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re: The age old "why did they change the bats" argument (some interesting numbers)
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:11 am to Brohypnol
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:11 am to Brohypnol
The whole point of the BBCOR bats was to reduce ball speed off the bat to give the pitcher more time to react to line drives. Because they made the change in the name of safety, it will never go back. So changing the bats is not an option.
One solution people have discussed is moving in the fences. While this would solve the HR issue, I don't think it's viable for many reasons. First is that it could not be implemented across the sport. Not every program has the financial capacity to make such a drastic change. Another unintended consequence of moving in fences would be to lower batting avg. b/c the outfielders would have much less ground to cover; if you think of the outfield as part of circle, decreasing the radius of that circle significantly lowers the area inside.
I think the best, most obvious fix would be to change the balls. The ball speed off the bat would not change, but the ball would still carry further b/c of less drag. Less drag has two effects. The most obvious being air resistance is lowered, but it also allows the ball to spin faster (backspin to be specific) and maintain that spin which creates more pressure underneath the ball causing more lift. I also think it makes sense because it gives pitchers and scouts a better idea of how their 'stuff' would translate to the next level.
One solution people have discussed is moving in the fences. While this would solve the HR issue, I don't think it's viable for many reasons. First is that it could not be implemented across the sport. Not every program has the financial capacity to make such a drastic change. Another unintended consequence of moving in fences would be to lower batting avg. b/c the outfielders would have much less ground to cover; if you think of the outfield as part of circle, decreasing the radius of that circle significantly lowers the area inside.
I think the best, most obvious fix would be to change the balls. The ball speed off the bat would not change, but the ball would still carry further b/c of less drag. Less drag has two effects. The most obvious being air resistance is lowered, but it also allows the ball to spin faster (backspin to be specific) and maintain that spin which creates more pressure underneath the ball causing more lift. I also think it makes sense because it gives pitchers and scouts a better idea of how their 'stuff' would translate to the next level.
1
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:12 am to thunderbird1100
Just make roids legal in college ball to fix the numbers
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:14 am to burke985
But seriously they should use the same wood bats and balls the major players use and be done with the debate.
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:16 am to thunderbird1100
Last night’s game was a perfect example of how the game has changed for the worse. I am all for precision hitting and great defense but FAR TO MANY hits just die 2-3ft. from the fences.
Just to note, I love college sports in general just because it’s the kid’s pure passion to play the sport they choose.
That being said I saw more BAD strike calls last night then I care to remember and as far as the bats are concern I do not feel we need the caveman clubs of the 90's but at the very least something closer to the 2009 bats.
I felt it really evened out the game to the point you HAD to have good pitching to compete and you REWARDED those players who worked hard enough & were strong enough to hit HR's.
Watching the Indiana/Louisville game at some point was like watching paint dry, it even lost the crowd. Now this could also be that both teams are not as strong as the others but still a little stronger bat could have made it a little more exciting.
JMO
Just to note, I love college sports in general just because it’s the kid’s pure passion to play the sport they choose.
That being said I saw more BAD strike calls last night then I care to remember and as far as the bats are concern I do not feel we need the caveman clubs of the 90's but at the very least something closer to the 2009 bats.
I felt it really evened out the game to the point you HAD to have good pitching to compete and you REWARDED those players who worked hard enough & were strong enough to hit HR's.
Watching the Indiana/Louisville game at some point was like watching paint dry, it even lost the crowd. Now this could also be that both teams are not as strong as the others but still a little stronger bat could have made it a little more exciting.
JMO
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:20 am to burke985
quote:
But seriously they should use the same wood bats and balls the major players use and be done with the debate.
Louisville would love this but there are reasons it went to metal and it won't go back. Much like high school, there is a large array of skill level in college. On the low end, you would see broken bat after broken bat and the productivity would drop even more. On the high end, the ball speed off the bat would jump back up to its previous level which was the whole point of the change in the first place. The sweet spot on the wooden bat is small, but with the flexibility of wood compared to metal, the ball 'jumps' off the bat. This is why 'rolling' was so popular with composites; it created the trampoline effect.
This post was edited on 6/16/13 at 10:32 am
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:26 am to JAF65
quote:
Watching the Indiana/Louisville game at some point was like watching paint dry, it even lost the crowd. Now this could also be that both teams are not as strong as the others but still a little stronger bat could have made it a little more exciting.
Yep, I dare anyone to say these cws games so far are better than that final series we had with Texas back in 2009. Home runs just kept changing those games, it was awesome.
