re: Wheel of Time TV, Full Trailer Oct 27, show premieres Nov 19

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What network is producing this series? Is it just as epic and engrossing as ASOIAF? (I'm not familiar with this book series)

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Amazon Prime.

It is a 14 book series. It is definitely Epic fantasy, but it is not like ASOIAF.

It WAS the biggest fantasy series in the world for many years, George RR Martin for instance credits Robert Jordan for helping him early on and they use quotes from Robert Jordan on the early ASOIAF books to sell them. It was a much bigger deal until GOT was greenlit.

It is not the same as ASOIAF at all. It is far less sexual, violent and "realistic", as it were, and much more high fantasy. Magic system, creatures, an evil force that is a threat to the world.

It is a very realized world, complex in a lot of ways, but much more innocent than ASOIAF and slowly fades to...not innocent.

There is also a middle stretch in the books that is...not great.

I still love it though.

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But the guess is 10 million an episode on average.

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Damn. That bodes well for production value though, which is going to make or break this series in terms of bringing in non-WoT fans.

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how they treat the characters inner monologue

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Agreed. definitely the biggest challenge for this particular series

I’ve started crossroads of twilight. I’ve got a book or two in between some of the series, but I’ve reading WOT pretty steadily all year. Hoping to finish it all before Rhythm of War launches.

Very much looking forward to the show. Really hope they nail it.

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how they treat the characters inner monologue

Agreed. definitely the biggest challenge for this particular series

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I wouldn't worry about that much at all.

I would wonder how the frick they're going to juggle 4-5 major storylines that cross multiple books before any resolution.

I would wonder how they're going to juggle such a large cast that is separate for so much of the story with multiple characters missing and/or presumed dead for multiple books.

I would wonder how accurately they want to adapt the sexual politics that pervade so much of the novels in a sort of chaste sense. In high fantasy novels of the early 90s, men and women could distrust each other and squabble and fight but then love takes over and everyone gets married and it's alright. Is that possible in 2020?

Also, will the inevitable pushback on the budgets affect the inevitable desire to overcut from Jordan's bloated storylines?

I don't see a lot of what you are saying to be a big deal if handled well, and I'm pretty optimistic about that as of now. The press releases, casting and production hires, etc. all seem to be saying the right things.


SPOILERS

Looking at Eye of the World - Most of the main characters are together, there is a "split" of the group at Shadar Logoth, but then you just really follow two groups before they come back together at the end at the eye. Same thing in Book 2, Split up to go to White Tower / Travel with the horn - Rand has a brief side - quest, then they all converge at Falms, Book 3 convergence at the Stone of Tear. Its really not till Book 4 or so that the main characters really start taking divergent main story-lines for multiple books, and even then you have enough a critical mass of main characters in each storyline that it should work well.

I think GoT, particularly in the middle seasons, showed that a wide ranging cast can be put on the screen well. A lot of the characters diverge but come back together, throughout the series. The only place this becomes a problem is in the book 9 / 10 area where I would imagine they trim some stories significantly, the whole search for Faile can largely be cut out and resolved in a few scenes, the political machinations in Andor, the same way, the march from Salidar to the White tower, etc. That sort of thing should help the convergence happen much quicker. Plus with lessons from the failings of later seasons of GoT, I think they can adjust the timing of some of these scenes to make the pacing more in line with today's TV tastes.

They have said that Rand and the Three Wives will still play out, they may focus more on the relationship of the women to balance out. I wouldn't be surprised if they just bailed on the whole Gawyn and Egwene thing, The Moiraine and Thom thing sort of comes out of nowhere so that doesn't have much focus. I am curious to see how much they focus on Nyn and Lan - but the relationships aren't a big part of the focus for me. I'm sure they will pick a couple to focus on that work the best or are the most interesting for tv.


They have a really big budget from most reports, but it is inevitable that its going to be trimmed, which isn't a huge problem because it is bloated in many ways, particularly around Books 9 / 10. But also instead of seeing them stop in 4 villages, you will only see the 2 where the most important events transpired, or they can combine events in separate villages. Some storylines will be significantly shortened or removed (I am 100% fine with the whole Luc / Slayer thing for example), but that is the case for any adaptation and given that the showrunner is a fan, I feel like on the whole it will be a worthy and enjoyable vision for the show.

