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Soft screens
Posted on 1/8/15 at 11:20 pm
Posted on 1/8/15 at 11:20 pm
anyone else feel like we don't know how to set a good pick?
I'm watching this Portland v Heat game and it's amazing how their guards drive by a screen and their guy gets stopped by the screen!
Everytime we set a non slip screen our big seems to leave it to soon or not have good positioning, or maybe it's the guards not driving close enough to the screen so it leaves too much room for the defender to easily fight over the screen, either way, they rarely seem to be effective to me.
LINK
Go to the 29 second mark And the 1:40, you'll see what I'm talking about
LINK
This is a decent example of a good one for comparison, 17 sec mark
LINK
Another decent example of a good one, 2:25 mark
I'm on my phone so it's the best examples I could find without having the tools for getting individual clips, lots of others come to mind though
I'm watching this Portland v Heat game and it's amazing how their guards drive by a screen and their guy gets stopped by the screen!
Everytime we set a non slip screen our big seems to leave it to soon or not have good positioning, or maybe it's the guards not driving close enough to the screen so it leaves too much room for the defender to easily fight over the screen, either way, they rarely seem to be effective to me.
LINK
Go to the 29 second mark And the 1:40, you'll see what I'm talking about
LINK
This is a decent example of a good one for comparison, 17 sec mark
LINK
Another decent example of a good one, 2:25 mark
I'm on my phone so it's the best examples I could find without having the tools for getting individual clips, lots of others come to mind though
2
Posted on 1/8/15 at 11:28 pm to sma19
I saw someone talking about this on another site recently, not sure if it was a blog article or fan post. Basically Asik sets picks ok, Ryno and AD can't wait to move to a position to receive the ball. The thing I've noticed is we seem to be getting far fewer moving pick fouls. Jason Smith collected those like crazy. Stiemsma too IIRC.
Posted on 1/8/15 at 11:34 pm to TigerinATL
Yeah I've noticed that too, cause it seems like most of the effective screens that bigs like Smith and Jordan, who are known for good screens, do have their hips moving into them a little more and Also take a wider stance.
So is that a coaching thing or just we don't have any players who can set a pick?
And if you could link that article I would enjoy reading it
So is that a coaching thing or just we don't have any players who can set a pick?
And if you could link that article I would enjoy reading it
Posted on 1/8/15 at 11:46 pm to sma19
Asik sets good screens. AD and Ryno are pretty weak with them.
Can't put it all on those guys though. Guards have to use them the right. A lot of times our guards go too early or don't set up their defender to run into the screen the right way.
Jrue and EG know how to use ADs screens pretty well. Tyreke is hit or miss. He over dribbles too often, going back and forth instead of just using the screen. I've seen AD getting more and more frustrated with it the past few games.
Can't put it all on those guys though. Guards have to use them the right. A lot of times our guards go too early or don't set up their defender to run into the screen the right way.
Jrue and EG know how to use ADs screens pretty well. Tyreke is hit or miss. He over dribbles too often, going back and forth instead of just using the screen. I've seen AD getting more and more frustrated with it the past few games.
Posted on 1/9/15 at 12:10 am to eyeran
quote:
Can't put it all on those guys though. Guards have to use them the right. A lot of times our guards go too early or don't set up their defender to run into the screen the right way.
Exactly, but is that a player or coach problem? I hate monty so I'm always gonna want to blame him, but I'm not always rational with my monty hate
Posted on 1/9/15 at 6:35 am to sma19
quote:
Exactly, but is that a player or coach problem? I hate monty so I'm always gonna want to blame him, but I'm not always rational with my monty hate
I'm not sure if it can all be put on Monty. Tyreke wastes alot of decent screens.
Jrue is really good at faking to the screen to freeze his defender then going the other way with it.
Posted on 1/9/15 at 6:35 am to sma19
double post.
This post was edited on 1/9/15 at 6:36 am
Posted on 1/9/15 at 7:03 am to sma19
I think they do a solid job of screening. You're just looking for the wrong thing. Most of the time they (especially AD) aren't looking to set a hard screen to stop the defender. They're just trying to reroute the defender to make him go around.
That extra second it takes to hit the defender on a screen means AD gets into his roll a second later, throwing off the timing off everything. Asik isn't a threat as a roll man, so that extra second doesn't cost him as much.
Screens don't need to be bone-jarring; they need to be effective. Which they are most of the time for us.
That extra second it takes to hit the defender on a screen means AD gets into his roll a second later, throwing off the timing off everything. Asik isn't a threat as a roll man, so that extra second doesn't cost him as much.
Screens don't need to be bone-jarring; they need to be effective. Which they are most of the time for us.
Posted on 1/9/15 at 8:13 am to eyeran
quote:
Guards have to use them the right.
I'm not the biggest Xs and Os guys so maybe you can explain this one to me. More often than not it seems like our guards will go opposite the screen and not use the block being set up for them, and it's not even some quick direction change thing. It seems to work out to get them free, but getting free by not using a block seems counter intuitive to me. Is it pretty common around the league to not use the screen that the play is designed around?
Posted on 1/9/15 at 8:21 am to sma19
quote:
And if you could link that article I would enjoy reading it
Sorry, I did some looking and couldn't find it. Like I said I can't even remember if it was a blog or a forum post.
Posted on 1/9/15 at 8:27 am to TigerinATL
quote:
Is it pretty common around the league to not use the screen that the play is designed around?
It depends how the big defends the pick and roll. If it's a switch or a show and the big is drawn out, once the guard has his man off balance the paint is wide open for a drive. If the big sags then its useless.
Posted on 1/9/15 at 9:41 am to TigerinATL
quote:Yeah, its pretty common for guards who are looking to score.
I'm not the biggest Xs and Os guys so maybe you can explain this one to me. More often than not it seems like our guards will go opposite the screen and not use the block being set up for them, and it's not even some quick direction change thing. It seems to work out to get them free, but getting free by not using a block seems counter intuitive to me. Is it pretty common around the league to not use the screen that the play is designed around?
If the defense is doing their job, somebody should be screaming which direction the pick is coming from. Guys looking to score will sometimes get defenders leaning one direction, expecting the pick, then crossover the opposite direction to get into the lane or a pullup jumper.
Tyreke can be frustrating because sometimes he'll try this twice in the same pick situation with Davis. Tries it, gets cut of. Tries again, gets cut off. Davis is frustrated and somebody ends having to take a bad shot late in the clock.
I think Gordon's the best on the team at reading when to use the screen and get to the rim, and when to make the little pocket pass to Davis for the open jumper.
This post was edited on 1/9/15 at 9:43 am
Posted on 1/9/15 at 9:44 am to eyeran
quote:
I think Gordon's the best on the team at reading when to use the screen and get to the rim, and when to make the little pocket pass to Davis for the open jumper.
+1 Gordon is a very underrated passer. Holiday has been missing Davis on a lot pf P&R opportunities.
Posted on 1/9/15 at 9:59 am to whoknows1390
quote:Yep.
+1 Gordon is a very underrated passer. Holiday has been missing Davis on a lot pf P&R opportunities.
I think part of Jrue's issue is he doesn't look to attack enough off the screen. He'll come off the screen diagonally because he's not looking to score at all, he's just looking to pass it back to Davis. He ends up taking himself out of the play. There was a play late in the Charlotte game where this really hurt us because he came off the screen diagonally and didn't have the angle to get the ball back to Davis who was wide open.
Gordon opens up the lane to pass it back because he's a threat to take it to the rim, so the big has to at least think about following him.
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