This post was edited on 6/16/13 at 10:28 am
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:29 am to tigerfoot
quote:
So the major league players really aren't better. Whew.
try google. I hear it's a miracle
Posted on 6/16/13 at 10:39 am to burke985
quote:
But seriously they should use the same wood bats and balls the major players use and be done with the debate.
Agree 100 %
If you keep up with wooden bat summer league, compare those stats to the regular season. You might be surprised
Posted on 6/16/13 at 11:51 am to LSUNV
quote:
Louisville would love this but there are reasons it went to metal and it won't go back. Much like high school, there is a large array of skill level in college. On the low end, you would see broken bat after broken bat and the productivity would drop even more. On the high end, the ball speed off the bat would jump back up to its previous level which was the whole point of the change in the first place. The sweet spot on the wooden bat is small, but with the flexibility of wood compared to metal, the ball 'jumps' off the bat. This is why 'rolling' was so popular with composites; it created the trampoline effect
Yeah i have played enough travel softball to know about how they can doctor up composites. They can also pop the end caps off and shave the inner walls on a lathe but that was really ovbious you were swinging illegal. Rolling just breaks the bats in faster which will in turn not last as long .I just think it would not be an issue with wood bats and i know you can doctor wood up too. But just think of the money universities would save also as you know how expensive a Metal/composite bats are.
Posted on 6/16/13 at 11:53 am to TigerCub
It's awful. I would like to see the schools move fences in as a revolt against this bullshite.
Posted on 6/16/13 at 11:57 am to burke985
You wouldn't save as much as you would think if at all. Decent woods are $60-$75 and with the number that would break, the cost would rise fast. Remember, not every team has top hitters 1-9. Small schools can get 4-7 bats a season whereas they may need 25-45 woods by the end of a season. And then there is the fall that would eat into that number as well when you can just use last year's metals.
Posted on 6/16/13 at 12:18 pm to ell_13
ell_13
Good point on the cost!
Good point on the cost!
Posted on 6/16/13 at 1:23 pm to ell_13
I see your point but metals crack too all on their own and to think the take bp, play games etc.etc alot of wear could come in to play with metals. I guess my main point im getting at is I think they would be better prepared for the next step if they all used the same equipment
Posted on 6/16/13 at 2:07 pm to ell_13
quote:
The whole point of the BBCOR bats was to reduce ball speed off the bat to give the pitcher more time to react to line drives. Because they made the change in the name of safety, it will never go back. So changing the bats is not an option.
I recall in the last year of BESR that some lines of composite bats ended up 15-20% over the allowable upper limit. That had something to do with the change. In addition, many of the newer MLB parks are hat boxes, + throw in Colorado, and it impacts the MLB HR totals. I would like to see +10-15% upside added to BBCOR, but am not holding my breath. It would seem MLB would prefer to evaluate college pitching using a similar ball to the minor league model, kind of surprised it has taken this long to consider it. The college game has much better overall athletes playing now compared to 15-yrs ago, there is a lot to appreciate about where the game is currently.
Posted on 6/16/13 at 3:03 pm to thunderbird1100
Maybe just maybe hitters are better in MLB
Posted on 6/16/13 at 3:07 pm to Tigah in the ATL
quote:
Maybe just maybe hitters are better in MLB
So are pitchers.
Posted on 6/16/13 at 3:11 pm to Tigah in the ATL
quote:
Maybe just maybe hitters are better in MLB
See above post. So are pitchers. Also, pitchers in MLB dont get huge strike zones.
This post was edited on 6/16/13 at 3:12 pm
Posted on 6/16/13 at 3:45 pm to thunderbird1100
quote:
tatistically more significant
quote:
Yep, just running over some numbers I found out that this years college 0.42 HR/gm average (per team) is less than half of the MLB 0.985 HR/gm average (per team). Whoa, wait a second. So MLB teams average just over twice the amount of HR/gm as college teams?
Z-test?
Posted on 6/16/13 at 3:55 pm to thunderbird1100
Talent in the collegiate level is diluted greatly compared to the major league level. Comparing apples to oranges.........
Posted on 6/17/13 at 12:26 am to thunderbird1100
quote:
So are pitchers. Also, pitchers in MLB dont get huge strike zones.
Should have said Power hitters....... that makes it clearer, and no need to mention the pitching....
Good mention on the fields, you have 30 teams, and several games are played at HR friendly confines...
Also good mention on the coaches also influencing the game... by choosing to avoid the HR game...
All influences on the game....
Could NCAA do more for the fans? maybe so
But this is real baseball...... and for the most part good baseball
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