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Started By
Message
Are Pels better offensively without AD? *VERDICT IS IN*
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:12 am
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:12 am
I love AD, but it seems our offense is more balanced when he is not playing recently. Could it be that we force him the ball too much when he is in. I do understand that he is GOAT.
Just a theory that ran through my head. I don't have data to back it up or given it too much thought. Just wondering what y'all think.
Commence the shitting on me ... GO!
ETA:
After doing some homework ...
Pelicans PPG w/ AD playing 99.63
Pelicans PPG w/o AD playing 98.75
Pelicans PAPG w/ AD playing 98.59
Pelicans PAPG w/o AD playing 101.17
Pelicans Record w/ AD playing 27-22
Pelicans Record w/o AD playing 6-6
VERDICT:
Offense practically the same output whether AD plays or not ... Pelicans defense better with AD on floor. Although our offense doesn't necessarily elevate with AD on the court, we are a better team with him (no one questioned this).
I just wanted to get people discussing something other than "Fire Monty" "Trade Tyreke" and "Asik Sucks" haha
Just a theory that ran through my head. I don't have data to back it up or given it too much thought. Just wondering what y'all think.
Commence the shitting on me ... GO!
ETA:
After doing some homework ...
Pelicans PPG w/ AD playing 99.63
Pelicans PPG w/o AD playing 98.75
Pelicans PAPG w/ AD playing 98.59
Pelicans PAPG w/o AD playing 101.17
Pelicans Record w/ AD playing 27-22
Pelicans Record w/o AD playing 6-6
VERDICT:
Offense practically the same output whether AD plays or not ... Pelicans defense better with AD on floor. Although our offense doesn't necessarily elevate with AD on the court, we are a better team with him (no one questioned this).
I just wanted to get people discussing something other than "Fire Monty" "Trade Tyreke" and "Asik Sucks" haha
This post was edited on 3/5/15 at 2:57 pm
9
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:14 am to Downtown Devin Brown
No they just need to adjust to him being back.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:17 am to LosLobos111
I'm not basing this off of one game. I think back and it always seemed like we had AD with 25+, either Reke/Gordon/Jrue with around 15-20, then everyone else is like 4-10.
Like I said, didn't do homework to back this up.
Like I said, didn't do homework to back this up.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:19 am to Downtown Devin Brown
lol its actually an interesting question to bring up.. you should go look up the numbers and see
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:20 am to Downtown Devin Brown
Offense per 100 possessions with AD - 112.3 pts
Offense per 100 possessions without AD - 105.2
Offense per 100 possessions without AD - 105.2
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:26 am to Noplacelikehome
Is that for the whole season though? Because our team is more balanced now with Dante and QPon (Cole is way too new)
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:27 am to Noplacelikehome
And just think when he starts putting up 3's next year.....
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:28 am to Downtown Devin Brown
Tyreke/EG will get their 15-20 and they have ajinca/cole scoring well of the bench.
Like I said some of the newbies like cole will adjust and so will the others.
The team is in no way better offensively sans AD.
Like I said some of the newbies like cole will adjust and so will the others.
The team is in no way better offensively sans AD.
This post was edited on 3/5/15 at 11:32 am
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:32 am to Downtown Devin Brown
Since you asked to be shat on, I downvoted. But, interesting question. I do however strongly think he makes our offense much easier to run and efficient. Teams are forced to double team or bring over help which opens up more opportunities for Reke to drive or our spot up shooters to spread the floor. He also keeps offensive possessions alive (3 Offensive Rbds/game) and is a monster getting doing the floor and finishing on fast breaks.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 11:40 am to Downtown Devin Brown
Posted on 3/5/15 at 12:48 pm to Downtown Devin Brown
The offense is certainly not better with Davis off, but it probably is more balanced. That is mostly out of necessity. Outside of Davis, Evans, and Ajinca (so strange to type that), there is no one healthy right now who has a clear advantage on there defensive mark most of the time. The ball movement was necessary for the team to score. They had to generate open shots. I think some of the ugliness on offense last night was the team trying to figure out how to reincorporate Davis, and ended up deferring to him in the extreme (30 FGAs was a career high I believe).
Some of this is the guys natural inclination to defer to the star and just get out of his way. Some of it is on Monty who was clearly feeding into it. Basically every set was designed to get Davis the ball, which sounds good, but ends up with the rest of the players standing around and not getting into a rhythm. Gordon in particular was atrocious. Gordon has to figure out a way to contribute when he is not the focal point of the offense, but there is also no excuse for Monty not drawing up more than 2 (per BSS recap) plays to get him an open 3. He has been one of the best 3pt shooters in the entire league this year and not utilizing that type of weapon is just not smart on Monty's part. The low number of 3s attempted in the game shows how much the offense changed in this one.
