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Who is the Pelican's best perimeter defender? The answer may surprise you!
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:19 am
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:19 am
More at 8...
Ok, here is an article from hoopshabit(is this some new bleacher report I never heard of?).
Anyone who watched any of our games last year knew we were atrocious at defending spot up shots. This wasn't a problem with individuals imo but on a terrible scheme. We sagged down to help on interior D but didn't double team leaving our guys out of position constantly. Hopefully with Davis getting stronger and a MASSIVE upgrade at C, we won't need to sag down as much and can stick with the shooters.
Here are the numbers from the article:
There is more number porn in there but this is the gist of it. Our 3's weren't that bad, our 2s were atrocious. From the looks of this, we should be OK with playing Miller and Salmons at the 3. Jimmer looks to be as big of a liability as we all thought. Eric Gordon and Austin Rivers are big surprises to me as they both seemed like competent defenders last year.
Ok, here is an article from hoopshabit(is this some new bleacher report I never heard of?).
quote:
The Pelicans finished 22nd in defending pick and roll ball-handlers, 25th in defending spot-ups, 27th in defending shots off screens, and dead least in the league in transition defense.
Anyone who watched any of our games last year knew we were atrocious at defending spot up shots. This wasn't a problem with individuals imo but on a terrible scheme. We sagged down to help on interior D but didn't double team leaving our guys out of position constantly. Hopefully with Davis getting stronger and a MASSIVE upgrade at C, we won't need to sag down as much and can stick with the shooters.
Here are the numbers from the article:
quote:
Player DRPM (Defensive real Plus Minus)
Darius Miller +1.45
John Salmons -0.25 (Raptors)
Luke Babbitt -1.84
Austin Rivers -3.03
Tyreke Evans -3.72
Eric Gordon -4.75
Jimmer Fredette (Kings) -5.64
DRPM hates the Pelicans’ wings.
There is more number porn in there but this is the gist of it. Our 3's weren't that bad, our 2s were atrocious. From the looks of this, we should be OK with playing Miller and Salmons at the 3. Jimmer looks to be as big of a liability as we all thought. Eric Gordon and Austin Rivers are big surprises to me as they both seemed like competent defenders last year.
5
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:22 am to saintsfan92612
So Babbit was the best perimeter defender?
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:34 am to c on z
quote:
So Babbit was the best perimeter defender?
are you fricking serious? can you read?
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:38 am to c on z
quote:
So Babbit was the best perimeter defender?
Al Farouq Aminu: 2.07
then Miller.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:39 am to c on z
Did you just take a stab in the dark?
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:41 am to saintsfan92612
Nice find.
Only linked one of 3 defensive chart metrics, slightly misleading. Babbitt did appear most effective as he appeared near the top in every category. Also, good God Jimmer was bad last year.
It's borderline hilarious that every single one of these players "Worst at Defending" was "Spot Up Shooting". If that doesn't scream defensive scheme and coaching, I don't know what does. God forbid someone bash Monty any more heading into this season, but his overly complicated defensive scheme is a real problem that I'm hoping to see fixed. Less switching, more man to man. Less double teaming, more trusting your guy 1 on 1. And for the love of god, if you are going to double team, at least make them swing the ball around the perimeter to allow the doubler to rotate over to the last shooter. It drove me absolutely bonkers watching us double team only to allow the first kick out pass turn into a wide open shot.
Monty has naturally gifted defensive players at his disposal, yet his scheme screams distrust of those abilities.
ETA: This article makes the Salmons signing look like a stroke of genius by Dell. We'll see.
Only linked one of 3 defensive chart metrics, slightly misleading. Babbitt did appear most effective as he appeared near the top in every category. Also, good God Jimmer was bad last year.
It's borderline hilarious that every single one of these players "Worst at Defending" was "Spot Up Shooting". If that doesn't scream defensive scheme and coaching, I don't know what does. God forbid someone bash Monty any more heading into this season, but his overly complicated defensive scheme is a real problem that I'm hoping to see fixed. Less switching, more man to man. Less double teaming, more trusting your guy 1 on 1. And for the love of god, if you are going to double team, at least make them swing the ball around the perimeter to allow the doubler to rotate over to the last shooter. It drove me absolutely bonkers watching us double team only to allow the first kick out pass turn into a wide open shot.
Monty has naturally gifted defensive players at his disposal, yet his scheme screams distrust of those abilities.
ETA: This article makes the Salmons signing look like a stroke of genius by Dell. We'll see.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 9:44 am
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:42 am to saintsfan92612
damnit I was hoping the answer was AR
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:42 am to c on z
quote:you have to be doing this on purpose
So Babbit was the best perimeter defender?
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:47 am to Fearthehat0307
he isn't far off. I didn't want to post the whole article here, but Miller and Babbitt were quite a bit better than the rest of the team.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:50 am to c on z
quote:
So Babbit was the best perimeter defender?
I could see how the argument could be made. He's the only player to appear in the top 3 of every metric listed in the article. His rebound rate of 6.7/per 36 smashes Miller's 2.6/per 36 (which is downright awful by the way, good for last on the team, including players like Austin Rivers, Anthony Morrow, and Brian Roberts).
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:56 am to saintsfan92612
quote:
Eric Gordon and Austin Rivers are big surprises to me as they both seemed like competent defenders last year.
