- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: NYPD cops refuse to turn and face mayor as he walks into hospital
Posted on 12/22/14 at 9:41 am to ChineseBandit58
Posted on 12/22/14 at 9:41 am to ChineseBandit58
quote:
You people need to start taking Martin Luther King's advice = Treat a person by the content of his character, not by the color of his skin.'
Present yourself as a thug = be prepared to be treated as a thug.
"content of character" <> how you dress Since you are an MLK historian, was there any other advice besides how to dress that MLK was known for?
quote:
You people need to start taking Martin Luther King's advice
2
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:06 am to mikelowery1911
quote:
I have been dressed in slacks and a polo and boat shoes and messenger bag and had the police called on me in a similar situation. The officer actually pulled his gun on me. Scariest moment of my life.
Before you try to stereotype me. Both my parents were cops. My father retired from law enforcement. I grew up with cops of all colors as my parents friends. I am not anti law enforcement.
I am speaking from life experiences. The mayor was 100% right for what he told his son.
I'd like to know the backstory on why a well dressed respectful young man would be accosted by a policeman with guns drawn. Not that I don't believe you but that is pretty far out. I am sure you filed a complaint. I certainly would have.
I don't stereotype except for behavior. If you are acting like a thug, I will expect you to be a thug until you prove differently by your actions.
I was not 'taught' respect - it was the culture I grew up in. It didn't have to be a 'lesson; for me or most of my generation - we observed how the world worked and it never occurred to us to act like spoiled two-year old brats. Respect came easily and naturally to me. With apologies to FDR = The only thing I disrespect is disrespect itself.
And I highly hate disrespect. It seems to me thee is a whole generation of young people today who are proud of their "right" to be disrespectful. To them I say 'frick you' - and the horse you rode in on.
What the mayor told his son is no different that what any father demonstrates to his children on a daily basis. The fact that he felt he had to single out this instance as a precaution to his son, must mean that he didn't trust his son to act responsibly.
The fact that the mayor would publicly highlight this 'discussion' with his son in the midst of violent riots about fictitious narratives ginned up by the race-industry is what is outrageous about his actions.
Of course nobody can argue with the inherent wisdom of his words - it is the timing and emphasis that is important.
The mayor is the titular head of the police dept. It is his duty to support his troops until there are real and factual abuses = and then he should handle the situation within the department and maybe make announcements when the problems have been solved. He certainly should not immediately side with the erroneous narrative and rumors which fuel violent riots.
I really would like to know the backstory of why policeman came after you with guns drawn when you were doing nothing suspicious.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:13 am to mmcgrath
quote:
"content of character" <> how you dress
Meh.
While certainly not locked in stone, when one wakes up in the AM, they don't just fall into their clothes and, unless they're "special", no one else is selecting their clothes for them.
When someone wakes up and spend half an hour putting on their best EMO costume, at the least, you DO know the image they WANT to present and the personality type they WANT you to think they have.
This doesn't just apply to thugs. It pretty much applies across the board. When a girl dresses super prudish, she may not actually be a prude but she most certainly is trying to present herself that way. And, of course, when she wears skirts that clear her pussy by half an inch and have no underwear on, they are trying to present the opposing image.
And, if you put on your best "Look at me, I'm a hard assed gangsta" look, don't be stunned that some folks are gonna assume you WANT them to think you're gangsta.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:26 am to mmcgrath
quote:
mmcgrath
You have no standing = inconsequential pimple
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:26 am to Scrowe
quote:
The site you linked doesn't average that. So in the grand scheme of things, it's a few isolated incidents.
I view the situation differently. Excessive violence complaints on a daily basis (many of them now corroborated with video) isn't excusable with simply saying "no big deal."
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:30 am to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:This statement is too broad. People who seek equality of opportunity (not equality of results) are SJW's. So are people who think white men are all out to rape all the women and keep all the blacks down. Probably all of us fall in "their tent" if we're just using the term "Social Justice Warrior".
frick social justice warriors and the groups that are in their tent.
It's much more effective to attack, directly, radical feminists and people who deliberately race bait and stir up feelings of an oppression that largely doesn't exist.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:32 am to ChineseBandit58
quote:
He keeps posting that stupid site. It has little to do with any police policy allegations. It mostly lists a bunch of crap that policemen, as individuals, get in trouble for - things like dui, domestic violence, stealing, etc - in other words there are some petty criminals who happen to be policemen -
First, there are many of the offenses listed on that site which are absolutely tied to police policy.
Secondly, it's not a trump card. It's simply data for people who've probably never been exposed to data which isn't favorable to police. You dismissed it after reading probably two or three paragraphs, I'm guessing. If you only seek data which aligns with your already existing worldview, you're not really getting data.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:44 am to the808bass
quote:
You dismissed it after reading probably two or three paragraphs
I read four pages - As I said in my first response to you there were only a handful of cases that could possibly have any connection to police abuse. Overwhelmingly it was all about bad behavior of people who happened to be cops.
