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Message
re: Official Hobbit The Desolation of Smaug Review Thread (spoilers)
Posted on 12/16/13 at 11:31 am to DMagic
Posted on 12/16/13 at 11:31 am to DMagic
quote:
The only real scene I had a problem with was Gandalf getting captured and his staff getting destroyed.
Yeah, why keep him alive? It seems that Sauron and Saruman had the opportunity to kill him, but they stupidly didn't take it. If they had killed him, they would have won the War for the Ring.
3
Posted on 12/16/13 at 11:38 am to OMLandshark
I don't think they were allied at this point
Posted on 12/16/13 at 11:49 am to leoj
quote:
I don't think they were allied at this point
I'm talking about in Fellowship when he has Gandalf imprisoned on the top of Isengard.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 12:03 pm to OMLandshark
To torture him for my information would be my guess. Gandalf did know an awful lot about the whereabouts of the ring, and a lot of other important things; Aragorn's identity etc.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 12:16 pm to udtiger
quote:
Yes there was. You only did not know it at the time. It would later be established in the Appendicies of LOTR that Necromancer = Sauron.
Boom
Posted on 12/16/13 at 12:18 pm to ZacAttack
quote:
To torture him for my information would be my guess. Gandalf did know an awful lot about the whereabouts of the ring, and a lot of other important things; Aragorn's identity etc.
The only thing he needs from Gandalf is to know where the One Ring is, and he gave him that information. It seems like Saruman was trying to force Gandalf into joining him.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 12:25 pm to OMLandshark
Perhaps Saruman didn't kill Gandalf because he knew that since he had turned to the dark side and was no longer truly Saruman the White that Gandalf would be reincarnated as Gandalf the White if he was ever killed, thus becoming equal to or even more powerful than Saruman. Gandalf the Gray had some neat tricks, but wasn't nearly as powerful as Saruman at the time.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 12:31 pm to Aubie Spr96
quote:
I keep patiently waiting for an explanation as to why Azog has been chasing the dwarves this whole time. I mean wtf? If they are gonna add that, at least tie it in to the plot line some how.
In the movie, it's because of his hatred for Thorin.
In the book, he was killed by Dáin during the war with the dwarves. His son, Bolg, led an army of Orcs, Wargs, and Bats to the Battle of Five Armies because they killed the Goblin King in Moria.
ETA: I think it's important to note that when comparing the movie to the book, you can't just compare the movie to one book (The Hobbit). There is an entire mythology that was created by Tolkien. Jackson does a very good job at tying a lot of it in. He also has to please an audience that might not have any knowledge of all the backstory. As a huge fan and owner of all the books (including the entire history of middle earth, that I still haven't finished reading), I'm satisfied by their efforts.
This post was edited on 12/16/13 at 12:55 pm
Posted on 12/16/13 at 12:48 pm to DMagic
quote:
The only real scene I had a problem with was Gandalf getting captured and his staff getting destroyed.
Yeah, there's some license there. I know he had been in Dol Guldur, because that's where he had found Thrain (and got the map and key). Of course, others had already noticed the staff Gandalf had in the first Hobbit movie was different from his in LOTR, so they had to close that loop. My one issue is that Sauron did not openly declare himself until later than the events of the Hobbit.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 1:17 pm to udtiger
quote:
My one issue is that Sauron did not openly declare himself until later than the events of the Hobbit
It kind of makes sense from Fellowship's approach. Saruman's quote to Gandalf:
"You know of what I speak, Gandalf. A great eye, lidless, wreathed in flame."
It appears Gandalf returned and give Saruman that description.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 1:52 pm to OMLandshark
I guess to create dramatic tension? I think making it like the appendices and making the battle between them epic but giving only vague hints at the necromancer's identity would've been more effective.
This post was edited on 12/16/13 at 2:03 pm
Posted on 12/16/13 at 6:22 pm to catholictigerfan
I like how the first face you see in the movie is Peter Jackson's.
Old costumes > new cgi... half of the movie looks like a video game.
Old costumes > new cgi... half of the movie looks like a video game.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 7:03 pm to Blue Velvet
tedious.
I just wanted it to get to the end. They had amazing source material to work from and they bloated it up so much that it's barely recognizable.
I really think the Hobbit series is Peter Jackson's George Lucas moment. Where he took an amazing work of art and let his ego run it into the ground.
I was disappointed with the movie...unlike the first three I was never immersed in the story of the first two hobbit movies.
I just wanted it to get to the end. They had amazing source material to work from and they bloated it up so much that it's barely recognizable.
I really think the Hobbit series is Peter Jackson's George Lucas moment. Where he took an amazing work of art and let his ego run it into the ground.
I was disappointed with the movie...unlike the first three I was never immersed in the story of the first two hobbit movies.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 7:22 pm to udtiger
Saruman also had intentions to get the one ring and defeat Sauron himself, and Gandalf being deemed the stronger of the 5 wizards was given Nayra one of the three rings the elves made, second only in power to the one ring so I don't think he could have actually defeated Gandalf had he really pushed the fight. Sauron didn't declare himself until later because he had no power to protect himself from an all out fight. He had put so much of his power into the ring that without it he was pretty weak. Just think it took Sauron a few thousand years to even regain enough strength to manifest his spirit, and start to put his plan into action.
Damn, I know way too much about this stuff.
Damn, I know way too much about this stuff.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 7:30 pm to asurob1
quote:
I really think the Hobbit series is Peter Jackson's George Lucas moment. Where he took an amazing work of art and let his ego run it into the ground.
Not at all. Great acting and great casting unlike what you speak of. The story is better and I can't wait for the 3rd one to tie all 3 movies perfectly together.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 8:56 pm to RceTigers
quote:
Not at all. Great acting and great casting unlike what you speak of. The story is better and I can't wait for the 3rd one to tie all 3 movies perfectly together.
The fan boy is strong in this one.
The casting and acting were fine. The screenplay was a truck wreck.
I LOVED, just LOVED how the security of the laketown was soooo tight that they had to sneak the dwarves in via fish in a barrel.
Yet, there is an entire Orc raiding party running along rooftops of the same town and nary a human even notices.
I can usually deal with plot holes and suspend my disbelief but that one stood out big time.
Terrible, simply terrible. Individual scenes were great...but strung together this movie is a mess. There was no need to divert from the source material and this is well off the mark.
Would not recommend. And would not recommend anyone who considers himself a tolkien fan.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 8:59 pm to asurob1
quote:
Would not recommend. And would not recommend anyone who considers himself a tolkien fan.
So much butt hurt on this one. The movies are getting praises. The next one will be great also.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 9:01 pm to asurob1
quote:i didn't catch that.
I LOVED, just LOVED how the security of the laketown was soooo tight that they had to sneak the dwarves in via fish in a barrel.
Yet, there is an entire Orc raiding party running along rooftops of the same town and nary a human even notices.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 9:16 pm to RceTigers
quote:
So much butt hurt on this one. The movies are getting praises. The next one will be great also.
By all means ignore the debate and keep repeating your mantra over and over.
Posted on 12/16/13 at 9:20 pm to Fearthehat0307
quote:
i didn't catch that.
I did. I had to think "where the frick is that security. That's a long arse bridge, and surely someone should have seen them coming.
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