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Message
Why blame everything on the illegal immigrants?
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:51 pm
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:51 pm
I see lots and lots of hatred/vitriol/blame pointed in the direction of illegal immigrants. Much less (on this board) do I see anything directed towards the businesses (both big and small) who employ them (i.e. the demand for labor that lures the supply across the border). In fact, business is usually spoken of in sacred tones with the seeming assumption that it can never do any wrong.
Bottom line - if businesses wouldn't hire illegals, then illegals wouldn't come.
Bottom line - if businesses wouldn't hire illegals, then illegals wouldn't come.
10
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:52 pm to Big Scrub TX
quote:
Bottom line - if businesses wouldn't hire illegals, then illegals wouldn't come.
Or, if they weren't allowed to come in and undercut US citizens then there wouldn't be a problem. It goes both ways.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:53 pm to Big Scrub TX
I blame it on the governments of the shitty countries that they're running from. You know, what you want to turn the US into.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:53 pm to Big Scrub TX
quote:There are a good bit of people on here who want harsher penalties on businesses who hire illegals.
Bottom line - if businesses wouldn't hire illegals, then illegals wouldn't come.
People then throw out the "who will do __________ job?" argument.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:57 pm to Big Scrub TX
Illegals have become a vital part of our economy, especially in the southwest and Florida.
People can hate them all they want, so long as they acknowledge that we need them. They take jobs that Americans will not, and perform jobs they would take for significantly reduced wages.
You want all illegals out, fine. Don't bitch when your produce doubles in price. Too many people want to have their cake and eat it to on this issue.
People can hate them all they want, so long as they acknowledge that we need them. They take jobs that Americans will not, and perform jobs they would take for significantly reduced wages.
You want all illegals out, fine. Don't bitch when your produce doubles in price. Too many people want to have their cake and eat it to on this issue.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 4:58 pm to Scruffy
quote:
People then throw out the "who will do __________ job?" argument.
It's a valid argument. How many Americans do you know willing to work for 20-30 bucks a day?
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:00 pm to Big Scrub TX
Otto's housemate
{confirmed} not confirmed
{confirmed} not confirmed
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:02 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:The problem is, how long until this becomes an issue again?
You want all illegals out, fine. Don't bitch when your produce doubles in price. Too many people want to have their cake and eat it to on this issue.
If illegals are made legal citizens, they likely will no longer accept lower wages.
Therefore, more illegal immigrants are needed, which will ultimately result in another instance in the future requiring nationalization.
That will then result in the requirement of more illegals to fill the jobs...
See where I'm going with this?
It is an endless song and dance.
This post was edited on 11/21/14 at 5:05 pm
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:04 pm to TN Bhoy
quote:
blame it on the governments of the shitty countries that they're running from.
So it's not US consumers or US businesses to blame at all, right? It's always the other guy, right?
quote:
You know, what you want to turn the US into.
Sure, whatever.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:05 pm to Scruffy
quote:
If illegals are made legal citizens, they likely will no longer accept lower wages.
I disagree, at least not within the current generation. Giving them citizenship doesn't change their inherent attitudes towards work and wages derived from their past in Mexico. Many are not even aware of the concept of minimum wage.
This post was edited on 11/21/14 at 5:06 pm
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:09 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:Not only do I disagree, but do you think a business owner would take that chance with someone he can no longer threaten?
I disagree, at least not within the current generation. Giving them citizenship doesn't change their inherent attitudes towards work and wages derived from their past in Mexico. Many are not even aware of the concept of minimum wage.
And that still doesn't address the fact that this situation will ultimately repeat itself.
Or are you a supporter of simply kicking the can down the road like the previous generations have done to mine? I'd prefer not to do that.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:13 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
I disagree, at least not within the current generation. Giving them citizenship doesn't change their inherent attitudes towards work and wages derived from their past in Mexico. Many are not even aware of the concept of minimum wage.
Eh, I think most of them are comfortable with be classified as illegal. If they are required to pay taxes, that's less money they can send home (which is the only reason most of them are here). They would rather be payed under the table for a smaller wage and get to keep 100% of their paycheck.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:14 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
How many Americans do you know willing to work for 20-30 bucks a day
From the USDA
quote:
Fifty-nine percent of farm laborers and supervisors found in the CPS are U.S. citizens, compared to 91 percent for managers,
quote:
About half of all laborers and supervisors are Hispanic
Average hourly wages for farm and other occupations May 2011
Farm occupations
First-line supervisors of farming, fishing, and forestry workers 21.97
Agricultural inspectors 20.25
Animal breeders 18.11
Graders and sorters, agricultural products 9.95
Agricultural equipment operators 12.90
Farmworkers and laborers: crop, nursery, and greenhouse 9.62
Farmworkers: farm, ranch, and aquacultural animals 11.60
Agricultural workers, all other 13.91
Selected nonfarm occupations
Maids and housekeepers 10.31
Construction laborers 16.43
Landscaping and groundskeeping workers 12.33
Source: USDA, Economic Research Service using data from Bureau of Labor Statistics.
LINK
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:17 pm to Scruffy
quote:
but do you think a business owner would take that chance with someone he can no longer threaten?
People will do a lot of things to protect their profit margin.
quote:
And that still doesn't address the fact that this situation will ultimately repeat itself.
Eventually, but we'll probably have been called on our debt by China and nuked each other into oblivion by then.
quote:
Or are you a supporter of simply kicking the can down the road like the previous generations have done to mine? I'd prefer not to do that.
I'm not particularly good at feigning altruism, I just accept that it goes against my human instinct. Sure I care about those in the here and now, but whether it be my grandchildren's financial success or the future of the ozone layer I don't really give many shits about what happens decades after I'm dead. The difference between me and most others is I don't try and fake it.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:18 pm to Big Scrub TX
I've always said you could greatly reduce illegal immigration by draconian penalties for hiring one. Whether a single home owner or meat packing plant.
No work no illegal immigration.
All without fences.
But Oprah and her garden and big biz are not down so...
No work no illegal immigration.
All without fences.
But Oprah and her garden and big biz are not down so...
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:19 pm to TigerTattle
quote:
From the USDA
That's great, now are you going to answer my question?
How many Americans are willing to work for 20-30 bucks a day?
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:21 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
How many Americans are willing to
...pay more for goods that are produced by American citizens?
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:21 pm to goatmilker
quote:
...pay more for goods that are produced by American citizens?
Not many
The nationalism of the average American goes only as far as it doesn't negatively impact their life.
This post was edited on 11/21/14 at 5:22 pm
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:22 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:
That's great, now are you going to answer my question?
How many Americans are willing to work for 20-30 bucks a day?
If we're talking in the ag industry, I'm sure automation would eventually begin to compensate for higher wage prices and the work force would begin to dwindle.
Posted on 11/21/14 at 5:23 pm to goatmilker
quote:
I've always said you could greatly reduce illegal immigration by draconian penalties for hiring one. Whether a single home owner or meat packing plant.
This would be literally impossible to enforce, and any attempt to do so would be a MASSIVE waste of government spending.
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