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re: Siap, McShay and Hoge discuss Mettenberger...
Posted on 4/24/14 at 9:13 am to goldenbadger08
Posted on 4/24/14 at 9:13 am to goldenbadger08
quote:The point you are missing is that people on this board are not paid by ESPN to stir up ratings.
Yeah I'm sure y'all know so much more than these guys
Noone gives a shite if McShay or Hoge are right, wrong, or indifferent. They are never held accountable. The are just looking to create controversy and ratings.
Having a different opinion doesn't make someone an idiot.
This post was edited on 4/24/14 at 9:13 am
Posted on 4/24/14 at 9:23 am to Mahootney
I just find it funny how angry/annoyed mcshay seems to get while hoge is just complimenting mett saying he is more nfl ready than manziel in one certain area.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 9:43 am to TheriotAF
quote:
Posted by Message TheriotAF Siap, McShay and Hoge discuss Mettenberger... I just find it funny how angry/annoyed mcshay seems to get while hoge is just complimenting mett saying he is more nfl ready than manziel in one certain area.
Lol! McShay was pissed. I wish that segment was longer so both Hoge and McShay could argue their pov. I know that Mett isn't very mobile but he has the tools to be a successful QB. Bridgewater was my favorite going into the draft but it now appears that he might not have a strong enough arm or his hands are to small to properly push the ball down the field. Bottom line, you have to be able to make almost all the throws or the NFL defenses will expose you. Mett can do that. And if he can learn to read the defenses effectively, it will makeup for his lack of mobility.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 9:51 am to toughcrittercrumb
The downplay of Bridgewater only started after his pro day. Also, with two extra weeks until the draft the media needs a QB to downgrade as well as push into the 1st Rd [Mett,Savage & Garoppolo] all fit this bill.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 10:23 am to JBeam
Clowney isnt all he's cracked up to be, definitely not a #1 overall.
Manziel is the wild card, could be great could be a bust.
Mett and Bortles are IMO the two best nfl prospects.
Manziel is the wild card, could be great could be a bust.
Mett and Bortles are IMO the two best nfl prospects.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 10:31 am to JBeam
Tom Brady isn't considered to be very mobile.
He still gets some positive press.
He still gets some positive press.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 10:36 am to Mahootney
Because comparing Mett to arguably the greatest QB in NFL history makes an ounce of sense.
Mcshay actually made a good point in that video. OBJ and Juice saved Metts career. I'd also add in the fact that having an explosive running game helped him out greatly.
Mcshay actually made a good point in that video. OBJ and Juice saved Metts career. I'd also add in the fact that having an explosive running game helped him out greatly.
This post was edited on 4/24/14 at 10:39 am
Posted on 4/24/14 at 10:54 am to JBeam
NFL Network > ESPN. Mett wouldn't be getting so much publicity if he was going to go in the 4th round. None of those mock drafts ever hold up anyway.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 12:18 pm to goldenbadger08
quote:
Yeah I'm sure y'all know so much more than these guys.. what idiots.
You do know all these draft player rankings and mocks are just speculation? All of the "expert draft analysis" have completely different lists. Some have Mett as a top 5 QB. Some have him a top 3 QB. Some have him between 7-10. Its all speculation.
Nobody is a "draft expert". If someone was, they wouldnt have nearly as many screw ups on their lists as they do, and most likely would be a GM of a team.
Mel Kiper compared JaMarcus to John Elway. He also said Ricky Stanzi would end up being the best QB in the 2011 draft, and that Mike Williams (USC) would be a Hall of Famer WR and was the best player in the 2005 draft. McShay said Blaine Gabbert would be a better pro player than Cam Newton and should be the #1 QB taken. He also had Mark Sanchez ahead of Stafford.
Point is, nobody knows who will do what at the next level. Its easy to predict that a guy like Andrew Luck is going to go #1 overall and be great at the next level. And that Clowney is an elite prospect. Those are givens. But when there isnt a clear cut top QB prospect, its tough. These "experts" opinion on Mett vary from a late 1st round to a 4th round pick. Thats not really telling me anything that I dont already know.
Its all a crapshoot. Am I saying I know more than these guys do? Nope. But they dont know that much more than some people that pay attention to this kinda stuff. Its pretty much a 50/50 guess.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 12:20 pm to KG5989
quote:
Yet he grades Bortles, Bridgewater, and Manziel top 20 picks? Ok... If it was grades, 2 of those 3 wouldnt be in the 1st. And Bortles would be borderline 1st /2nd round.
