20 pm to
Chavis' worst defense at Tennessee in 2007 stuffed that high school shite when they played Arkansas like two weeks before LSU did. Pelini could have watched film of that and learned... Kinda like with Washington's wins over Leach's WSU teams
Posted by madddoggydawg
Metairie
Member since Jun 2013
6567 posts
Posted on 11/3/20 at 6:21 pm to
NFL teams started running that high school shite after Arkansas did...and still do!
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