re: History Topic: Did R.E. Lee Betray His Countrymen?

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You would respect him more if he had marched into his home town in Virginia and attacked his family and neighbors at the direction of the US government?

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History is the ultimate judge here, and he chose the wrong side of it.

That was my short answer... he fought for the south, which means he fought for slavery (states rights = slavery btw)

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Yes, he did betray his countrymen. When he resigned from the U.S. Army and decided to fight for the treasonous inveterates fighting to keep the evil institution of slavery he betrayed his country.


This. I have zero respect for the man.

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Why? Prior to the Civil War, the majority of Americans, not just southerners, viewed themselves as citizens of their state first and the USA second. That argument goes back to the days after Yorktown and continued on until the days of the Civil War. Were the Anti-Federalists traitors for wanting each state be seperate during the Consitutional Convention? There was also a completely legit argument that if a state could join the union, it could leave the union. Pre-Civil War America was alot like the EU and NATO today. States came together and used a common currency (even though there were multiple currencies) and common network of infastructure to advance the economies of all the members. They also used a common defense force because they were stronger that way. Did France betray Europe when it withdrew from NATO or did Greenland betray Europe when it withdrew from the EU?

ETA: Do you consider Ukrainians to be traitors to Russia? How about any of the Baltic States? Do you consider Taiwan to be full of traitor's to China? Are the leaders of South Sudan traitors to Sudan?

Bullets don't fly without supply. Lol


Sorry I always wanted to say that lmao

He was outnumbered by at least 4 to 1 and had limited resources left. His army had been on the defensive for almost 2 years.

For those that say he betrayed his countrymen when he resigned to fight for Virginia may be right by applying today's standards but in 1861 the states were still viewed as a basis of the republic that the Founding Fathers had created.

"There are certain social principles in human nature, from which we may draw the most solid conclusions with respect to the conduct of individuals and of communities. We love our families more than our neighbors; we love our neighbors more than our countrymen in general. The human affections, like solar heat, lose their intensity as they depart from the centre . . . On these principles, the attachment of the individual will be first and for ever secured by the State governments. They will be a mutual protection and support." - Alexander Hamilton, 1788

It seems this held true for Lee even though he was against the secession of Virginia.

Here's a good article on Lee.

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He and his family had a choice... they chose to represent an oppressive and inhumane pratice that was slavery. If he joined the union army, he could have brought his family with him.

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Something nobody mentions about slavery is up to the War of Northern Aggression, slavery was not illegal.

Am I? I think it's convenient to say he fought for the south because that's where his friends and family lived. Was he wrong to represent the side that oppressed humans? Was he? The obvious answer is yes...

I'm a southerner through and through, and I find it funny when anyone tries to rationalize the souths succession from the north... it was about slavery, period. I'm glad the north won, and I am ashamed of "the confederacy"...

Longstreet would be equally guilty, considering he got shot off his horse fighting his old soldiers at the battle of liberty place in 1874.

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it was about slavery, period.

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Every unbiased historian disagrees with you. Slavery was a major issue, but it was not the only issue. The Republicans came from the Whigs who came indirectly came from the Federalist. Then there were arguments over taxes, where the tranconintenal railroad should go, hell there was even a dispute over Thanksgiving vs Christmas. Then there was the argument of secession , which had been around since the days of the Articles of Confederation. The Anti-Federalists believed it and they dropped the name Anti-Federalist and adopted the name Democratic-Republicans and eventually just democrats. The Republicans came from the Whigs who came indirectly came from the Federalist.

ETA: Slavery is just the sexiest issue because it is easy to make the winning side look good. The North wasn't much better. In the north, workers worked long hours in conditions that were much more dangerous than cotton field and they worked for company currency that could only be used at company stores. The only difference is that ppl could leave if they chose to. Irish and Chinese were killed without prosecution in the norht and west just like free blacks were killed in the south without prosection (slaves usually were never executed because that was just bad business, but they did endure punishments worse than death).