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Message
Single payer healthcare and school loan reform cannot be separated
Posted on 5/8/17 at 12:58 pm
Posted on 5/8/17 at 12:58 pm
If you are going to institute a single payer plan based on european nations, that means reducing pay by nearly 80k/year for physicians, which is what doctors make across the sea and over our northern border
LINK
Can you imagine how huge the collapse in people wishing to be doctors would be if school loan amounts remained the same, but pay decreased by that much per year? It would be awful. You would have to pass two laws at the same time. One that is single payer, and the other that somehow brings down med school costs.
quote:
The average family physician in the United States earns $207,000, according to the Medscape Physician Compensation Report. General practitioners in Britain, which has a single-payer system, earn an average pay of around $130,000. The gaps in pay for specialists are even bigger.
LINK
Can you imagine how huge the collapse in people wishing to be doctors would be if school loan amounts remained the same, but pay decreased by that much per year? It would be awful. You would have to pass two laws at the same time. One that is single payer, and the other that somehow brings down med school costs.
16
Posted on 5/8/17 at 12:59 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:
You would have to pass two laws at the same time. One that is single payer, and the other that somehow brings down med school costs.
Serious question. When has a new law ever reduced costs in anything?
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:00 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
Plus, no more deep private company pockets for med mal attorneys to dig into
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:01 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
The lesser talked about aspect of healthcare reform.
Professional salaries are what they are due in large part to the loan burden.
You want smart people to still aspire to be doctors, surgeons, etc, so you have to make it worth their while.
Cutting salaries and maintaining 150-300-400k (depending on school and vocation) burdens is a non starter.
Professional salaries are what they are due in large part to the loan burden.
You want smart people to still aspire to be doctors, surgeons, etc, so you have to make it worth their while.
Cutting salaries and maintaining 150-300-400k (depending on school and vocation) burdens is a non starter.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:02 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
I wonder if that $130K is adjusted for the cost of living difference between England and the US?
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:02 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:It also means a 40hr work week at that pay rate.
If you are going to institute a single payer plan based on european nations, that means reducing pay by nearly 80k/year for physicians, which is what doctors make across the sea and over our northern border
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:04 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
Surely to reduce the cost of med school you just bust up the AMA who don't allow massively qualified people to train year on year. Increase supply.
This seems too simple. I know much of the cost of med school is the cost of the course so it can't just be reduced that simply, but cheaper schools, cheaper doctors, cheaper healthcare?
This seems too simple. I know much of the cost of med school is the cost of the course so it can't just be reduced that simply, but cheaper schools, cheaper doctors, cheaper healthcare?
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:04 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:Make the MD a five-year undergraduate degree like in Europe easy peasy
You would have to pass two laws at the same time. One that is single payer, and the other that somehow brings down med school costs.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:05 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
While healthcare costs have been rising the last few decades, doctors' pay is basically stagnant. Adminstration for the red tape is the increase in cost.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:06 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
But but there were quite a few of you in the Student Loan thread saying things like "doesnt effect me" , "Why should I pay for someone else's schooling" , etc.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:06 pm to Mephistopheles
Schools aren't necessarily the limiting factor. Residencies are. What you are suggesting would require a dramatic overhaul of what it means to be a gp in this country.
It's my understanding that basic gps in Britain only have undergrad and med school. They may or may not have completed a residency.
You pretty much have to have completed some type of residency to do any sort of clinical anything here.
It's my understanding that basic gps in Britain only have undergrad and med school. They may or may not have completed a residency.
You pretty much have to have completed some type of residency to do any sort of clinical anything here.
This post was edited on 5/8/17 at 1:10 pm
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:07 pm to Iosh
I think the better option is to keep MDs what they are and expand mid level autonomy and availability
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:08 pm to MasterofTigerBait
quote:
Plus, no more deep private company pockets for med mal attorneys to dig into
I had a looong argument on Twitter with someone who kept saying this. My wife is a health insurance attorney (enrollee/provider side), she has frequently had to fight insurers breaking the law and has never even had to litigate thus far because it's always so blatant and the law always on her side, but still, to some, getting enrollees treatments they are legally entitled to makes her a snake who's just pushing prices up for everyone.
How is it different with medical issues? Surely doctors, nurses, surgeons, technicians, all have a job role, code of conduct and code of ethics. Is there a big gray area here? Is it pushing my healthcare costs up much? What's the deal?
This post was edited on 5/8/17 at 1:10 pm
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:12 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
We just import more H1B doctors.
Problem solved.
Problem solved.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:12 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
I mean if you want to do both I'm down.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:13 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:
Can you imagine how huge the collapse in people wishing to be doctors would be if school loan amounts remained the same, but pay decreased by that much per year? It would be awful.
The inverse of that is if we subsidize doctors mdical education, that will drive down medical prices and expand availability.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:16 pm to jamboybarry
quote:
quote:
You would have to pass two laws at the same time. One that is single payer, and the other that somehow brings down med school costs.
Serious question. When has a new law ever reduced costs in anything?
This guy gets it.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:19 pm to montanagator
quote:But that would require hefty tax increases as well. I don't think it would be politically popular to try to pass a law which has the middle class pay for the education of rich doctors.
I mean if you want to do both I'm down.
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:20 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
We can just let the government set doctor's wages to something that is fair.
Why are you making this more difficult than it is?
Why are you making this more difficult than it is?
Posted on 5/8/17 at 1:22 pm to Centinel
Price controls rarely work. If we set doctor pay at the rate medicare pays to providers, there'd be one hell of a shortage.
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