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I think GoT, particularly in the middle seasons, showed that a wide ranging cast can be put on the screen well. A lot of the characters diverge but come back together, throughout the series.

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I see this sentiment a lot, but I wonder just how easily the success of GOT can be recreated. It seems a little like magical handwaving to say "just do what GOT did" when it was, for most of its tenure, collectively believed to be one of the most ambitious and innovative shows in the history of television.

And, no matter how essential to the story, it was clear that GOT was a less enjoyable television show without the gravitas of characters like Ned and Tywin. It was very apparent during the last season watching the conflicts play out between weak characters often played by weak actors - the sense of oh shite, this is really all we have left?

Rosamund Pike was cast as Moirane. Do we think Wheel of Time the tv show will be as enjoyable to watch if she disappears for a season or two or permanently?

And if anecdotally the romances weren't important to you as a reader, I would counter with the anecdote that to my mother (not the standard fantasy reader in any way) they were probably the key thing that kept her invested over a decade of books. Perrin-Faile and Lan-Nynaeve are two of her favorite romances from any media.

But moreso than the romance is the positioning of Female Intellectuals against Roguish Male warriors and the explicit desire of some of the male characters to subvert and erase the influence of those women. That is what I struggle to see being popularly accepted in pop culture generally but specifically in the WOT writer's room.

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It seems a little like magical handwaving to say "just do what GOT did" when it was, for most of its tenure, collectively believed to be one of the most ambitious and innovative shows in the history of television

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That just depends on if the underlying story of a GOT is the best the genre has to offer or if the two underlying literary works are comparable in quality, i don't see a good argument for assuming a tv show with a similar budget can't recreate that magic - especially given that they even have more of a roadmap by taking lessons from GoT itself.

As far as the casting concerns, I'd contend that it was much more bad writing in GoT after they lost the books to fall back on. We still had characters like Jamie, Tyrion, Jon Snow and many others that were favorites in the series - its just that many of them were terribly written in the latter part of the series. Ned was gone after season 1 and the show was still quite good for several seasons after that.

I'm definitely assuming that the younger main character actors they have gotten will be decent if not good, but that is based on the quality of the other hires like post production companies, etc. I've recognized some of the minor characters in roles before and it seems they have a good eye for talent. So it is an unknown but I am optimistic on that front.

I think in this world, both females AND males in this world are very sexist. You would look at two scenes and cut to a group of men saying "oh those women and their gossip" then you'd cut to women's circle and they would say "you just can't trust men and their gossip". With Nyn and Lan, Nyn bosses him around in public while we are told that off the screen in private / he is the boss. With the wide range of powerful female characters, i feel like there is plenty within the story to highlight both sexes while staying true to the story

What really gives me some confidence is that Brandon Sanderson has been a consultant on some scripts thus far and has come out saying there are certainly some necessary changes but thus far it has stayed very true to the intent of the story. Plus, the showrunner is a huge childhood fan - and when he came out and said that they were keeping in the rand and his three wives story in there, I feel like that means they aren't out to try and change the heart of the story too much. That I thought would have been the most likely thing they would change up if they planned on going in that direction.


And i'm not sitting here thinking that everything is going to be perfect, there will be changes I don't like and things i would have done differently. But it seems like they are making efforts and spending the money to do it the right way, I just hope it catches on enough to justify the budget so we see the whole story - even so, as long as we get to see the story through Duamai's Wells, I'll be happy enough.


Hopefully we still get a 2021 release date, i can't wait to start seeing promo clips and stuff.

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Halfway through the last book now. Should finish this week. It’s been quite a trek and it’s sad that it’s almost over. Looking forward to reading this thread with spoilers now tho . Do y’all recommend the prequel book? Was planning on reading after Memory of Light.

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Its pretty short and really just shows some of the events you have already read about as characters telling stories of that time. If you've come this far might as well haha

I think most people now believe that the show will incorporate elements of New Spring, given things that are emerging from production, comments from actors, some of the casting, etc.