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Message
OB/boat related: Any Elec Engineers or solar power experts on the OB?
Posted on 5/18/14 at 10:46 pm
Posted on 5/18/14 at 10:46 pm
Looking to explore putting a team in the event below. Trying to see if I have any local experts in the BR area that want to try to be mad scientist with me.
would need to custom design and create an electric boat that could compete in a 340 mile race. Can use an existing boat hull/ design( which I have in mind), but would have to retrofit for electric propulsion and solar recharging of batteries.
Does LSU have an engineering class I could partner with maybe if no one has the knowledge or interest to brainstorm the project? I recognize it could get pricey, but I could cover a lot of it and find sponsors if cost gets outrageous.
LINK to info
LINK to rules
If anyone would like to discuss, my email is lazzy1@me(dot) com
The Rules
1. Craft must be powered by solar-electric means only and must convey, at minimum, one human adult from start to finish.
2. Storage of electrical power is allowed in batteries. The batteries may be fully charged at the start of the race. Once the race begins, charging may only take place via photovoltaic (solar) power.
3. Race begins at Kaw Point at the confluence of the Kansas and Missouri Rivers (mile 367.5) and ends at the City of St. Charles, MO, mile 28 OR at any designated official boat ramp the leading boat can make a powered landing at within the 38 hour window from 7am August 8th to 9pm August 9th. The boat at the furthest officially designated downstream boat ramp from KC at 9pm, August 9th shall be deemed the winner of the 2014 e-340.
4. There will be 3 checkpoints with cutoff times along the course.
7am start at Kaw Point
Miami, mile 263, with a cutoff time of 9pm at 14 hours. (7.5mph leg)
Glasgow, mile 226, with a cutoff time of 3am at 20 hours. (6mph leg)
Cooper's Landing, mile 170, with a cutoff time of noon at 29 hours. (6.2mph leg)
After Cooper's Landing, any official public boat ramp may be a finish line. The maximum allowable finish time is 9pm, August 9th. St. Charles is the maximum finish line, a distance of 340 miles from Kaw Point.
For a legal finish, a boat must land under power at the boat ramp. Drifting past the boat ramp is not a legal finish. Paddling in to boat ramp is not a legal finish. If a boat records a legal finish, then elects to continue and cannot record a subsequent legal finish, they are disqualified and their previous finish is forfeit.
5. Boat must have positive buoyancy, even if capsized.
6. Batteries and gear must be secured in boat and should remain secured in the event of a capsize.
7. Cockpit must not create an entrapment hazard.
8. Boat must have functioning navigation lights.
9. Motorized boat must be registered. Proper paper work for a motorized boat must be carried board. Proper numbering on both sides of the boat is required. Boat should meet all Coast Guard safety minimums.
10. Coast Guard approved PFD must be worn at all times while underway and by all crew.
11. There must be a functioning cell phone aboard each boat.
12. There shall be no differentiation between boats with one crew and multiple crew. While crew can exit the boat and not return, new crew may not replace them.
13. Each boat is responsible for a ground crew to retrieve them from their final boat ramp or shore side terminus.
14. Safety boats will be on the water to provide assistance in the form of towing or rescue. Safety boats are not responsible for loss of equipment, including vessel, if a tow or rescue is requested. Safety boat pilot will make the determination as to what is the safest destination for the towed vessel.
would need to custom design and create an electric boat that could compete in a 340 mile race. Can use an existing boat hull/ design( which I have in mind), but would have to retrofit for electric propulsion and solar recharging of batteries.
Does LSU have an engineering class I could partner with maybe if no one has the knowledge or interest to brainstorm the project? I recognize it could get pricey, but I could cover a lot of it and find sponsors if cost gets outrageous.
LINK to info
LINK to rules
If anyone would like to discuss, my email is lazzy1@me(dot) com
The Rules
1. Craft must be powered by solar-electric means only and must convey, at minimum, one human adult from start to finish.
2. Storage of electrical power is allowed in batteries. The batteries may be fully charged at the start of the race. Once the race begins, charging may only take place via photovoltaic (solar) power.
3. Race begins at Kaw Point at the confluence of the Kansas and Missouri Rivers (mile 367.5) and ends at the City of St. Charles, MO, mile 28 OR at any designated official boat ramp the leading boat can make a powered landing at within the 38 hour window from 7am August 8th to 9pm August 9th. The boat at the furthest officially designated downstream boat ramp from KC at 9pm, August 9th shall be deemed the winner of the 2014 e-340.
