re: Rolling over 401K to new job

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We love the property too much to jeopardize the sale over something like this.

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Not worth pushing at all then. Don't say a word.

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Probably best to take Janky's cue and just walk away on this one.

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We've already changed topics. And Native is an a-hole I've known since I was a kid. He just says shite to be on whatever side I'm not on. So his views never count.

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So his views never count.

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Speaking of count. He could prolly add to this as well.

The tax on a conversion must be paid out of pocket unless the individual is over 59.5. If you plan on paying the tax from the conversion out of the account you're going to get penalized and pay additional taxes on that distribution.

By the way I just checked on my 401k and it seems like we have 55 available fund choices from 8 different families.

Just waded through this thing. I'm not going to put a ton of effort into this, but Sigma is an idiot and has been incredibly wrong.

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By the way I just checked on my 401k and it seems like we have 55 available fund choices from 8 different families.

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that is maybe 1/1000th the funds available on TD Ameritrade or similar. And take a look at the fees on those funds. My guess is none lower than .8%

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So let's do a calculation. $20,000, 5% compounded annually for 30 years. If he rolls into a trad/401k he ends up with $86,438.85 If he rolls into a Roth and pays the tax out of pocket he ends up with $86,438.85 If he uses the balance and his tax bracket is 15% he ends up with: $73,473.02 Which is what I've been saying all along. You want to throw taxation into a discussion about balance. And you're wrong.

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I think most of the confusion in this thread can be seen above. I was wrong by using the term "balance" in this context. I was looking for a word to describe the amount of money in the account, comparing a lump sum rolled from a 401k into a tIRA/401k vs rolled into a Roth. The amount you would have, the balance in the account, (considering the cash outlay it the back at the point of conversion) when you start to withdraw, including the tax paid the following tax year on your return. This included two points of potential taxation, the rolling, and the withdrawing. It's hard to know exactly because no one knows the relative tax rates, but most assumptions end up with the Roth being the better option, especially if, like the OP, you've got a long time until retirement.

I'm sorry if this didn't come across in my posts.

I think if we were in the same room face to face we wouldn't be having this disagreement. It's utterly basic personal finance and I suppose I'm just doing a poor job explaining my point.

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My guess is none lower than .8%

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Actually it looks like the only ones over .6% are International funds. None over 0.9%. Cheapest is.04%