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Started By
Message
just another beer trademark battle
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:13 pm
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:13 pm
Bell's vs Innovation
LINK
Bell's response:
Local bars siding with Innovation:
More Bars Drop Bell's Beer in Midst of Trademark Dispute
LINK
quote:
nnovation Brewing of Sylva, N.C. makes only about 500 barrels of beer a year, mostly sold in Jackson County. But size doesn't matter in a tough trademark dispute with the much bigger Bell's Brewery of Kalamazoo, which made more than 310,000 barrels last year. Bell's has filed a federal action against Innovation over the use of its name. Bell's says its unregistered advertising slogan "bottling innovation since 1985" could lead to confusion with customers. While the slogan is used on bumper stickers, it's not present on any of the brewery's beer packaging. Bell's also uses a slogan "inspired brewing" that's been part of the legal complaint that the company believes would be confused with Innovation Brewing's name.
Bell's response:
quote:
To our Bell’s customers and the passionate craft beer community,
We want to clear up a few things regarding our federal trademark dispute with Innovation Brewing.
1. We have not, and are not asking them to change their name or their logo. There is no lawsuit. We are not suing them. We have not asked them for money. We have not asked them to stop selling their beer. We are asking them to withdraw their federal trademark application.
2. Our concern is with their United States trademark application and potential impact on our brand, which we have spent 30 years building.
3. I personally reached out to Innovation Brewing to try to settle this matter in February, 2014 and attempted to talk about this brewer to brewer instead of involving lawyers. Our efforts were rebuffed and Innovation Brewing choose to pursue this in the legal system.
4. Over the last year, we have offered co-existence agreements and have offered to pay for their legal fees. We tried to find solutions that would work for both of us. Their response was to ask for an exorbitant amount of money and we did not feel that was a collaborative solution.
5. All offers that we proposed were rejected and after more than a year of discussion regrettably, this matter has moved to the federal trademark office.
We have the utmost respect for Innovation Brewing and we are going to keep any comments we have regarding this matter positive, honest, and collaborative. We want them to continue to brew and do the good work they’re doing under their own name.
We hope to resolve this as swiftly as the system will allow.
The passion that we have seen over the past few days is a testament to how much the beer industry means to those who support it and why we are proud to be a part of it. We always appreciate further feedback and invite everyone to continue to share their concerns with us directly: link to website.
Sincerely,
Laura S. Bell
Vice President
Bell’s Brewery, Inc.
Local bars siding with Innovation:
More Bars Drop Bell's Beer in Midst of Trademark Dispute
quote:
ASHEVILLE, N.C. -- At least three Asheville bars have stopped pouring Bell’s Brewery beer after the company engaged in a trademark dispute with Innovation Brewery based out of Sylva.
quote:
The Bywater, Buffalo Nickel and Pack’s Tavern have all dropped the beer until further notice.
“We couldn't rationalize no matter how good of a beer it is, keeping it on and selling it here,” general manager of Buffalo Nickel Brock Kehoe said.
5
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:20 pm to LoneStarTiger
How are these two slogans confusing? Seems like a pretty big stretch.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:21 pm to LoneStarTiger
Seems like a pretty rational approach by Bell's.
And we'll see how customers feel about those bars trying to make a statement of solidarity..
And we'll see how customers feel about those bars trying to make a statement of solidarity..
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:27 pm to LoneStarTiger
quote:
Bell's says its unregistered advertising slogan "bottling innovation since 1985" could lead to confusion with customers.
Well, you probably should have registered it, then.
quote:
1. We have not, and are not asking them to change their name or their logo. There is no lawsuit. We are not suing them. We have not asked them for money. We have not asked them to stop selling their beer. We are asking them to withdraw their federal trademark application.
So, because Bell's forgot to register the trademark "Innovation" then they want this new brewery to also not register it? GTFO.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:29 pm to fightin tigers
you can't see how this:
Innovation Brewing vs "Bottling innovation"
can be confusing?
Innovation Brewing vs "Bottling innovation"
can be confusing?
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:30 pm to LoneStarTiger
Gonna be great marketing for Innovation Brewing
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:33 pm to LoneStarTiger
quote:
Dear Innovation Brewing:
Welcome to the big leagues. We have money and lawyers. You don't.
Sincerely,
Bell's
That said, I don't care one way or the other about this. Not my problem and I don't get either of the breweries here.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:38 pm to LoneStarTiger
quote:
can be confusing?
I guess it could be to some people.
Would this be equivocal of Mike's Hard Lemonade suing Bud for saying their beer is brewed the "hard way?"
I never knew Bell's had the slogan, or about Innovation Brewing until this article.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:48 pm to fightin tigers
quote:
I never knew Bell's had the slogan, or about Innovation Brewing until this article.
Me either... and regardless of who is "in the right" it's always going to be good publicity for the little guy and bad publicity for the big bully.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 12:52 pm to BottomlandBrew
quote:
don't care; not my problem
:kige:
Posted on 3/12/15 at 2:00 pm to Tiger Ryno
I hope tons of bars in other states stop selling Bells and they expand operations to TX. Would be a dream!
Posted on 3/12/15 at 2:25 pm to SUB
I thought it was pretty dick by Bell's at first, until i read their response.