4. There will be 3 checkpoints with cutoff times along the course.
7am start at Kaw Point
Miami, mile 263, with a cutoff time of 9pm at 14 hours. (7.5mph leg)
Glasgow, mile 226, with a cutoff time of 3am at 20 hours. (6mph leg)
Cooper's Landing, mile 170, with a cutoff time of noon at 29 hours. (6.2mph leg)
After Cooper's Landing, any official public boat ramp may be a finish line. The maximum allowable finish time is 9pm, August 9th. St. Charles is the maximum finish line, a distance of 340 miles from Kaw Point.
For a legal finish, a boat must land under power at the boat ramp. Drifting past the boat ramp is not a legal finish. Paddling in to boat ramp is not a legal finish. If a boat records a legal finish, then elects to continue and cannot record a subsequent legal finish, they are disqualified and their previous finish is forfeit.
5. Boat must have positive buoyancy, even if capsized.
6. Batteries and gear must be secured in boat and should remain secured in the event of a capsize.
7. Cockpit must not create an entrapment hazard.
8. Boat must have functioning navigation lights.
9. Motorized boat must be registered. Proper paper work for a motorized boat must be carried board. Proper numbering on both sides of the boat is required. Boat should meet all Coast Guard safety minimums.
10. Coast Guard approved PFD must be worn at all times while underway and by all crew.
11. There must be a functioning cell phone aboard each boat.
12. There shall be no differentiation between boats with one crew and multiple crew. While crew can exit the boat and not return, new crew may not replace them.
13. Each boat is responsible for a ground crew to retrieve them from their final boat ramp or shore side terminus.
14. Safety boats will be on the water to provide assistance in the form of towing or rescue. Safety boats are not responsible for loss of equipment, including vessel, if a tow or rescue is requested. Safety boat pilot will make the determination as to what is the safest destination for the towed vessel.
This post was edited on 5/19/14 at 9:00 am
5
Posted on 5/18/14 at 10:48 pm to tigers win2
man, that would be an awesome senior design project...
pretty much every discipline of engineering has to be done on that one....
pretty much every discipline of engineering has to be done on that one....
Posted on 5/18/14 at 10:50 pm to Spankum
I would love to link up with other TDers and enter a boat. I finished a paddle race last year on the same river, but I was the motor.
I know the river and boat design, but need help with other aspects. Maybe too late for this year, but there is one spot left.
I know the river and boat design, but need help with other aspects. Maybe too late for this year, but there is one spot left.
This post was edited on 5/19/14 at 6:30 am
Posted on 5/18/14 at 11:50 pm to tigers win2
I talked to Mama Coastie (she's a naval architect & marine engineer....where my kids get their brains).
Her optimum hull recommendation is some sort of a twin-hull catamaran. Maximum stability for heavier loads inherent to solar power (batteries/inverters) while minimizing hull/water contact surfaces (drag). Furthermore, it's a broader platform for any solar collectors.
On the electrical...you're on your own there. I would recommend seeing if there have been any student projects or concept papers published at Webb Institute. A boatload of brainpower there.
Her optimum hull recommendation is some sort of a twin-hull catamaran. Maximum stability for heavier loads inherent to solar power (batteries/inverters) while minimizing hull/water contact surfaces (drag). Furthermore, it's a broader platform for any solar collectors.
On the electrical...you're on your own there. I would recommend seeing if there have been any student projects or concept papers published at Webb Institute. A boatload of brainpower there.
Posted on 5/19/14 at 12:36 am to CoastieGM
quote:
Her optimum hull recommendation is some sort of a twin-hull catamaran. Maximum stability for heavier loads inherent
Agree, wide deck space for weight(battery) distribution. Also would create sizable area for solar panel array. Would need to build mechanism to adjust panel angle so I could get maxim sun exposure by tracking sun across sky.
Edit: of course, that's an initial idea. Will have to determine if weight of necessary equipment is too heavy. If so, will look at similar design (small catamaran sailboat or Hobie tandem island) with more carrying capacity.
This post was edited on 5/25/14 at 10:44 am
Posted on 5/19/14 at 12:54 am to tigers win2
Houston, MS High School owns most of the records in solar car racing in whatever division they race in.
You can find some useful info about solar power for the cars at the link below. You would have to figure out transferring the power to a propeller.
