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Message
re: Mortgage Amount 2-2.5x Annual Income
Posted on 4/10/22 at 10:33 am to MrJimBeam
Posted on 4/10/22 at 10:33 am to MrJimBeam
1. Finding a home in a 2.5 income range is very hard right now. Although rates are going up, supply is not going to get better anytime soon. Those with 2-3% interest rates are not going to be jumping out of those homes and into something with a 5% or higher rate.
2. Not all incomes are created equal as someone had mentioned. A combined family income of $150 with 2 as opposed to a family paying bills and saving for college are 2 different animals, so the formula can't be applied equally.
3. Assuming you get a fixed interest rate, this rule has been around forever and created when interest rates were above 7%. The math is substantially different if applied at 2.25%.
4. If you happen to already be collecting a pension or receiving substantial dividends. This is my case, my retirement check covers my mortgage and I don't use a single dollar of my income to pay for my home.
2. Not all incomes are created equal as someone had mentioned. A combined family income of $150 with 2 as opposed to a family paying bills and saving for college are 2 different animals, so the formula can't be applied equally.
3. Assuming you get a fixed interest rate, this rule has been around forever and created when interest rates were above 7%. The math is substantially different if applied at 2.25%.
4. If you happen to already be collecting a pension or receiving substantial dividends. This is my case, my retirement check covers my mortgage and I don't use a single dollar of my income to pay for my home.
Posted on 4/10/22 at 10:45 am to oneg8rh8r
quote:
The math is substantially different if applied at 2.25%.
We might not see rates that low again in our lifetime unless the economy collapses.
Posted on 4/10/22 at 11:38 am to OleVaught14
I work with a lot of millennials, many are purchasing homes for the first time. Yes they are buying more expensive homes, but they have their reasons. The biggest is inflation.
Quality neighborhoods cost more than ever before, and they also believe they will be making more money in 5-10 years. Some are also counting on their student debt being forgiven.
"It will be tough at the start, but its a 30 year mortgagee and we will be making more in the future"
Quality neighborhoods cost more than ever before, and they also believe they will be making more money in 5-10 years. Some are also counting on their student debt being forgiven.
"It will be tough at the start, but its a 30 year mortgagee and we will be making more in the future"
Posted on 4/10/22 at 11:45 am to OleVaught14
Whatever value enables you to still live below your means…rule of thumb that matters most.
Posted on 4/10/22 at 12:09 pm to OleVaught14
Too many other variables to just compare mortgage amount to income. At 6% on a 400,000 loan you’re looking at 2,400 a month but drop that to 2.5% and it’s about 1,580. Property tax varies greatly from state to state along with insurance and things like HOA fees. I’d start with monthly note (including all of the above) vs monthly net income minus other debt
Posted on 4/10/22 at 1:42 pm to Paul Allen
quote:
But everyone is different. For a family of 4 making 130,000 a year, maybe a 325,000-350,000 house would be the max amount. But I could also see a couple with no kids making 130k with no debt easily affording a 475k-500k house. There are too many variables sometimes.
The irony is it’s the folks with kids who need the 500k house, not the couple with no kids.
This just illustrates how fricking hard it is to have a middle class family in today’s society… and it’s only gonna get harder.
Posted on 4/10/22 at 1:49 pm to lowspark12
My mortgage to annual income ratio is a little less than 1
Posted on 4/10/22 at 2:55 pm to white perch
I’ve owned my house for 7 years. If I was looking now, no way I could afford my house since I would have to pay double what I paid.
Posted on 4/10/22 at 4:26 pm to OleVaught14
When I bought my house, the. banks were willing to lend me far more than what I considered reasonable. Instead, I stuck with the range that you mention in your post and I ammdamn glad I did. I was able to afford that house payment and live comfortably. I have even been able to add to my principal payments and now am able to pay it off early if I choose.
Posted on 4/10/22 at 4:45 pm to Spankum
Yeah what banks are willing to lend and what I feel comfortable spending are two very different amounts.
Another recent issue (that we currently have) is we bought our first home knowing we'd bring kids home to it. But we didn't count on COVID / us now working from home. We went from buying a house to grow into to one that's already to small now that we work from home.
Another recent issue (that we currently have) is we bought our first home knowing we'd bring kids home to it. But we didn't count on COVID / us now working from home. We went from buying a house to grow into to one that's already to small now that we work from home.
