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Global warming question for both sides....
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:42 am
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:42 am
I want anyone to disprove my way of thinking....
Every time I hear an event happening, freezing, a flood, a drought, etc, I also hear some quote along the lines of "this is the worst since 1931, 1876, 1912" (or some other random date that the event equaled)
SO my question is, what was the cause of the event in the past? Or Dems arguing that the climate change is actually a "returning to past" climate change? All of these events have a history of happening in the past. So why is today considered "change".
Every time I hear an event happening, freezing, a flood, a drought, etc, I also hear some quote along the lines of "this is the worst since 1931, 1876, 1912" (or some other random date that the event equaled)
SO my question is, what was the cause of the event in the past? Or Dems arguing that the climate change is actually a "returning to past" climate change? All of these events have a history of happening in the past. So why is today considered "change".
10
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:45 am to GeeOH
The real question is, if you accept the premise that humans can affect global climate, what 'temperature' (year) should it be set at? 1990? 1800? 1200?
If warming is so bad, why is the temp we are now so good? Wouldn't warming open more fertile land in the arctic and antarctic regions?
If warming is so bad, why is the temp we are now so good? Wouldn't warming open more fertile land in the arctic and antarctic regions?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:48 am to GeeOH
quote:
Every time I hear an event happening, freezing, a flood, a drought, etc
if you're hearing about a single event like that in reference to climate change theory, from either side, you should ignore it as irrelevant to the debate. they're either stupid or trolling the other side
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:48 am to cokebottleag
quote:There's no global temperature we're looking for. Please tell me that's not what you think.
The real question is, if you accept the premise that humans can affect global climate, what 'temperature' (year) should it be set at? 1990? 1800? 1200?
quote:...
Wouldn't warming open more fertile land in the arctic and antarctic regions?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:51 am to FT
quote:
There's no global temperature we're looking for.
What are we looking for?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:54 am to GeeOH
quote:
Every time I hear an event happening, freezing, a flood, a drought, etc, I also hear some quote along the lines of "this is the worst since 1931, 1876, 1912" (or some other random date that the event equaled)
If it is the hottest on record, the dems will at minimum implicitly imply that it is a result of global warming. If it is the coldest on record, dems will either implicity imply that it is a result of global warming...or tell point out that weather is not the same as climate.
All of it is a campaign to play upon people's fear in an attempt to get major tax revenue additions.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:56 am to 90proofprofessional
quote:
if you're hearing about a single event like that in reference to climate change theory, from either side, you should ignore it as irrelevant to the debate. they're either stupid or trolling the other side
I just watched a debate on a video clip where they did just that. Floods in Europe, drought in California, freezes in Georgia, etc are the stories they lead into the debate with....it was a CNN video (color me shocked that they would try anything to get views) But all of their examples, had dates that were the last time events like this happened.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:56 am to GeeOH
Greenland...was named 'Green Land'...for a reason, GO. Now what caused warmer temps back then, or whether man's effect re GH gases now...has less to do with Science than it does (Authoritarian Socialist) Politics.
Back in the Hippie Days, when I was in the groove
...it was the Commies that were pushing the Global Cooling 
meme. Same now.
And even if it's man's oil-based technology that is raising GH gases...we are going to need a vibrant economy to make the next technological leap to a more 'Green'-based civilization.
Of course, populations are key. We'll likely get a major die off from war, viral plague or the fast-rising impotence of anti-biotics. GW will be a moot issue.
Now if one wants to talk respect, and reverence for 'mother earth'...or the Principle of Beauty as such affects societal health of our species...that's a whole nother animal. And probably far more productive that the scaremonger/sky is falling meme of the Authoritarian Left.
Back in the Hippie Days, when I was in the groove
...it was the Commies that were pushing the Global Cooling meme. Same now. And even if it's man's oil-based technology that is raising GH gases...we are going to need a vibrant economy to make the next technological leap to a more 'Green'-based civilization.
Of course, populations are key. We'll likely get a major die off from war, viral plague or the fast-rising impotence of anti-biotics. GW will be a moot issue.
