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Brewing a Sour
I'd like to brew my first sour next year sometime. Preferably using dregs from my cantillon gueze. I have a few questions.
1) Do I need to supplement the yeast with another yeast for fermentation?
2) Should my sours finish dry?
3) Do i need to dedicate my fermenters/equipment that come in contact with the souring bacteria? Or will standard cleaning/sanitizing practices kill any residual bacteria?
4) Anything i need to keep in mind?
I'd like to brew my first sour next year sometime. Preferably using dregs from my cantillon gueze. I have a few questions.
1) Do I need to supplement the yeast with another yeast for fermentation?
2) Should my sours finish dry?
3) Do i need to dedicate my fermenters/equipment that come in contact with the souring bacteria? Or will standard cleaning/sanitizing practices kill any residual bacteria?
4) Anything i need to keep in mind?
quote:
1) Do I need to supplement the yeast with another yeast for fermentation?
No, if you use Cantillon dregs then you will have everything you need. However, it will probably take a year or more for that to mellow. The Cantillon dregs that I have used were pretty harsh when they were young.
quote:
2) Should my sours finish dry?
Yes, it should finish off below 1.005
quote:
3) Do i need to dedicate my fermenters/equipment that come in contact with the souring bacteria? Or will standard cleaning/sanitizing practices kill any residual bacteria?
I can't really speak to that, since all of my brews are some variation of wild ales.
quote:
4) Anything i need to keep in mind?
Patience
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by bigberg2000 on 12/13/14 at 1:04 pm to rds dc
Hey guys.
My mom wants to get my brother a decent brewing kit and I wanted to see if yall could check out this link to see if any of these are legit. I will be doing it with him more than likely so its sort of a gift for me as well. This is a local place so I wouldnt have to worry about shipping.
Kit with glass carboy
Here is what the one I am leaning towards includes for $135:
7.8 Gallon Bucket with Drilled & Grommeted Lid
5 Gallon Glass Carboy with Rubber Stopper
3-Piece Airlock (for Fermenting Bucket)
Adhesive Thermometer (for Fermenting Bucket)
Automatic Pump-style Siphon with 5' of flexible tubing
Dual Function Bottle Filler
Bottling Spigot with Bottle-fit Spout
Glass, Triple Scale Hydrometer
Twin-lever Capper
Beer Bottle Brush
8 oz of B-BRITE
My mom wants to get my brother a decent brewing kit and I wanted to see if yall could check out this link to see if any of these are legit. I will be doing it with him more than likely so its sort of a gift for me as well. This is a local place so I wouldnt have to worry about shipping.
Kit with glass carboy
Here is what the one I am leaning towards includes for $135:
7.8 Gallon Bucket with Drilled & Grommeted Lid
5 Gallon Glass Carboy with Rubber Stopper
3-Piece Airlock (for Fermenting Bucket)
Adhesive Thermometer (for Fermenting Bucket)
Automatic Pump-style Siphon with 5' of flexible tubing
Dual Function Bottle Filler
Bottling Spigot with Bottle-fit Spout
Glass, Triple Scale Hydrometer
Twin-lever Capper
Beer Bottle Brush
8 oz of B-BRITE
This post was edited on 12/13 at 1:10 pm
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by rds dc on 12/13/14 at 1:48 pm to bigberg2000
Here is something very similar for a good bit less and free shipping here.
You really don't need a glass carboy and can do just as well with a bucket. However, I like to use my glass carboy for bulk aging.
You really don't need a glass carboy and can do just as well with a bucket. However, I like to use my glass carboy for bulk aging.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by bigberg2000 on 12/14/14 at 8:28 am to rds dc
Yeah my friend who is big into brewing said he doesn't like glass. I guess I should go cheaper and just go with the bucket.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by BugAC on 12/14/14 at 12:12 pm to bigberg2000
Brewing today, question.
