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re: Why Can't the United States Assemble a Championship Soccer Team?
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:30 pm to theOG
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:30 pm to theOG
quote:
I'm not sure how better athletes would bring more competent coaches to the game.
Of course it would. If soccer were THE sport here, as it is in basically every country in the world (countries that matter at least), all of our sporting resources (including better teaching/coaching, better fans, better facilities/infrastructure, everything) would be dedicated to it.
quote:
i think he's stating that if soccer were the sport that demanded our "top athletes"
Key word here is demanded. If our country cared about the sport and didn't have our BEST athletes split between football, basketball, baseball, things would be different. Don't get me wrong, the guys we have on the national team are good athletes, but nowhere near the best our country has to offer. America churns out more elite athletes than any other country in the world, by far, and if all of our amazing resources were applied to soccer, we would dominate like the world has never seen. Just my opinion. I don't buy the popular argument among soccer diehards that having enough good athletes isn't the problem, it is THE problem. It's amazing that we compete as well as we do considering we are competing against countries that dedicate all their #1 resources, while we are basically dedicating our 4th best resources, if that makes sense. I'm not saying you could just throw Chris Paul or Reggie Bush out on the field, they would be good soccer players. What I'm saying is that if those type of guys, and other, picked up a soccer ball instead of a basketball or football when they were 5 years old, it would be a game changer at the highest levels.
It also doesn't help that our league is garbage, compared to the rest of the world. Once the MLS becomes elite, if ever, things will start to change. I understand these are a lot of hypotheticals and "if this, then that" statements, but thats kinda of the point of the argument isn't it.
2
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:34 pm to acgeaux129
They do "alright" because a select few countries have done an excellent job developing highly technical players in bunches.
Have you watched the rest of the continent play? I'm specifically talking about the teams who rely on athletic ability instead of technical proficiency. In fact, watch South Africa and Mali play in an hour and you will see that your argument holds no water.
Have you watched the rest of the continent play? I'm specifically talking about the teams who rely on athletic ability instead of technical proficiency. In fact, watch South Africa and Mali play in an hour and you will see that your argument holds no water.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:34 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
It has nothing to do with the "athletes" that do or do not play the game. All of the Percy Harvin's/Lebron James' of the US could play soccer, but it wouldn't matter because our technical skills and development would still be the same.
So much wrong in this post. It's mind-boggling to me that people actually believe this.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:38 pm to mynamebowl
quote:
I don't buy the popular argument among soccer diehards that having enough good athletes isn't the problem, it is THE problem.
It's far from THE problem. It would certainly be nice, but we can do much better with what we have. Our primary priority has been, and should be, to do better with what we have.
Athleticism just isn't that big of a deal. It's great if you have it, but you have to know how to use it. If you know how to play the game well enough to use it at the highest level, then you could probably play the game at a Teddy Sheringham pace, anyway.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:42 pm to mynamebowl
quote:
So much wrong in this post. It's mind-boggling to me that people actually believe this.
It's your mindset that is hindering development in the US. The US doesn't need the country's top athletes to succeed.
quote:
I'm not saying you could just throw Chris Paul or Reggie Bush out on the field, they would be good soccer players. What I'm saying is that if those type of guys, and other, picked up a soccer ball instead of a basketball or football when they were 5 years old, it would be a game changer at the highest levels.
I disagree. Under the current developmental system in the US, I doubt either one of those players would be an upgrade over any other player in our current pool.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 12:44 pm
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:47 pm to joey barton
quote:
It's far from THE problem. It would certainly be nice, but we can do much better with what we have. Our primary priority has been, and should be, to do better with what we have.
Athleticism just isn't that big of a deal. It's great if you have it, but you have to know how to use it. If you know how to play the game well enough to use it at the highest level, then you could probably play the game at a Teddy Sheringham pace, anyway.
I see where you're coming from, and I agree to a certain extent. What I am saying though is that if the best athletes we have played soccer, athleticism would be a huge deal. The major soccer-playing nations haven't seen athleticism like we have. Lack of athleticism isn't a major hindrance to the best teams/countries because they don't have the huge amounts of it that we do.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:48 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
It doesn't have to be either extreme because we are comparing two somewhat dissimilar concepts in this first place. I don't know what South Africa and Mali have to do with it. But I guess my argument holds no water because I think we should throw out everything else or whatever.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:53 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
It's your mindset that is hindering development in the US. The US doesn't need the country's top athletes to succeed.
In my opinion, it's your "woe is us" mentality that is the hindrance, not my "we have to be better" mindset. Of course we don't have to have the absolute best athletes, but some good ones would be nice.
quote:
I disagree. Under the current developmental system in the US, I doubt either one of those players would be an upgrade over any other player in our current pool.
Dude, I realize that. My argument is only valid IF things at the grassroots levels were different, huge if I know. The hypothetical situation I'm referencing here isn't using the current developmental system. It's basically pointless, I'm living in fantasy land. It's fun to talk about though.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 12:59 pm
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:56 pm to mynamebowl
Crap, this turned into a serious discussion. 
