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Posted on 4/27/20 at 4:36 pm to Inadvertent Whistle
quote:
I'm not typically a Kobe defender, but I'll submit that he did not quit, but was certainly trying to prove a point. Probably still a bitch move at best.
I don't know what Kobe was doing vs Phx, but it wasn't trying to win. Same thing in the 2008 Finals Game 6 series clincher vs the Celts.
The Suns, he just didn't participate in the second half. The Celts, he took a few shots as his team was getting drilled by 40.
It's one reason I can't see Kobe as top ten all time. Those two games are glaring vs the other greats.
Heck, I openly criticize LeBron for his Dallas series in 2011 and he had a triple double in Game 5 and 21 in Game 6.
Kobe scored 23 in the first half vs the Suns, 1 in the second on 3 shots. Vs the Celts, he was 3-11 with 1 assist and 2 rebounds.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 4:51 pm to PhillyFan1994
quote:
2017: Lost to the greatest Non-Olympic basketball team of all-time. Kyrie didn't show up until Game 3. Love didn't show up at all. LeBron still averaged a triple double
1. The Bulls are the goat.
1a. LeBron James lacks the ability to guard the best player in the game, Kevin Durant. Kevin Durant torches LBJ, while LBJ puts up empty stats
1b. Game 3 LeBron can’t stop the game clinching 30 footer in his grill.
2017 is on LeBron, Because The Kingslayer took it from him.
This post was edited on 4/27/20 at 4:52 pm
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:00 pm to PhillyFan1994
LeBron averaged 17 PPG in that Dallas series. Pathetic.
Now go look at MJ’s Finals averages.
Now go look at MJ’s Finals averages.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:01 pm to PhillyFan1994
quote:
2014: Lost to Big 3 Spurs + Kawhi in a series where he torched Kawhi on offense but DWade and Bosh were old and hurt. Averaged 28 per game and shot over 50% from the field and from 3.
28 a game is not exactly Herculean
Also, how are you going to pretend Wade and Bosh were "old" when they lost to the frickign Spurs. Tim Duncan was 38, Manu was 36
Bosh and Lebron were more or less in their prime, and was was only 32.
Thats some weak shite.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:29 pm to PhillyFan1994
Imagine only having 3 championships while spending a decade playing with Wade, Bosh, Kryrie, and Love 
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:31 pm to PhillyFan1994
2013 he had lost that one - Ray Allen bailed his arse out.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:38 pm to Boomshockalocka
quote:
Golden state was not historically great When they played the cavs. That version of the team was a far cry from the one that won 73.
No team is 100% healthy by the Finals. What they did in the regular season speaks for itself.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:39 pm to 1ranter1
quote:
Imagine only having 3 championships while spending a decade playing with Wade, Bosh, Kryrie, and Love
I know. I'm sure he cries himself to sleep at night over it.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:45 pm to Tiger Ugly
quote:
2013 he had lost that one - Ray Allen bailed his arse out.
People say that, but LeBron had 16 points in the 4th to lead the Heat back from a double digit deficit. Between scoring and assists, he was responsible for 22 of the Heat's 30 points that quarter.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 5:55 pm to PhillyFan1994
quote:
2014: Lost to Big 3 Spurs + Kawhi in a series where he torched Kawhi on offense but DWade and Bosh were old and hurt. Averaged 28 per game and shot over 50% from the field and from 3.
Series was tied 1-1 going to Miami for 2 games, chokes away game 3, submits empty stats in games 4 and 5 as the Spurs proceeded to blow them TF out to win the title, let's not forget the Heat were 2x defending champs entering this series with LeBron still in his prime
quote:
2015: Went to Finals with Matthew Dellevadova as his starting PG and Timofey Mozgov (Who?) as his second best player. Averaged nearly a 30 point triple double and won two games in the hardest arena to win in Basketball (Oracle) before falling to MVP Steph and Co.
Choked away a winnable game 4 up 2-1 in his house, lost the duel to Steph in critical game 5, then proceeded to submit inefficient stats in the clinching game 6 with IGGY guarding him
quote:
2018: Lost again to the greatest Non-Olympic team of all time. No Kyrie. Love still a no show. Had 50 in Game 1 but JR Smith was off his meds. Averaged 34 Points 10 assists and 8.5 Rebounds per game. =
Basically stopped playing that OT and his pettiness and negativity spread throughout the team as the Dubs proceeded to blow them out 4 straight, no one put a gun to Bron's head and tell him to melt down after JR's melt down but here we are
Clown take, bro
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:00 pm to BhamDore
quote:
Jordan was responsible for the loss in the ECF in 89. He disappeared in the pivotal game 5. He only scored 18 pts in 46 minutes. (10 pts off free throws) only had 8 attempts in in 46 mins. He quit on his team.