No, I didn't go any deeper - I would think that if you are going to cite that link, you would find one that is more demonstrative of the point you are trying to make. Or perhaps you could do the leg work to support your own argument. It is kind of presumptive of you to expect every one who tries to see what you are talking about to invest half an hour of their time in searching out some hidden nuggets.
It is your responsibility to support your points with cogent data. I will look and listen if you do.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:46 am to ChineseBandit58
So when someone says "it's not a problem," I'm supposed to provide data points to the contrary. I don't know how I could have missed that logical point.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:49 am to ChineseBandit58
quote:
It is your responsibility to support your points with cogent data. I will look and listen if you do.
That's pretty rich coming from you...
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:51 am to ChineseBandit58
One of the problems with providing data is that police don't report it with any uniformity on these sorts of issues.
Even though it was required that police report on all the police related fatalities. They still don't do it.
It would be good to have nationwide data which is reported in a uniform fashion. If it's really not a problem, that would completely clear it up.
Even though it was required that police report on all the police related fatalities. They still don't do it.
It would be good to have nationwide data which is reported in a uniform fashion. If it's really not a problem, that would completely clear it up.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:52 am to ChineseBandit58
quote:
I'd like to know the backstory on why a well dressed respectful young man would be accosted by a policeman with guns drawn. Not that I don't believe you but that is pretty far out. I am sure you filed a complaint. I certainly would have.
I finished finals early and went to meet my girlfriend at her house. I knocked on the door. She wasn't home. I sat on her porch for a few minutes, walked to her friend's house next door to see if she was there. No one was home there either. I went back to my girlfriend's house and knocked on her window which was located on the side of the house. The police officer was waiting for me with his gun drawn when I walked from the side of the house. He ran my id and let me go. Turns out he was a friend of my girlfriend's family. He saw a strange car parked in the driveway during the middle of the day and stopped to investigate.
Another time I was riding home from an office Christmas party with a female coworker who was white. The police officers stopped us because we ran a red light (allegedly). There was an open fifth of vodka in the back seat. My co worker was driving. We were in her car. The officers handcuffed me and put me in the back of the squad car while they ran my id. Meanwhile my coworker is crying, trying to get the officers to explain why I am cuffed when she was driving. It was her car and her alcohol. They eventually let us go and gave me the ticket for the open container. I filed a report on that one. My lawyer advised it would be cheaper to pay for pretrial instead of fighting the ticket and having it possibly go one my record.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 10:56 am to baybeefeetz
quote:
Going door to door is suspicious in and of itself nowadays if you ask me.
I'm always suspicious of anyone who knocks on my door, don't trust strangers, something you learn as a kid that sticks with you I guess.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 11:17 am to mmcgrath
"Cops don't have it worse then regular people"? Go ride in any police unit for a wk & tell me Joe Public ever faces anything like any police officer does in just doing his regular duty. Then,go take a ride in a unit in a large city like N.Y. Chicago, L.A. I like the officer who walked up to Labron James after he wore that shirt the first nite: "Hey, King, go call a protestor to walk you to the safety of your car after games from now on", a service the area provides for team players.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 11:28 am to trackfan
quote:
These people? Who are "these people" of whom you speak?
typical liberal
Posted on 12/22/14 at 12:49 pm to mikelowery1911
Sounds like two legitimate concerns. However, on the first one, do you think it would have been different had you not been black? maybe, maybe not.
The second instance is clearly abuse, based on what you recounted here. I would have filed the complaint for sure. That is the kind of thing that breeds the anti-cop rationale - and hopefully it is rare.
I know that in my experience this kind of thing just never happens. This leads me to my belief that the overwhelming majority of police/arrestee interactions that go bad are the fault of something the perpetrator did, not due to an institutional proclivity within the police dept.
Perhaps my sheltered life has given me the wrong impression of what routinely goes on out there - that is why I always try to analyze the facts of these issues. And I wait for the facts of a real instance of such police abuse to be the basis of a protest. So far, the major protests have all been based on flimsy or nonexistent data.
In the Brown/Garner issues the facts do not support the amount of vitriol coming from left wing activist and hard core libertarians and devout anarchists. I am sure there are legitimate instances where outrage would be justified, but these two just ain't it. Pressing forward with these two false narratives does a great disservice to any legitimate concerns there may be. I have seen it so often that I automatically take the side of the police when these things arise.
I can be persuaded otherwise - but so far nobody had presented any reason for me to do so.
I can understand the arguments in the Garner case, but I think the Grand Jury came to the correct decision - there was just nothing there to support a criminal trial.
