re: Conversation between Scott Long and Mike Detillier

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That said, there is a difference between actually understanding some of the struggles that we have had trying to get back on track since Crowton's mishandling of the 08/09 seasons and being "complacent" in a "happy little boat".

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"Sailing, sailing..." Try to explain it away, excuse it, blame Crowton, "understand the struggles" all you want.

Complacency is complacency. The shoe fits. Wear it.

While this may be a revelation to some, what these guys are sayin everyone already knows. An idiot can look at LSU on TV and know that this is a team that for some reason(and I'm really clownin on that) hardly throws the damn ball on offense except in certain situations. And you cannot win the important games like that, last year's title game was really painful to watch, let alone experiencing more of the same this season. In the Chik bowl the O Line protection was horrible, hope that straightens out next season.

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An idiot can look at LSU on TV and know that this is a team that for some reason(and I'm really clownin on that) hardly throws the damn ball on offense except in certain situations. And you cannot win the important games like that,

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Take a guess at which BCS champ had less passing attempts than LSU this year?

When did I call anyone names?

And when did I say all is well.and keep everything the way it is?

You see, when people who believe 100% the same as you do that the O needs to improve dramatically, yet believe Miles and his staff are capable of achieving that improvement, we are "complacent" and sailing in denial.

Why?

Bill Belicheck is probably the best coach in NFL history, and widely regarded as a defensive mastermind, yet for the past several years his defenses have been among the worst in the NFL. He has not won a championship since 2004. Are Patriots fans in denial.and complacent?

He has won in different ways based on the talent at his disposal and their strengths.

For 4 years, despite every effort in recruiting, LSU simply did not have QBs able to fully attack SEC defenses. So, after fielding the #1 offense in LSU history in 2007, he realized after the 08 INT fest that he needed to limit their exposure to hurt the team, so he slammed the brakes and reverted to picking and choosing when to take shots with them. It was frustrating as hell to watch, but those teams were guided to wins much more often than not, and steadily increased the wins every year from 08-11.

This year, with a promising new QB, OL and WR issues held us back despite showing promising flashes of improvement in several big games.

Many of us are excited about what that means for next year with a consistent OL lineup and a few more explosive options at WR than the slot type receivers we relied on this year.

But it's impossible to have discussions about those hopes without constantly being bombarded by the Miles is stoopid brigade, and that just gets a little old.

So, we'll all just have to wait and see if the bottom falls out the way the same brigade predicted in 08, 09, and 2010, when we improved every year until we went on LSUs record breaking 13-0 SEC Champion run in 2011 before the unfortunate and unprecedented rematch gave the brigade their long awaited TOLD YOU SO!!!

I've made my hopes and reasoning pretty clear. I have no doubt you'll be back to gleefully point out my error if 2013 is a bottom half O again.

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Shouldn't the same reasoning apply to players everywhere? Why don't we see players leaving other schools in the numbers that leave LSU early? If it's because we have more NFL quality players, then that just shows that LSU coaches aren't getting the most out of them, or they would be winning NCs the way Bama does.

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Well, miami and usc used to have 5-6 guys levae early in back to back seasons. LSU has never had that. It was the best class we ever had and the timing is why so many are leaving.

You guys can bash miles for a lot of things, but yall are going way too far this time. There is no descension in this program and you guys are seriously reaching and trying to take any jab at Miles.

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BUT, the parts that make others stay, like B Jones @ Bama or Barkley @ USC or Murray @ Georgia, is that they know they will have the opprtunity to put up big #s and get better thru coaching. I mean they are CONFIDENT in the system and coaching.

Right now, LSU's players do not have that confidence, with damn good reason, to think that LSU will change anything to fix the 3rd yr of struggles. Remember, although they are young men, these guys know more about what's going on than you will ever know about the issues.

SO everyone quit bashing people for saying why players leave. Whats going on is they aren't finding confident reasons to stay, which is spot on.

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So majority of guys are from defense. So you are saying these guys have no confidence in chavis and co?

Look i can bash you fir being an idiot.