With the temperatures outside, i'm unsure on the method for fermentation control i should try for my ferm fridge. At night it gets cold enough to possibly use the fermwrap to keep it warm (66-68 using vermont IPA yeast from gigayeast). However, during the day it warms up to 70 degrees outside, which keeps my ferm fridge right at about ferm temps, maybe pushing it higher to 72.
Should i control the heat or the cold? Plug in the freezer and use the temp controller on that to avoid a 70 degree fermentation temp, which would be part of the day, or use the ferm wrap to keep the fermenter around 66. Right now, my ferm freezer is at 62 degrees just due to ambient temps.
With the temperatures outside, i'm unsure on the method for fermentation control i should try for my ferm fridge. At night it gets cold enough to possibly use the fermwrap to keep it warm (66-68 using vermont IPA yeast from gigayeast). However, during the day it warms up to 70 degrees outside, which keeps my ferm fridge right at about ferm temps, maybe pushing it higher to 72.
Should i control the heat or the cold? Plug in the freezer and use the temp controller on that to avoid a 70 degree fermentation temp, which would be part of the day, or use the ferm wrap to keep the fermenter around 66. Right now, my ferm freezer is at 62 degrees just due to ambient temps.
Don't think so. I'd have to have an additional temp controller. I think i'll just use the fermwrap to keep it from getting in the lower 60s. It's 70 degrees outside right now and my ferm chamber reads 62. So the more i think about it, i have less danger of too high ferm temps, than too low.
Another question, measured my pre-boil OG and in the beer thief, it measures 1.05, in the pot it measures 1.042. adjusted for heat and the beer thief would mean i have 105% mash efficiency, the pot would mean i have 78% efficiency. Why is there a difference? Shouldn't they both be the same?
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and for those curious of the grain bill.
80.5 IBU's, Estimated ABV = 8%
11 lbs 4.0 oz Maris Otter (Crisp) (4.0 SRM) Grain 9 79.3 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Caramel Malt - 60L (Briess) (60.0 SRM) Grain 10 10.6 %
14.0 oz Caraamber (30.0 SRM) Grain 11 6.2 %
9.0 oz Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) Grain 12 3.9 %
0.33 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - First Wort 75.0 min Hop 13 12.3 IBUs
0.25 oz Chinook [11.40 %] - First Wort 75.0 min Hop 14 9.1 IBUs
0.25 oz Chinook [11.40 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 15 7.9 IBUs
0.25 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 16 8.1 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 17 8.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Mosaic (HBC 369) [11.70 %] - Boil 30.0 m Hop 18 12.4 IBUs
0.75 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 19 12.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Cascade [6.90 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 20 4.7 IBUs
0.33 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 21 5.6 IBUs
0.50 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining 22 -
0.67 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 23 0.0 IBUs
0.46 oz Cascade [6.90 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 24 0.0 IBUs
0.45 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 25 0.0 IBUs
0.43 oz Chinook [11.40 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 26 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Vermont IPA (Gigayeast #GY054) Yeast 27 -
1.00 oz Cascade [6.90 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 28 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 29 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 30 0.0 IBUs
When i created the recipe I wanted the Mosaic to be added at every hop stage, coupled with other hops. Last years was great but i had efficiency problems due to brewing in the cold in high wind. Only had about 4.25 gallons made. This batch should be exactly what i'm shooting for. It tasted great last year.