The Brown case was pure bullshite.
Any national leader who does not denounce the misguided 'hands up - don't shoot' meme share the blame for the results these narratives have on mentally unstable thugs.
Words have consequences.
Facts are not racist.
The second instance is clearly abuse, based on what you recounted here. I would have filed the complaint for sure. That is the kind of thing that breeds the anti-cop rationale - and hopefully it is rare.
I know that in my experience this kind of thing just never happens. This leads me to my belief that the overwhelming majority of police/arrestee interactions that go bad are the fault of something the perpetrator did, not due to an institutional proclivity within the police dept.
Perhaps my sheltered life has given me the wrong impression of what routinely goes on out there - that is why I always try to analyze the facts of these issues. And I wait for the facts of a real instance of such police abuse to be the basis of a protest. So far, the major protests have all been based on flimsy or nonexistent data.
In the Brown/Garner issues the facts do not support the amount of vitriol coming from left wing activist and hard core libertarians and devout anarchists. I am sure there are legitimate instances where outrage would be justified, but these two just ain't it. Pressing forward with these two false narratives does a great disservice to any legitimate concerns there may be. I have seen it so often that I automatically take the side of the police when these things arise.
I can be persuaded otherwise - but so far nobody had presented any reason for me to do so.
I can understand the arguments in the Garner case, but I think the Grand Jury came to the correct decision - there was just nothing there to support a criminal trial.
The Brown case was pure bullshite.
Any national leader who does not denounce the misguided 'hands up - don't shoot' meme share the blame for the results these narratives have on mentally unstable thugs.
Words have consequences.
Facts are not racist.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 12:58 pm to the808bass
quote:
One of the problems with providing data is that police don't report it with any uniformity on these sorts of issues.
Even though it was required that police report on all the police related fatalities. They still don't do it.
It would be good to have nationwide data which is reported in a uniform fashion. If it's really not a problem, that would completely clear it up.
I cannot disagree with anything you posted here. I have zero experience with big city police organizations, but I have formed good opinions of the NYPD because of the pronounced decrease in murder rates there after Guliano took over. Whatever the NYPD became during those years seemed to be a good thing.
If your assertion about police data reporting is true, then there needs to be a bi-partisan effort to oversee that - perhaps some independent auditor could be instituted to make sure nothing is swept under the rug.
And I don't for an instant think that any large organization doesn't try to sweep unflattering data under the rug - from presidential administrations on down to local library staffs. The police is such an important cog in our system of justice that it must be above reproach. So I agree, some kind of investigative agency needs to be set up to provide assurance that they are acting justly.
But - to beat a dead horse - latching on to emotional, non-factual, issues like the Michaael Brown case to support a false narrative does disservice to your larger cause. It certainly turns off people like me.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 1:21 pm to ChineseBandit58
quote:
latching on to ... false narrative
I agree. I think that the race pimps pick inflammatory cases purposefully because they don't want solutions or even broad-based support. They cease to exist if there's solutions or broad-based support across the population. So they focus on a narrative over and above the facts. Because their existence depends on division, not facts.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 1:34 pm to ChineseBandit58
quote:
The second instance is clearly abuse, based on what you recounted here. I would have filed the complaint for sure. That is the kind of thing that breeds the anti-cop rationale - and hopefully it is rare.
Putting a person in the back of a patrol car while you investigate a crime is not "abuse" by any means. It is called investigative detention.
Posted on 12/22/14 at 1:35 pm to ChineseBandit58
quote:
I know that in my experience this kind of thing just never happens. This leads me to my belief that the overwhelming majority of police/arrestee interactions that go bad are the fault of something the perpetrator did, not due to an institutional proclivity within the police dept. Perhaps my sheltered life has given me the wrong impression of what routinely goes on out there - that is why I always try to analyze the facts of these issues. And I wait for the facts of a real instance of such police abuse to be the basis of a protest. So far, the major protests have all been based on flimsy or nonexistent data.
This pretty much mirrors my opinion before moving to St. Louis. Having been here for about 15 years, my opinion has shifted pretty radically.
I think that racial profiling occurs here on a fairly routine basis. I know that the multitude of small municipal police forces here are revenue generators first and law enforcement second. And those two factors (among others) have created a very adversarial relationship between the civilians and the police.
I remember a conversation I had with an AA friend of mine here. He asked me how many times I'd been pulled over and sat on the side of the road in cuffs while the police searched my car. I responded "none." He said, "Exactly. It's happened to me 6 times." (He might have said 8, I don't recall exactly.). This is a successful, college-educated black man who makes 6 figures. He has no real police record.
So when the media said that STL police had an adversarial relationship with AAs, it's true. And it is somewhat deserved. Hell. They have an adversarial relationship with whites.
Page 7 of 9
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News