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re: Ending "Trump is no conservative"
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:05 am to Jjdoc
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:05 am to Jjdoc
quote:
I have given you the very definition of those variants. I challenge you to help him out and prove he doe not fall under conservatism.
Well, you're wrong and every political pundit in the country agrees. No one has accused Trump of being overly conservative. We all know he's actually pro-abortion and gay marriage, or at least he now doesn't give a shite. Largely refusing to address it under most crowds shows it. Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio didn't give a frick about that and would just say they're against those things.
1
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:05 am to DumbCollegeKid
quote:
Before I begin... Do you need him to be conservative?
The sad truth is that most followers of either ideology are sheep. They just agree with something because everyone who is supposed to be liberal/conservative says to agree with it.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:06 am to Texas Weazel
I don't like the sheep analogy because it divorces us from our nature.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:07 am to OMLandshark
quote:
And that's totally fine. I always wanted a third party candidate to win the White House, I just didn't want it to be Trump. Trump was without question the most liberal of all 17 candidates he ran against in the primaries.
Still posting opinion instead of proving me wrong.
BTW... by the very definitions of these few variants he is most certainly NOT the most liberal of the field of 17. Second being the most liberal does not equal being a liberal.
quote:
but please don't have the balls to come up to me and say he's a textbook conservative.
Please present the textbook conservative definition. Then give examples of the people that follow it. Keep in mind, step off the "textbook" and they are disqualified in your world from being a conservative. quote:
You insult my and literally the country at large's intelligence by doing that.
Are you saying the definitions of the variants I gave are wrong or that Trump isn't pushing policies that fall within those?
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:08 am to DumbCollegeKid
quote:
Before I begin... Do you need him to be conservative?
Actually no. So begin. :)
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:08 am to TigerFanInSouthland
quote:
On social issues, I think most draw the line at the tranny bathroom thing. Although, I kinda don't feel like if you are gay you shouldn't be able to adopt because you can't get pregnant from gay sex. But most would work with that. Also, the abortion aspect, I don't know a single conservative that is alright with abortion. We have got to find a way to get legal murder of children into the past. That is a huge black mark on our history to me.
Politically conservative =/= social conservative.
Stop trying to label both as "conservative". Big mistake by political parties was taking a stance on social issues.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:09 am to Jjdoc
You don't know what Conservatism is.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:09 am to Texas Weazel
quote:
Trump isn't conservative. End of thread.
Why? Because you say so?
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:10 am to Jjdoc
Trump is a jacksonian populist, he's not a conservative but he does share a lot of common values and beliefs with conservatives and is willing to work with them and them only as liberals of the current democratic party has completely abandoned the working class of America and cannot be trusted right now.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:10 am to Jjdoc
Okay. The man has stated opinions on things that gave me reservations, including healthcare and the whole transgender debacle. These are decidedly not conservative opinions. They also weren't dealbreakers.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:12 am to Jjdoc
quote:
Why? Because you say so?
No. Because his actions say so.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:15 am to OMLandshark
quote:
Well, you're wrong and every political pundit in the country agrees.
HA! Pundits? Again. I gave you the definitions.
quote:
No one has accused Trump of being overly conservative.
Trump is actually to the right of today's version of Conservative.
quote:
We all know he's actually pro-abortion and gay marriage
Do we? BTW, the whole of the GOP pretty much morphed to being ok with gay marriage. So nobody is conservative anymore right?
Pro-abortion.... yet signed an EO defunding PP LINK
Actions speak louder than words...
quote:
President Trump signed an executive order on Monday barring federal funds from organizations that promote abortion around the world, including the International Planned Parenthood Federation, in what activists say is the president’s first major pro-life action while in office.
quote:
Marco Rubio didn't give a frick about that and would just say they're against those things.
Wait... Rubio can't be a conservative. He's pro amnesty.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:17 am to Jjdoc
Rubio was bad. He was a milquetoast. He's also not a good comparison.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:17 am to SabiDojo
quote:
You don't know what Conservatism is.
We live in an enlightened age..... so... enlighten me. Were those definitions wrong?
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:18 am to Jjdoc
quote:
Still posting opinion instead of proving me wrong.
How is this an opinion when not only no one of authority and intelligence disagrees with me, but also the fact that I don't think Trump himself would disagree with me here? I think if I talked with him about this, he would say he was right leaning but that he wants to form a bridge with the left. I don't think Trump himself would say he's an actual conservative. You're fricking delusional since no one says he's conservative but idiot sheep.
quote:
BTW... by the very definitions of these few variants he is most certainly NOT the most liberal of the field of 17.
Well, name the person then instead of just saying that he wasn't the most liberal and give me reasons why he isn't more liberal than them. He was pro-abortion and gay marriage for God's sake.
quote:
Please present the textbook conservative definition.
I did in the last thread and then you had a response that left me dumbfounded in its stupidity. You said that Trump conforms to these two principles:
quote:
the conservative adheres to custom, convention, and continuity
quote:
the conservative perceives the need for prudent restraints upon power and upon human passions
If you thinks Trump conforms to these two, you are totally delusional.
quote:
Are you saying the definitions of the variants I gave are wrong or that Trump isn't pushing policies that fall within those?
Both
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:21 am to Jjdoc
Conservatism is a lifestyle. It's about morals you live by. It's what's right and wrong.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:23 am to Sentrius
quote:
Trump is a jacksonian populist,
He may have a few things in common like Laissez-faire. But that is also part of the conservative umbrella too.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:24 am to Jjdoc
He's a national treasure, so far.
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:25 am to DumbCollegeKid
quote:
The man has stated opinions on things that gave me reservations, including healthcare and the whole transgender debacle. These are decidedly not conservative opinions.
What about healthcare? Transgender .. well he just reversed what Obama did.
Actions speak louder than words right?
Posted on 2/25/17 at 12:25 am to Sentrius
More of a mercantilist.
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