- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
What separates Derek Jeter from Craig Biggio? Is it only rings?
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:05 am
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:05 am
Most people believe Jeter will be a 1st ballot HOFer. Biggio might get in after 3 tries.
Objectively, isn't Jeter just a glorified Biggio? The only thing he has on Biggio is WS rings, but that doesn't impress me. IF you play your whole career in NYY you're bound to have a few rings.
To compare:
1. both played premium positions. Biggio played 3 premium positions.
2. Career BA for Jeter- .312
Career BA for Biggio- .281
Jeter gets a pretty solid edge here.
3. Career HR for jeter- 256
Career HR for Biggio- 291
Slugging pct were about equal. .433 to .446. Jeter benefitted from playing in NY while Craig played most of his career in the Astrodome during his prime.
4. both have over 3000 hits
5. Craig was a much better runner. 348 SB to Craig's 414.
6. Craig's fielding metrics are also a lot better.
My question is this: Sure Jeter was a slightly better hitter than Craig. If Jeter played his career in HOU and Craig played his career in NY, would Biggio have been 1st ballot?
ETA: I'm no Astrostard either. I'm a braves fan, so I really have a deep dislike for both players.
Objectively, isn't Jeter just a glorified Biggio? The only thing he has on Biggio is WS rings, but that doesn't impress me. IF you play your whole career in NYY you're bound to have a few rings.
To compare:
1. both played premium positions. Biggio played 3 premium positions.
2. Career BA for Jeter- .312
Career BA for Biggio- .281
Jeter gets a pretty solid edge here.
3. Career HR for jeter- 256
Career HR for Biggio- 291
Slugging pct were about equal. .433 to .446. Jeter benefitted from playing in NY while Craig played most of his career in the Astrodome during his prime.
4. both have over 3000 hits
5. Craig was a much better runner. 348 SB to Craig's 414.
6. Craig's fielding metrics are also a lot better.
My question is this: Sure Jeter was a slightly better hitter than Craig. If Jeter played his career in HOU and Craig played his career in NY, would Biggio have been 1st ballot?
ETA: I'm no Astrostard either. I'm a braves fan, so I really have a deep dislike for both players.
This post was edited on 2/13/14 at 11:07 am
28
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:07 am to Moustache
yankees>stros
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:08 am to Moustache
quote:
I'm a braves fan, so I really have a deep dislike for both players.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:08 am to Moustache
Rings has a lot to do with it. I agree though if Biggio put up those same numbers for the Yankees he would be 1st ballot IMO.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:08 am to Geauxld Finger
quote:
yankees>stros
See, this here is why I don't even get mad when players try to go to NYY as soon as possible. It's the best possible thing a ballplayer could do for their career and legacy, unless you frick it up like Arod did.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:09 am to craigbiggio
quote:
craigbiggio
I don't dislike Biggio all that much, but my dad was a stros fan, and he was the biggest homer ever. So, naturally I disliked the astros.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:10 am to Moustache
I think this is a legit question because Jeter had two specific things going for him that inflated his resume:
1. He had immense popularity due to playing in New York and being good-looking and well-spoken. Half of his all-star appearances and gold gloves were based purely on popularity and non on-field performance.
2. He was always surrounded with talent. He was never unprotected in the lineup and picked up the rings thanks to having a team full of all-stars. That was also worth at least 10 batting average points.
1. He had immense popularity due to playing in New York and being good-looking and well-spoken. Half of his all-star appearances and gold gloves were based purely on popularity and non on-field performance.
2. He was always surrounded with talent. He was never unprotected in the lineup and picked up the rings thanks to having a team full of all-stars. That was also worth at least 10 batting average points.
This post was edited on 2/13/14 at 11:12 am
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:11 am to Moustache
To me winning rings when you play for the Yankees is what is expected. To do it for the Astros is a lot more difficult.
I don't know where I am going with this other than that if Jeter is first ballot Biggio should have been.