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:57 pm to acgeaux129
You brought up Africa. I'm just pointing out that it's a silly comparison considering they have sent 13 teams to the World Cup and have only reached the QF 1 more time than the US. It's actually an excellent example of the limits athletic ability has on the world stage.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 12:58 pm to mynamebowl
quote:
Dude, I realize that. My argument is only valid IF things at the grassroots levels were different, huge if I know. The hypothetical situation I'm referencing here isn't using the current developmental system. It's basically pointless, I'm living in fantasy land. It's fun to talk about though.
So did you just not read my post that you quoted and then said "So much wrong in this post."? Because you are saying the exact thing I said.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 1:14 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Dude I'm not saying these teams are the model. Their athleticism is a crutch that will help them possibly compete and yield better results than Mongolia or Afghanistan. I just don't see why we should write off developing our biggest strength in addition to focusing on skills development in youth system as a whole.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 1:15 pm to mynamebowl
quote:
Of course it would. If soccer were THE sport here, as it is in basically every country in the world (countries that matter at least), all of our sporting resources (including better teaching/coaching, better fans, better facilities/infrastructure, everything) would be dedicated to it.
This is a huge hypothetical. We still need to learn how to develop technically gifted players if we want to succeed on the world stage. Does Spain have the best athletes in the world? Hell no. But they do have the best soccer team in the world. Why you ask? Because of technical ability and the fact that their coaches know wtf they are doing. Ours do not. Even with additional resources, our talent development is really holding us back. The interest is there, and with a population of 315 million+, even with more attention paid to football and basketball, we have a sizeable (and athletic) population that is definitely interested in the game. We are getting better, but again, it will take time. Changing your youth development program has long term goals with little improvement in the short term.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 1:21 pm to acgeaux129
quote:
I just don't see why we should write off developing our biggest strength in addition to focusing on skills development in youth system as a whole.
We don't have to write it off by any means, it just isn't a necessity. Concentrating on keeping and developing the talent the sport already has, in addition to expanding and improving the youth development system, the domestic league and the grassroots of the sport, is the most efficient, logical and practical way to improve the sport in our country. Athletic ability will only marginally aid the process IMO.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 1:23 pm
Posted on 2/2/13 at 1:23 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
How does increasing athletes hurt any of that?
Posted on 2/2/13 at 1:33 pm to acgeaux129
Because athletic ability just isn't as important as you are making it out to be. Often times it actually hinders development because the individual begins to rely too heavily on his natural talent (speed, size, strength).
Of course, if you can blend the aspects perfectly (Cristiano Ronaldo) then you will have an all-world player. But it is extremely unlikely.
Of course, if you can blend the aspects perfectly (Cristiano Ronaldo) then you will have an all-world player. But it is extremely unlikely.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 2:13 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Xavi
Iniesta
Cazorla
Mata
Puyol
Lahm
Berbatov
These guys aren't exceptionally gifted athletes. They're certainly well conditioned to play a certain style of football, but I'm not taking Xavi in a foot race against Danny Williams.
In comparison to these guys, Michael Bradley looks like a superhuman athlete. Bradley is perpetually one of the leaders in distance covered in whatever competition he plays. Landon Donovan's speed isn't on par with someone like Adrian Peterson, but it does force international quality defenders to change tactics.
We have some of the best raw athletes in world football, outside of England, Germany, Brazil and West Africa. We just lack in technically gifted athletic players.
Iniesta
Cazorla
Mata
Puyol
Lahm
Berbatov
These guys aren't exceptionally gifted athletes. They're certainly well conditioned to play a certain style of football, but I'm not taking Xavi in a foot race against Danny Williams.
In comparison to these guys, Michael Bradley looks like a superhuman athlete. Bradley is perpetually one of the leaders in distance covered in whatever competition he plays. Landon Donovan's speed isn't on par with someone like Adrian Peterson, but it does force international quality defenders to change tactics.
We have some of the best raw athletes in world football, outside of England, Germany, Brazil and West Africa. We just lack in technically gifted athletic players.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 3:05 pm to thenry712
That list goes on and on. Like I said, there is a reason there are only a small handful of Cristiano's, Zlatan's, Eto'o's, etc.. Athleticism only gets you so far, and in plenty of cases, it hinders development.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 3:06 pm
Posted on 2/2/13 at 3:21 pm to acgeaux129
quote:
Soccer is the preeminent finesse/skill team sport in the world
C'mon, bro. Even NBA basketball requires more overall athleticism than the soccer.
Posted on 2/2/13 at 3:35 pm to Womski
quote:
We have some of the best raw athletes in world football, outside of England, Germany, Brazil and West Africa. We just lack in technically gifted athletic players.
Yes, exactly..people don't realize that we do typically trot out bigger, superior athletes against just about every nation sans a few. Our MNT is stocked full of world class athletes, they're just lacking the technique to be world class footballers..
quote:
Even NBA basketball requires more overall athleticism than the soccer
lol, NBA is basically Dunkball, it's a joke.
This post was edited on 2/2/13 at 3:39 pm
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