No he didn't, the Jordan Rules was predicated on getting the ball out of MJ's hands and he was surrounded by 3-4 Pistons (all elite defenders btw) that entire game per Sam Smith's Jordan Rules, it was what it was but I'll never accuse him on "quitting" on his team there, that's patently dumb.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:01 pm to Goldrush25
Oh this year we are gonna have teams at full health. I cannot wait.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:01 pm to BhamDore
quote:
It was similar to when Kobe quit in that Phoenix series that everyone magically forgets when they talk about their killer mentality.
Kobe did quit that game, no getting around it, but he used that as fuel and motivation to improve himself in the coming years and he did by leading the Lake Show to 3 straight Finals and 2 straight championships
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:01 pm to BhamDore
This is the point that is lost on people drunk on nostalgia.
Kobe and Jordan are two of the best in NBA history. However, they couldn't carry teams the way James has.
Given help, Jordan did what he did. Given help, Kobe did what he did. Given help, James did what he did.
Without the help, Jordan and Kobe's performances were subpar compared to James. LeBron was dragging damn near literal garbage into the NBA finals.
I'd argue his greatest performance was against Golden State when Love and Irving were hurt. Dude balled out and averaged a triple double for the series by himself.
Kobe and Jordan are two of the best in NBA history. However, they couldn't carry teams the way James has.
Given help, Jordan did what he did. Given help, Kobe did what he did. Given help, James did what he did.
Without the help, Jordan and Kobe's performances were subpar compared to James. LeBron was dragging damn near literal garbage into the NBA finals.
I'd argue his greatest performance was against Golden State when Love and Irving were hurt. Dude balled out and averaged a triple double for the series by himself.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:18 pm to dcrews
quote:
However, they couldn't carry teams the way James has.
To Finals losses when his teams were stacked?
quote:
Given help, James did what he did.
Lose a bunch of Finals while flanked with stars?
quote:
Without the help, Jordan and Kobe's performances were subpar compared to James.
One could argue both Jordan and Kobe basically created the help they ultimately received by pushing their teammates as hard as they did, the only time one could argue LeBron did the same was during his first stint in Cleveland when they started winning 60+ plus games in back to back years and Mo Williams became an all-star. The rest of the time his teams did what they did because he was flanked by stars and they played in a weaker conference.
quote:
LeBron was dragging damn near literal garbage into the NBA finals.
Once, his first stint in Cleveland
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:26 pm to PhillyFan1994
Lebron's fans are the biggest excuse making people in the sports world. When he wins, he makes everyone around him better. When he loses, he has no help.
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:27 pm to ThePTExperience1969
quote:
One could argue both Jordan and Kobe basically created the help they ultimately received by pushing their teammates as hard as they did
Ah, I love hearing this one. So Kobe and MJ are alchemists, they're taking ordinary NBA players and turning them into All-Stars?
It's not like Pau Gasol made an all-star team before he even got to the Lakers. It was all Kobe.
quote:
LeBron was dragging damn near literal garbage into the NBA finals.
Once, his first stint in Cleveland
And how many times did those other two do it? I remember Kobe having a 34 win season in the middle of his prime.
So basically it was up to Lebron to create a top 50 all-time NBA player, and the fact that he didn't reflects poorly on him?
This post was edited on 4/27/20 at 6:32 pm
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:29 pm to PhillyFan1994
quote:
PhillyFan1994
Posted on 4/27/20 at 6:32 pm to Goldrush25
quote:
Ah, I love hearing this one. So Kobe and MJ are alchemists, they're taking ordinary NBA players and turning them into All-Stars?
That's not what I'm saying but they created the help they ultimately received in winning titles, The Last Dance and multiple accounts over the years clearly corroborate this
quote:
It's not like Pau Gasol made an all-star team before he even got to the Lakers. It was all Kobe.
While going nowhere with the Grizzlies, his game and notoriety elevated when he played for the Lakers
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