Seems reasonable from Bell's perspective. They just don't want Innovation brewing to later sue Bell's for using the word Innovative. Which if they were worth a shite, wouldn't need to worry about lawsuits for using a word.
IMO, and if i had access to the 2, i would be protesting Innovation Brewing, not Bell's.
Seems reasonable from Bell's perspective. They just don't want Innovation brewing to later sue Bell's for using the word Innovative. Which if they were worth a shite, wouldn't need to worry about lawsuits for using a word.
IMO, and if i had access to the 2, i would be protesting Innovation Brewing, not Bell's.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 2:39 pm to BugAC
quote:
Seems reasonable from Bell's perspective. They just don't want Innovation brewing to later sue Bell's for using the word Innovative. Which if they were worth a shite, wouldn't need to worry about lawsuits for using a word.
Sure, perfectly reasonable until some other brewery, probably Bells, files an application to trademark 'Innovation' as soon Innovation Brewing withdraws their application.
Bells had 30 years to mark that slogan and didn't. It apparently wasn't that important to them.
This post was edited on 3/12/15 at 2:40 pm
Posted on 3/12/15 at 3:18 pm to LSUGrad00
quote:
Sure, perfectly reasonable until some other brewery, probably Bells, files an application to trademark 'Innovation' as soon Innovation Brewing withdraws their application.
Bells had 30 years to mark that slogan and didn't. It apparently wasn't that important to them.
From there response it appears as though they don't want to go about trademarking shite just to own something.
Seems like they just don't want innovation trademarking the word innovation so they don't have to change one of their slogans. So what your hypothetical about Bells is doing, is in actuality what Innovation is trying to do right now.
Again, Innovation seems like they are being the dicks here.
Bell's is being ganged up on by the local NC bars and breweries because A) innovation got their side of the story out first and B) they are the bigger brewery, and for some reason big = bad.
Same thing with the Lagunitas trademark dispute. When it first came out, it appeared that Lagunitas was trying to trademark the letters IPA, but once you get both sides, they don't come out like the assholes the other side said they were.
By and large, most of the craft breweries, regardless of size, hate dealing with legal issues, and will only do so as a last resort.
ETA: The founder of Lagunitas was on the session podcast and was talking about it. I'd have to listen to it again to hear exactly what he said.
This post was edited on 3/12/15 at 3:24 pm
Posted on 3/12/15 at 3:24 pm to BugAC
quote:
Again, Innovation seems like they are being the dicks here.
Maybe, but if you named your brewery BugAC Brewing and some brewery in Michigan said, "hey Bug, we have been using the term bugac as a slogan on bumper stickers for years, so we'd appreciate it if you didn't trademark the name of your brewery so that we can keep using it." you would laugh at their faces. A lot.
And maybe they are asking for an 'exorbitant' amount of money, but if they don't pursue a trademark on the name Innovation Brewing, then they are going to have to get a new name that they will trademark and that means rebranding everything and all the costs that go along with it. Or they can just carry on and some other brewery can claim the trademark to Innovation Brewing and then they are royally fricked over for trying to be nice.
Now why they don't just say... it's cool, we'll keep the name, you can keep the slogan... I dunno. I guess Bell's is just assuming that if this place trademarks "Innovation Brewing" then they are going to turn around and send them a cease and desist letter. Now THAT would be a dick move.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 3:29 pm to LSUBoo
quote:
Now why they don't just say... it's cool, we'll keep the name, you can keep the slogan... I dunno. I guess Bell's is just assuming that if this place trademarks "Innovation Brewing" then they are going to turn around and send them a cease and desist letter. Now THAT would be a dick move.
That's what I think is Bell's fear. I agree with all of your post. But the fact that Innovation is asking for "exorbitant amounts of money" makes me think that Innovation will indeed, eventually go that route.
Again, asking for a lot of money to not file a trademark seems shady. But i also see it from Innovation's side that "hey, this is our brand, we aren't changing it, and we don't want to get screwed over in the future so if you want us to not use the name, pay up". But if that is their reasoning then they have a "price" and it has nothing to do with the naming rights. If you are sticking by your name, then no amount of $ will make you change it.
The reasonable solution would be an agreement would be made between bells and innovation that innovation will not sue bell's for trademark infringement once they copyright their name.
Posted on 3/12/15 at 3:49 pm to BugAC
quote:
"exorbitant amounts of money"
that term was used by Bell's, so take it with a grain of salt
Posted on 3/12/15 at 4:09 pm to LSUBoo
So Bells initiated a change and Innovative is wanting to go to court?
This post was edited on 3/12/15 at 4:10 pm
Posted on 3/12/15 at 4:38 pm to BugAC
quote:
hat's what I think is Bell's fear. I agree with all of your post. But the fact that Innovation is asking for "exorbitant amounts of money" makes me think that Innovation will indeed, eventually go that route
Yeah, this. And I think Bell's has pursued this in a very reasonable and fair manner.
I've been to Innovation probably 3 times, had at least a dozen (maybe more) of their beers, and have been thoroughly underwhelmed each time. It's like Courtyard without the same quality or quality guest taps. Nice little place to hang out if you are in the area and don't feel like driving in to Asheville proper in search of quality.
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