LINK
The Houston, Mississippi (population 4,079) Sundancer solar car team won the Dell-Winston School Solar Car Challenge open division championship trophy at Texas Motor Speedway for the sixth consecutive year. During the challenge’s four days and seven racing periods of three hours each, the Sundancer solar car traveled more than 619 miles (413 laps), at an averaged a speed of almost 30 mph, reached a top speed of approximately 60 mph and completed more laps than any of the 13 other cars competing in the race.
You can find some useful info about solar power for the cars at the link below. You would have to figure out transferring the power to a propeller.
LINK
The Houston, Mississippi (population 4,079) Sundancer solar car team won the Dell-Winston School Solar Car Challenge open division championship trophy at Texas Motor Speedway for the sixth consecutive year. During the challenge’s four days and seven racing periods of three hours each, the Sundancer solar car traveled more than 619 miles (413 laps), at an averaged a speed of almost 30 mph, reached a top speed of approximately 60 mph and completed more laps than any of the 13 other cars competing in the race.
Posted on 5/19/14 at 7:30 am to tigers win2
i'm an EE. i'm hesitant to commit to it without more information, but if it fits around my schedule i'd probably be interested.
Posted on 5/19/14 at 7:33 am to tigers win2
couple of questions: is it intended to be human-operated? what sort of water needs to be traversed? what restrictions are there on the solar arrays, size of the boat, and are you supposed to design an electric-powered propulsion yourself, or you're just responsible for putting all the major pieces together?
Posted on 5/19/14 at 7:43 am to tigers win2
quote:
Does LSU have an engineering class I could partner with maybe if no one has the knowledge or interest to brainstorm the project? I recognize it could get pricey, but I could cover a lot of it and find sponsors if cost gets outrageous.
LSU's mechanical engineering department does what's called a Capstone Design class for seniors. It's both semesters of the senior year. Students have a design/build project. Funding is a major hurdle to overcome for them, so that would help. The school would probably want the students to retain a significant amount of control over the design phase, though, so that may turn you off.
I could probably answer some questions for you if you have any specific design questions.
Posted on 5/19/14 at 7:47 am to tigers win2
quote:
Edit: of course, that's an initial idea. Will have to determine if weight of necessary equipment is too heavy. If so, will look at similar design (small catamaran sailboat or Hobie tandem island) with more carrying capacity.
Depending on your batteries, that probably won't be sufficient. I don't really have time to read the rules this morning.
You may want to check out Solar Splash for ideas. This sounds more long-haul, whereas Solar Splash is more about acceleration and maneuverability, though. Could give you some ideas, though.
Posted on 5/19/14 at 7:57 am to gorillacoco
quote:
couple of questions: is it intended to be human-operated? what sort of water needs to be traversed? what restrictions are there on the solar arrays, size of the boat, and are you supposed to design an electric-powered propulsion yourself, or you're just responsible for putting all the major pieces together?
The Race will be on Missouri River from Kansas City to St Charles (st Louis ). LINK to pics of kayak race on same course
Just have to put together the pieces. At least one person has to be on board. Can innovate or purchase and bolt together.
The link about about the car race teams listed all of the contacts for the components to build a car. Thanks a lot to the poster who posted that site. I spent a lot of time reading the how to articles last night. Not surprised that team won, their motor/controller cost $15k. Other listed motors were around 1,000 to $1,500.
The trick to this event, is effecient use of power and the ability to generate and store enough power to get you through the night as the race doesn't stop at night. I have no idea if that's possible. To meet the time requirements, the boat would have to travel at least 10MPH. The river current will give you around 2 MPH so the boat would need to be able to create, store and operate on enough power to generate the additional 8 MPH even through the 10 hours of darkness. Of course, if the boat is fast enough during the day, it could just drift at night other than having power to navigate around wing dikes, bridge structures and channel markers.
Edit:
Better views of river in this video
This post was edited on 5/19/14 at 9:24 am
Posted on 5/19/14 at 9:28 am to tigers win2
quote:
twin-hull catamaran
This is a really efficient hull choice. My only concern is any type of tunnel hull boat does not become very efficient until you acheive a certain speed to create enough lift to reduce wetted surace area. At 10MPH in a heavy boat this may be an issue. I would focus on a boat design that would plane easily for the amount of weight and power involved.
What length boat do you have in mind?
Type of drive system?
For this to be sucessful, boat setup and weight will be a major factor. Allison and Hydrostream have made some small lightweight hulls over the years that planed with very little power.
I've built/raced boats in my past life and have done alot with battery powered gadgets.... I could offer advice from afar....
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