Here's a pic from last years batch
80.5 IBU's, Estimated ABV = 8%
11 lbs 4.0 oz Maris Otter (Crisp) (4.0 SRM) Grain 9 79.3 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Caramel Malt - 60L (Briess) (60.0 SRM) Grain 10 10.6 %
14.0 oz Caraamber (30.0 SRM) Grain 11 6.2 %
9.0 oz Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) Grain 12 3.9 %
0.33 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - First Wort 75.0 min Hop 13 12.3 IBUs
0.25 oz Chinook [11.40 %] - First Wort 75.0 min Hop 14 9.1 IBUs
0.25 oz Chinook [11.40 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 15 7.9 IBUs
0.25 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 16 8.1 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 17 8.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Mosaic (HBC 369) [11.70 %] - Boil 30.0 m Hop 18 12.4 IBUs
0.75 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 19 12.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Cascade [6.90 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 20 4.7 IBUs
0.33 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 21 5.6 IBUs
0.50 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining 22 -
0.67 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 23 0.0 IBUs
0.46 oz Cascade [6.90 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 24 0.0 IBUs
0.45 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 25 0.0 IBUs
0.43 oz Chinook [11.40 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 26 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Vermont IPA (Gigayeast #GY054) Yeast 27 -
1.00 oz Cascade [6.90 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 28 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Mosaic [11.70 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 29 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Simcoe [12.30 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 30 0.0 IBUs
When i created the recipe I wanted the Mosaic to be added at every hop stage, coupled with other hops. Last years was great but i had efficiency problems due to brewing in the cold in high wind. Only had about 4.25 gallons made. This batch should be exactly what i'm shooting for. It tasted great last year.
Here's a pic from last years batch
This post was edited on 12/14 at 2:57 pm
So i'm cooling down my beer right now with my wort chillers. I typically wash them in pbw, and then soak them in star san before letting it touch my beer. Well, i usually rinse off the chillers prior to putting in the wort to chill. Well, i didn't this time, and now there is what appears to be, a sheen on the top of the wort. I hope this doesn't cause the brew to taste "coppery" or anything.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by BottomlandBrew on 12/14/14 at 8:00 pm to BugAC
IPA. Oil sheen. Sounds about right. RDWHAHB.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by Fratastic423 on 12/14/14 at 9:06 pm to BugAC
Well you cannot have above 100% mash efficiency, so I assume that is just wrongly calculated. There would be no reason for the difference unless for some reason the wort in the beer their was not mixed terribly well from the kettle.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by s14suspense on 12/15/14 at 6:42 am to BugAC
What's verloren?
Definition of overkill and worrying.
quote:
I typically wash them in pbw, and then soak them in star san before letting it touch my beer. Well, i usually rinse off the chillers prior to putting in the wort to chill.
Definition of overkill and worrying.
This post was edited on 12/15 at 8:12 am
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by LoneStarTiger on 12/15/14 at 8:08 am to BottomlandBrew
quote:
RDWHAHB.
Bug, you worry enough for me and you both
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by BottomlandBrew on 12/15/14 at 8:24 am to BottomlandBrew
IPA oil sheen. You should have seen the one I did with hop extract. Looked like the Deepwater Horizon in my kettle.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by Fratastic423 on 12/15/14 at 8:51 am to s14suspense
quote:
verloren
I assume he meant vorlauf, or the German term for recirculating some of the mash until it runs clear.
quote:
I typically wash them in pbw, and then soak them in star san before letting it touch my beer. Well, i usually rinse off the chillers prior to putting in the wort to chill.
Definition of overkill and worrying.
No doubt.
re: Homebrewing: In-Process ThreadPosted by BottomlandBrew on 12/15/14 at 9:23 am to Fratastic423
Since my brewing is now done off-site and my time is somewhat limited, I'm toying with the idea of doing a modified partigyle. Someone stop me if they see a problem. I'd like to do mash for a tripel, which would be almost 100% pilsner at around 16-17 lbs, and then afterwards add in a couple pounds of wheat malt to the mash tun and mash again and do a no-boil sour from those runnings. My main concern is extracting too much astringency from the pilsner with it essentially going through a mash, a sparge, and then another mash.
The tripel will be turned into a tripel IPA fermented with Crooked Stave brett. The partigyle runnings will be fermented with lacto and brett.
The tripel will be turned into a tripel IPA fermented with Crooked Stave brett. The partigyle runnings will be fermented with lacto and brett.
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