Now if one wants to talk respect, and reverence for 'mother earth'...or the Principle of Beauty as such affects societal health of our species...that's a whole nother animal. And probably far more productive that the scaremonger/sky is falling meme of the Authoritarian Left.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 9:58 am to moneyg
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:03 am to GeeOH
I always wonder what caused climate change in the past as well. Many of the comparative dates are slightly before or during the Industrial Revolution. Our planet has gone through many warming and cooling periods. I'm no scientist, what is the primary evidence that THIS CHANGE is manmade versus all the other times that were just cyclical change?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:05 am to GumboPot
quote:
Meanwhile we'll probably need icebreaking funding for the Great Lakes:
LINK
Isn't it amazing that they just speak of the "pass" in that video. It freezes every fricking year! It started a little earlier this year and they make it out to be some unforeseen event...pisses me off.
Listen carefully, the pass is patrolled by 9 of these boats....they have been doing it for many many years.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:06 am to cokebottleag
quote:
Wouldn't warming open more fertile land in the arctic and antarctic regions?
Thus releasing more CO2 absorbing plant life.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:12 am to RCDfan1950
quote:
Now if one wants to talk respect, and reverence for 'mother earth'...or the Principle of Beauty as such affects societal health of our species...that's a whole nother animal. And probably far more productive that the scaremonger/sky is falling meme of the Authoritarian Left.
Agreed. Global "weather" is a farce to justify tax increases. There is nothing scientific behind it. I am, however, a very ardent advocate of keeping nature beautiful. Wanting lower polluting industries should be wanted by all, simply for the sake of keeping Earth beautiful, and being good stewards. You do not need legislation for that. The only thing you need for that is education. Teach your children to respect your surroundings, and nature.
Global warming is simply a political tool to take more taxes away from businesses.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:33 am to BugAC
Mars is undergoing the same changes as we are, please tell me how man is causing that.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:33 am to GeeOH
quote:
Isn't it amazing that they just speak of the "pass" in that video. It freezes every fricking year! It started a little earlier this year
Posted on 2/17/14 at 10:35 am to FT
quote:
There's no global temperature we're looking for. Please tell me that's not what you think.
No. He's got a perfectly valid point. The earth has warmed 1 degree since 1900. No one disputes that. This warming is causing all kinds of disasters (see Kerry and Gore speeches re: WMD last week).
Therefore, these disastrous effects would not take place if we returned to 1900 temps by cooling the earth 1 degree. I didn't realize 1900 was such a great year for weather.
Posted on 2/17/14 at 11:01 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
NC_Tigah
Thanks for proving the legitimacy of my question. Most in 20 years means it happens in the pass EVERY year but the "middle" of the lakes are freezing as much as they did 20 years ago! It's happened before MANY times in those lakes!
Not sure where you stand on this topic, but your post does nothing to show that it isn't cold every year around those lakes and hasn't been forever.
Help me understand your point
Posted on 2/17/14 at 11:06 am to GumboPot
quote:I don't know. I'm not a climate scientist. I haven't really paid attention to the debate. I don't have a side. His question sounded like the earth was supposed to have one particular temperature, which is about like saying everyone on earth, of all ages, should always all be the same height.
What are we looking for?
Posted on 2/17/14 at 11:09 am to GeeOH
quote:You seemed to be saying the news piece only referenced the interlake pass, and that freezes annually. Actually this year the freeze is a bit more extensive than the annual norm. Didn't know if you were aware. Nothing more.
Most in 20 years means it happens in the pass EVERY year but the "middle" of the lakes are freezing as much as they did 20 years ago! It's happened before MANY times in those lakes!
quote:correct.
your post does nothing to show that it isn't cold every year around those lakes and hasn't been forever.
This addresses temperature fluctuation over a slightly greater time span:
This post was edited on 2/17/14 at 11:34 am
Posted on 2/17/14 at 11:19 am to 90proofprofessional
quote:
if you're hearing about a single event like that in reference to climate change theory, from either side, you should ignore it as irrelevant to the debate. they're either stupid or trolling the other side
I have a friend I really like except for one thing. He really really wants climate change to be real and really wants it to have an adverse affect. His daily facebook climate update yesterday contained the good news that all the hysteria about the cold snowy winter down south is nothing to worry about, because January's average temp was only slightly below normal. He seems relieved.
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