BSS regularly pointed out how Gordon is useless if he has to switch onto a bigger player. He just doesn't want to get physical at all.
I think Rivers is way overrated as a defender on this board simply because he looks like he's trying really hard with his on ball defense. But so much of what happens off ball has become so important that I don't think most of us are capable of picking out good defense unless we're specifically looking for it.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:58 am to TigerinATL
Effort is the most important thing on D. Well, controlled effort.
Rivers passed the defensive eye test just because Roberts was so awful at it.
Rivers passed the defensive eye test just because Roberts was so awful at it.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 9:59 am
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:00 am to saintsfan92612
quote:
Effort is the most important thing on D. Well, controlled effort.
And hopefully another year of experience, strength training and improved basketball IQ will give him the control he needs, because we know the effort's there.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:06 am to TigerinATL
I just did a quick search for worst DRPMs last year and found this article:
quote:
* SG Eric Gordon, New Orleans. He’s still young, and it’s not clear if this is who he is now or if he’s not quite yet all the way back from his early-career injuries.
But if we use the last few seasons as a baseline… Gordon is just not a good player any more and he’s getting worse and worse specifically on D, which is killing the Pelicans.
He has slow feet and a large disinterest in chasing offensive players through picks or paying attention to the strong side when he’s currently standing on the weak side.
A stat: Gordon’s -4.75 DRPM this season ranked him 432nd in the entire league, which is almost last. Into Jimmer Territory.
Another stat: The Pelicans were +6.2 points on defense per 100 poss’s when Gordon was OFF the floor vs. when he was ON, which was the second-largest bad-D deficit I could find for any individual player in the league.
Last stat: New Orleans out-scored its opponents when Gordon was OUT; New Orleans was out-scored by 7.1 points per 100 poss’s when he was IN the game.
quote:
* Coach: New Orleans’ Monty Williams. The Pellies had injuries, for sure, but what the hell? They were tied for the fifth-worst defensive efficiency and were third-worst last season, and that’s not just about injuries.
Something has gone wrong here. For a few clues, just look at Tyreke Evans, Austin Rivers and Eric Gordon’s recent career arcs.
Yes, there were many horrendous defensive teams this season–the Lakers under Mike D’Antoni, Philly under Brett Brown, Utah under Tyrone Corbin, etc.–but New Orleans is the team that probably should’ve been better and I think was trying to be better. And definitely was terrible.
quote:
* W Tyreke Evans, New Orleans. His four-year, $44M deal kicked in this season–the same deal that Curry got. Both have three years left. Curry is a better defensive player than Evans (#427th ranked in Defensive Real Plus-Minus this season). And we don’t even need to go into the offensive comparisons.
Evans’ DRPM was -3.72.
quote:
—-Moved off of consideration for lack of playing time at least for this season and maybe forever/
* Jimmer Fredette, Chicago. Yes, he’s on the Bulls. I forgot, too. He played 519 minutes this season and it was about 515 too much. There are no more words for his defense because it doesn’t exist.
I don’t think Fredette is ever going to play enough minutes ever again to qualify for anything, except: Worst top-10 draft choice of the last 10 years, (tied with Jonny Flynn).
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:16 am to saintsfan92612
The worst part is that it was just a general article not aimed at the Pelicans but the ones that got mentioned, including ones like Jimmer that weren't Pelicans at the time, stood out.
One thing Gordon and Jimmer seem to have in common is both don't like to get physical on defense. Maybe Monty should send them across campus to the Saints so they can get desensitized to contact.
One thing Gordon and Jimmer seem to have in common is both don't like to get physical on defense. Maybe Monty should send them across campus to the Saints so they can get desensitized to contact.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 10:17 am
Posted on 8/11/14 at 11:32 am to saintsfan92612
ok that's depressing...
Posted on 8/11/14 at 12:00 pm to ShamelessPel
quote:
t's borderline hilarious that every single one of these players "Worst at Defending" was "Spot Up Shooting". If that doesn't scream defensive scheme and coaching, I don't know what does. God forbid someone bash Monty any more heading into this season, but his overly complicated defensive scheme is a real problem that I'm hoping to see fixed. Less switching, more man to man. Less double teaming, more trusting your guy 1 on 1. And for the love of god, if you are going to double team, at least make them swing the ball around the perimeter to allow the doubler to rotate over to the last shooter. It drove me absolutely bonkers watching us double team only to allow the first kick out pass turn into a wide open shot.
Pretty much this
It's scheme more than talent
Posted on 8/11/14 at 3:21 pm to saintsfan92612
...and some people insist that the team is better with Gordon...his defense last year was horrible, and everyone kept saying he was a solid defender when he came here
Posted on 8/11/14 at 5:52 pm to ShamelessPel
quote:
Monty has naturally gifted defensive players at his disposal, yet his scheme screams distrust of those abilities.
It's troubling when a guy like JVG tells Lowe that he (and guys like Thibs) always wants offensive players over defensive players. That he can teach defense and scheme a lot more easily than offense.
Charlotte had a top 10 defense w/ Jefferson/McBob frontcourt. The Blazers were mid pack w/ a Lillard/Rolo combo.
As much as I like to grouse, Monty is clearly a better offensive than defensive coach. He can coax respectable offenses from middling talent.
Posted on 8/11/14 at 6:11 pm to cgrand
quote:
ok that's depressing...
No shite.
Good thing we have AD and Asik.
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