Bortles is going to be a big bust. I can't see how any sane person has him going in the first or second round.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 12:28 pm to Datbayoubengal
Well I dont see how any sane person could have Manziel or Bridgewater going in the 1st round either. None of these guys are 1st round NFL QBs.
Out of the top 3 QBs, Bortles translates the best to the NFL. Is he gonna be great? No. But I think hes a safer pick than Manziel and will be better than Bridgewater.
Thats the thing with this QB draft class though. All these "experts" act like Bortles, Bridgewater, and Manziel are the clear cut top 3 QBs. But based on what I have seen these guys do in college and at combine / pro day, I cant confidently say those guys will be better in the NFL than QBs like Mett, McCarron, Carr, Murray, etc.
Manziel is the most electrifying, but comes with a lot of questions about how he translates to the NFL. Bortles has the size, arm, tape, attitude, etc to be an NFL QB, but played against bad competition in college so his tape could be a bit misleading. And Bridgewater was the top guy a few months ago, but was bad at his pro day and he doesnt have the potential to be a great NFL QB. Could be a solid QB, like an Andy Dalton, but he wont be an elite NFL QB.
In 5 years from now, any of those guys could end up being the best QB in this class, and the top 3 guys could be out of the league. Mett and Carr have as high a ceiling as any QB in this draft class.
Out of the top 3 QBs, Bortles translates the best to the NFL. Is he gonna be great? No. But I think hes a safer pick than Manziel and will be better than Bridgewater.
Thats the thing with this QB draft class though. All these "experts" act like Bortles, Bridgewater, and Manziel are the clear cut top 3 QBs. But based on what I have seen these guys do in college and at combine / pro day, I cant confidently say those guys will be better in the NFL than QBs like Mett, McCarron, Carr, Murray, etc.
Manziel is the most electrifying, but comes with a lot of questions about how he translates to the NFL. Bortles has the size, arm, tape, attitude, etc to be an NFL QB, but played against bad competition in college so his tape could be a bit misleading. And Bridgewater was the top guy a few months ago, but was bad at his pro day and he doesnt have the potential to be a great NFL QB. Could be a solid QB, like an Andy Dalton, but he wont be an elite NFL QB.
In 5 years from now, any of those guys could end up being the best QB in this class, and the top 3 guys could be out of the league. Mett and Carr have as high a ceiling as any QB in this draft class.
This post was edited on 4/24/14 at 12:49 pm
Posted on 4/24/14 at 12:37 pm to KG5989
quote:Disagree, Bridgewater is the most pro ready of the top QBs in this draft. He's had a bad stretch since his pro day. I actually think him sliding to the back half of the 1st Rd might be a good thing for him.
Well I dont see how any sane person could have Manziel or Bridgewater going in the 1st round either. None of these guys are 1st round NFL QBs.
Out of the top 3 QBs, Bortles translates the best to the NFL. Is he gonna be great? No. But I think hes a safer pick than Manziel and will be better than Bridgewater.
quote:I like Aaron Murray & Derek Carr out of all the guys in this draft.
Thats the thing with this QB draft class though. All these "experts" act like Bortles, Bridgewater, and Manziel are the clear cut top 3 QBs. But based on what I have seen these guys do in college and at combine / pro day, I cant confidently say those guys will be better in the NFL than QBs like Mett, McCarron, Carr, etc.
Manziel is the most electrifying, but comes with a lot of questions about how he translates to the NFL. Bortles has the size, arm, tape, attitude, etc to be an NFL QB, but played against bad competition in college so his tape could be a bit misleading. And Bridgewater was the top guy a few months ago, but was bad at his pro day and he doesnt have the potential to be a great NFL QB. Could be a solid QB, like an Andy Dalton, but he wont be an elite NFL QB.
In 5 years from now, any of those guys could end up being the best QB in this class, and the top 3 guys could be out of the league. Mett and Carr have as high a ceiling as any QB in this draft class.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 12:48 pm to JBeam
quote:
Disagree, Bridgewater is the most pro ready of the top QBs in this draft. He's had a bad stretch since his pro day. I actually think him sliding to the back half of the 1st Rd might be a good thing for him.
I agree he is the most ready to come in and play immediately and has a good football IQ. But, potential wise he is limited. I just dont see him becoming an elite QB at the next level. Bortles isnt as polished as Bridgewater, but he has more talent and potential.