I'm hoping this was mostly just shaking off some rust and and getting Davis back involved, because a team that shares the ball like they had been and utilizes a healthy Davis would be near-impossible to stop.
Some of this is the guys natural inclination to defer to the star and just get out of his way. Some of it is on Monty who was clearly feeding into it. Basically every set was designed to get Davis the ball, which sounds good, but ends up with the rest of the players standing around and not getting into a rhythm. Gordon in particular was atrocious. Gordon has to figure out a way to contribute when he is not the focal point of the offense, but there is also no excuse for Monty not drawing up more than 2 (per BSS recap) plays to get him an open 3. He has been one of the best 3pt shooters in the entire league this year and not utilizing that type of weapon is just not smart on Monty's part. The low number of 3s attempted in the game shows how much the offense changed in this one.
I'm hoping this was mostly just shaking off some rust and and getting Davis back involved, because a team that shares the ball like they had been and utilizes a healthy Davis would be near-impossible to stop.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 1:28 pm to Downtown Devin Brown
Take away a guy who just scored 39 points..and you are asking if an offense is better without him? 
Posted on 3/5/15 at 1:35 pm to Downtown Devin Brown
Not saying you are completely wrong but when you have a star, balance is not always what you are looking for.
It's hard to compare AD with anyone else because I think he is just a different type of player that we have seen before but some nights he is on and you just have to give him the ball.
It's hard to compare AD with anyone else because I think he is just a different type of player that we have seen before but some nights he is on and you just have to give him the ball.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 1:41 pm to Noplacelikehome
quote:
Offense per 100 possessions with AD - 112.3 pts
Offense per 100 possessions without AD - 105.2
My issue with this stat is that it only counts possessions with AD vs without AD. Which means it factors in all games that AD plays in, so that 105.2 per 100 possessions is essentially the bench. The team better be more efficient on offense with our starters than our bench.
I would like to see our team PPG when AD plays vs when he's been hurt.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 1:41 pm to UserName69
quote:
Take away a guy who just scored 39 points..and you are asking if an offense is better without him?
Carmelo Anthony
Posted on 3/5/15 at 1:46 pm to Downtown Devin Brown
Davis isn't selfish, doesn't demand the ball constantly, and is efficient. He's not melo. If the ball movement/offense is better without him then the players need to adjust and play the same way when he's on the court. As clean and balance as the offense may be when he's not there it has a ceiling, if Monty and the supporting cast can maintain that attitude and incorporate AD it could be one of the best offenses in the league
Posted on 3/5/15 at 2:00 pm to Downtown Devin Brown
Pels are better without AD period. I said this yesterday
Posted on 3/5/15 at 2:28 pm to tigerfan88
I'm not comparing AD's attitude to Melo. I was just saying that having a high scorer doesn't necessarily make you a better team.
And this is not a Anti-AD discussion by any means ... if anything, a slight dig at Monty.
And this is not a Anti-AD discussion by any means ... if anything, a slight dig at Monty.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 3:25 pm to Noplacelikehome
quote:
Offense per 100 possessions with AD - 112.3 pts
Offense per 100 possessions without AD - 105.2
Yes, but he also plays with the starters more. Obviously AD is an amazing offensive player and it certainly isn't his fault. But I feel like we often waste the shot clock because of the nature of trying to get him an open look but not actually putting the ball in his hands. With any other scorer(whether they are a guard who goes off dribble or a big man who posts) you just give them the ball. With AD its like we keep running screens hoping he'll get a little sliver of daylight because of how insanely good he is finishing.
But the problem is when we can't get it to him we don't have enough clock to run the second option. You could see it yesterday.
Posted on 3/5/15 at 3:27 pm to tigerfan88
quote:
Davis isn't selfish, doesn't demand the ball constantly, and is efficient. He's not melo. If the ball movement/offense is better without him then the players need to adjust and play the same way when he's on the court. As clean and balance as the offense may be when he's not there it has a ceiling, if Monty and the supporting cast can maintain that attitude and incorporate AD it could be one of the best offenses in the league
Exactly. This isn't on AD. He has absolutely ZERO parts of his game that wouldnt be an asset while he's in. But whether we are better with him on the court or not, the fact is we are not better with him on by near as much of a margin as we should be. Our offense without him is way too good to justify it not being absolutely ELITE with him on the court.
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