I don't know where I am going with this other than that if Jeter is first ballot Biggio should have been.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:12 am to Moustache
quote:
Career BA for Jeter- .312
Career BA for Biggio- .281
Huge difference between .280 and .310+
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:13 am to Moustache
the postseason accomplishments are stacked in jeter's favor.
i understand that he was on better teams throughout his career, but you can't fault him for being there or for succeeding when he was
i understand that he was on better teams throughout his career, but you can't fault him for being there or for succeeding when he was
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:14 am to Moustache
Talent
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:16 am to Moustache
they're somewhat close, but jeter was better
he was a better hitter, and the difference between jeter and biggio defensively is cancelled out by jeter playing a tougher position. they were both poor defenders for their positions
he was a better hitter, and the difference between jeter and biggio defensively is cancelled out by jeter playing a tougher position. they were both poor defenders for their positions
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:16 am to Moustache
quote:
IF you play your whole career in NYY you're bound to have a few rings.
Don Mattingly would like a word with you.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:16 am to Sevendust912
quote:
Huge difference between .280 and .310+
Of course there is. However, when you look at OPS+, they're remarkably similar.
Ballparks, Jeter being in a much better lineup, and Biggio having to face better pitching in the NL has a lot to do with it. I'm not saying it makes up the difference, but all things considered, it's a lot closer than .40. I'd say the difference is really around .10-.15 batting average points.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:17 am to The White Lobster
quote:
they're somewhat close, but jeter was better
I agree. BUt people are talking as if Jeter should be a unanimous vote in the HOF for the 1st time ever, when someone who is arguably close or equal to him is still not fricking in.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:19 am to Moustache
ops+ adjusts for league (nl vs. al) and for ballparks
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:19 am to Moustache
The Yankee national media hard-on makes a difference. And Jeter has rings. That is the major difference. And I will readily admit, as an avid Biggio fan, that his last few years were not great as he was just kinda chasing 3000.
Biggio hit .246 and .251 his last 2 years.
Jeter hit .316 in his most recent full year, at age 38.
Also...post season: Biggio batted .234 in relatively limited post-season action.
Jeter batted .308 in 158 post-season games...that is amazing that his post-seasons have added up to almost a full extra season.
And again, I am a die-hard Astro, so I present these facts begrudgingly....but facts are facts and that is why Jeter has a clear edge over Biggio.
Biggio hit .246 and .251 his last 2 years.
Jeter hit .316 in his most recent full year, at age 38.
Also...post season: Biggio batted .234 in relatively limited post-season action.
Jeter batted .308 in 158 post-season games...that is amazing that his post-seasons have added up to almost a full extra season.
And again, I am a die-hard Astro, so I present these facts begrudgingly....but facts are facts and that is why Jeter has a clear edge over Biggio.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:19 am to Moustache
Definitely an interesting comparison. What Biggio was able to accomplish at all of those positions is pretty ridiculous in this age of super-specialized players, especially considering that one of those positions was catcher.
I've always thought that Jeter's backhanded throw to home in the playoffs (or was it the WS?) is one of the most over-rated plays in sports history. Yes, it was a good, clutch play, but athletically, any ML infielder could have done it. So you have a pretty good point that he gets an enormous bump because of who he played for.
I've always thought that Jeter's backhanded throw to home in the playoffs (or was it the WS?) is one of the most over-rated plays in sports history. Yes, it was a good, clutch play, but athletically, any ML infielder could have done it. So you have a pretty good point that he gets an enormous bump because of who he played for.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:20 am to Moustache
quote:
What separates Derek Jeter from Craig Biggio?
Location, Location, Location.
Had Biggio played 20 years in New York, he would have had more rings, more all star appearances, more Gold Gloves and a stacked lineup around him his whole career. All of that would have gotten him the national media love that he didn't get in Houston
This post was edited on 2/13/14 at 11:21 am
Posted on 2/13/14 at 11:24 am to Moustache
First of all 30 pts in career BA is HUGE.
Also Jeter was always a beast in the post season. Regardless of what team he plays for, he performed on the biggest stage
Also Jeter was always a beast in the post season. Regardless of what team he plays for, he performed on the biggest stage
Page 1 of 8
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News