Posted on 4/11/22 at 12:48 pm to OleVaught14
We are at 1.5x with a 15year mortgage. I couldn't imagine going higher, as it would cut into other things we like to do as well as our current savings plan.
Posted on 4/11/22 at 1:03 pm to OleVaught14
Like many here have said, too many factors to count.
We elected to skip the traditional starter home. That said, we're working on a deal right now that is 2.5-2.75, and I admit it's a bit out of my comfort zone, but it comes with living in a high cost of living area. Generally speaking, our incomes will continue to trend upwards, making it easier and dropping that number over the next decade.
We elected to skip the traditional starter home. That said, we're working on a deal right now that is 2.5-2.75, and I admit it's a bit out of my comfort zone, but it comes with living in a high cost of living area. Generally speaking, our incomes will continue to trend upwards, making it easier and dropping that number over the next decade.
Posted on 4/11/22 at 1:08 pm to OleVaught14
Is this 2.5x gross?
I’m at 2.52 my gross with mortgage, PMI, and escrow. This doesn’t include my wife’s income.
But I have a kid and another on the way and their daycare will slightly exceed the housing payment.
I’m at 2.52 my gross with mortgage, PMI, and escrow. This doesn’t include my wife’s income.
But I have a kid and another on the way and their daycare will slightly exceed the housing payment.
This post was edited on 4/11/22 at 1:13 pm
Posted on 4/11/22 at 2:36 pm to CorkRockingham
We are still in our first home. We gross more than we paid for our home. But as others have said and I have mentioned on this board before, raising children in the Greater New Orleans area is expensive as frick.
We pay $40,000 a year for a nanny.
$18,500 next year for PK4. Only going up from there.
We also pay more to student loans each month than we do for our mortgage.
We pay $40,000 a year for a nanny.
$18,500 next year for PK4. Only going up from there.
We also pay more to student loans each month than we do for our mortgage.
Posted on 4/11/22 at 2:51 pm to TheWiz
quote:
We might not see rates that low again in our lifetime unless the economy collapses.
Never underestimate the stupidity and near sightedness of the fed. Give it a few years and the 10yr will be back near 2.00-2.25%
Posted on 4/11/22 at 3:02 pm to OleVaught14
This isnt really a good way to do it without accounting for other revolving debt.
I.E. take 2 young couples both making $100k/yr
Couple A has no debt at all
Couple B has 2 car payments, revolving c.c debt and student loans totaling about $1.5k/mo
Couple A can afford way more house than couple B
All about total debt to income monthly, banks use 36-43% DTI to come up with your mortgage you can 'afford'
IMO, if you can keep thing at 25% or lower, it's most ideal in terms of being able to enjoy other things and build wealth. The people who go out and get a $2500 mortgage with $1500 monthly recurring other debt and bring in $6.5k a month after tax are under some serious stress. IF you just have that mortgage and no other debt, same couple bringing in $6.5k a month after tax have a bit more room to breathe, although it's still not an ideal scenario, $4k to work with is a lot better than $2.5k.
I.E. take 2 young couples both making $100k/yr
Couple A has no debt at all
Couple B has 2 car payments, revolving c.c debt and student loans totaling about $1.5k/mo
Couple A can afford way more house than couple B
All about total debt to income monthly, banks use 36-43% DTI to come up with your mortgage you can 'afford'
IMO, if you can keep thing at 25% or lower, it's most ideal in terms of being able to enjoy other things and build wealth. The people who go out and get a $2500 mortgage with $1500 monthly recurring other debt and bring in $6.5k a month after tax are under some serious stress. IF you just have that mortgage and no other debt, same couple bringing in $6.5k a month after tax have a bit more room to breathe, although it's still not an ideal scenario, $4k to work with is a lot better than $2.5k.
This post was edited on 4/11/22 at 3:07 pm
Posted on 4/11/22 at 3:38 pm to OleVaught14
3 to 4x could work with 2.5 to 3.0 interest. Not with 5 or 6, IMHO
Posted on 4/12/22 at 11:55 am to OleVaught14
It depends on interest rates. But it is and will always be a good rule of thumb to follow really. We bought at 2x our income. It’s at about 1.5x our income now. But still not planning on moving for quite a while!
Posted on 4/12/22 at 11:58 am to HarveyBanger
It’s really the mortgage amount. Because that will be your debt to income ratio and be what’s hitting you in payments.
Posted on 4/12/22 at 11:59 am to fallguy_1978
That’s because if you ask the average person they have know clue what the rule of thumb is! So they aren’t calculating it.
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