I think Bridgewater is the safest pick out of the top 3 QBs. But I dont think he will ever be an elite QB. Similar to Andy Dalton IMO. He can run a system and is a good leader that makes solid decisions. But has athletic and physical limitations. I see Bridgewater as a solid NFL QB. Not great, but not horrible either.
But Bortles has more potential to be a better NFL QB, and still isnt a huge risk. And is a really good athlete. He most likely will be a solid NFL QB as well, but has more talent and potential to play at a higher level than Bridgewater. And doesnt have the physical and athletic limitations that Bridgewater does. He reminds me of a poor mans Big Ben.
Manziel is your typical boom or bust guy. If he can do what he did at TAMU in the NFL, he will be great. If not, hes going to struggle.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:05 pm to KG5989
quote:
You do know all these draft player rankings and mocks are just speculation? All of the "expert draft analysis" have completely different lists. Some have Mett as a top 5 QB. Some have him a top 3 QB. Some have him between 7-10. Its all speculation.
Exactly. No one could ever accurately predict the draft. Every year guys go higher than projected, while others guys fall. Sometimes a team really wants to take a particular QB in the first round. If they aren't available they might pick up a tackle, and wait to see if value pick QB is available in another round.
Sometimes a guy might be the best overall rated guy at his position, but his style doesn't fit the scheme which allows him to get passed over for another guy.
Some teams aren't will to take risks on guys with various red flags.
Most drafts predictions try and look at team needs versus best player available, and then each pick falls into order as different guys come off the board. The draft is fluid, so a team comes in with an unexpected pick, and it could drastically change what other teams choose to do.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:09 pm to JBeam
quote:Brady is a system QB.
Because comparing Mett to arguably the greatest QB in NFL history makes an ounce of sense.
I'm not saying he isn't good, but sign me up for arguing against him as the greatest in NFL history.
Plus, they are both pocket passers.... does that not count as an ounce?
Would he not do well in a similar system?
Every year you hear discussion about how NFL QBs need to be pocket passers and throw from the pocket in order to succeed. But come draft time, athletic ability and college highlight reels cloud everyone's judgement.
It's like we all have to learn the same lesson over and over again.
Mett is the traditional stereotype for an NFL pocket passer, and he gets labeled 4th Round.
Manziel gets shite one by LSU twice, scrambles around and throws up prayers vs Bama, and boom... #1 overall option.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:17 pm to KG5989
quote:
Nobody is a "draft expert". If someone was, they wouldnt have nearly as many screw ups on their lists as they do, and most likely would be a GM of a team
John Hollinger is the perfect example of this, although the NBA equivalent.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:19 pm to KG5989
quote:
McShay said Blaine Gabbert would be a better pro player than Cam Newton and should be the #1 QB taken. He also had Mark Sanchez ahead of Stafford.
Seriously, McShay is terrible at evaluating talent and his history bears that out.
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:20 pm to Mahootney
I don't think you can compare the two coming out of college. Brady was a QB who was benched numerous times for the prototypical QB Drew Henson. Time and time again he had to come in late in the game and engineer drives for UM to win. I'd say he was asked to do more.
Again, I'll mention the fact that OBJ,Juice & a explosive running game helped ZM8 out a ton this year.
Again, I'll mention the fact that OBJ,Juice & a explosive running game helped ZM8 out a ton this year.
quote:Boom or bust type of talent. Similar to the likes of Vince Young. His size isn't coming into question this year because of the success of QBs like Brees & Wilson.
Mett is the traditional stereotype for an NFL pocket passer, and he gets labeled 4th Round.
Manziel gets shite one by LSU twice, scrambles around and throws up prayers vs Bama, and boom... #1 overall option.
This post was edited on 4/24/14 at 1:22 pm
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:21 pm to Mahootney
quote:
Brady is a system QB.
And what system would that be?
Hes gone through countless offensive schemes and coaches and succeeded in them all
So what system is the driving force behind his success?
And if you say Belicheck you must think Joe Montana is a scrub
This post was edited on 4/24/14 at 1:22 pm
Posted on 4/24/14 at 1:22 pm to KG5989
quote:
Manziel is your typical boom or bust guy. If he can do what he did at TAMU in the NFL, he will be great. If not, hes going to struggle.
I love that in most of the pieces on ESPN about Manziel, videos of LSU litter his negatives.
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