If chavis has saved Les his job, then why are so many defenders jumping ship? Shouldnt we have lost all the jr rbs, lineman and receivers?

Barkley cost himself millions. He will never get the money back he has lost by staying. He would have been a first round pick and already made a years salary. He is now never getting that back.

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When did I call anyone names?

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For starters, let's take a look at your last post to me...

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you clearly don't understand shite.

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I guess that's your friendly way of calling somebody you don't really know stupid. And then you said...

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You and your ilk all bitch and moan

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Me and my ilk? I suppose lumping all the "stupids" together into one pathetic bundle makes you more of a man and a better LSU fan? But then you said...

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mainly because you don't know what the frick you're talking about.

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What is this? A friendly way of describing somebody? A mature way to persuade someone who has a differing point of view? Or simply an ad hominem attack, which you can get away with in the anonymity of a team message board?

Seems like you have anger issues, T.VD. But your rationalizing that you didn't call names isn't gonna fly. You're too rich a source of quotes to deny it.

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You see, when people who believe 100% the same as you do that the O needs to improve dramatically, yet believe Miles and his staff are capable of achieving that improvement, we are "complacent" and sailing in denial.

Why?

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Now let me say this. What you posted there, I can almost totally agree with and say we're close to even in our assessment. Except I think Coach Miles has to do more than tweak his offensive staff. I don't have confidence in their ability to perform on the elite level. And I think that Coach Miles does not have a real aptitude for calling offensive plays during a game situation. So I believe that Coach Miles and a real OC hire other than Studwara can turn the LSU offensive problems around. But Coach is going to have to do the heavy lifting and make the changes, like soon or 2013 isn't necessarily going to be pretty.

And Coach Miles is no Bill Belichick. And I can't speak for Patriot fans, as to whether they are in denial or complacent. So I'll leave that little segment alone.

I do think that to accept as fact that

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despite every effort in recruiting, LSU simply did not have QBs able to fully attack SEC defenses

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is giving a little too much benefit of the doubt to the offensive end of LSU football. It is the basic function of coaching to take average or above average players and coach them up to a competitive level. We see this on so many, many teams every year. Not all are born Tim Tebows or Johnny Footballs. Most reasonably successful QBs have been coached well and are given an offense they can operate within their skill set. Not sure that happens at LSU, and I believe that's what we're looking at when we see QBs who aren't performing up to expectations, underutilized tight ends, and wide receivers who can't, don't, or won't receive.
Regarding Mett and a hoped-for revitalized OL...

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Many of us are excited about what that means for next year with a consistent OL lineup and a few more explosive options at WR than the slot type receivers we relied on this year. But it's impossible to have discussions about those hopes without constantly being bombarded by the Miles is stoopid brigade, and that just gets a little old.

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I can understand that. But lumping every concerned poster into your "Miles is stoopid brigade" bundle isn't fair or even particularly helpful to having real discussions about hopes, concerns, and differences of opinion. Sorry you're tired of it, but a lot of us are tired of Coach Miles making promises he doesn't keep about players and schemes, and his trying to force square pegs into round holes on the field and on the coaching staff (see: Malveto, Studwara). A lot of us believe that while LSU has been among the elites during the period of the 2003-2011, LSU could have stood alone as "the" elite. Especially last year 2011. And we are frustrated to see the success a certain Nick Saban has had at Alabama during his tenure there and are tired of being accused of being on his bandwagon because we point to a coach who "gets" it and does the hard work of coaching with attention to excellence, excellent use of his personnel and staff, and attention to every game detail. Not that I want him back at LSU. I do believe that Coach Miles is every bit his equal when he's focused; plus he appears to be a much nicer, friendlier face on the Tiger sidelines than Saban. I just don't know what it takes to keep CLM focused and that is a frustration. Seems like there's always some aspect of the LSU game that's flapping in the wind like a flyaway tarp on a truck bed.

Anyway, I'm not too sure we're all that far apart on our hopes or expectations for LSU and Coach Miles. I do want the guy to succeed beyond any of our wildest dreams. I do think he's a decent guy. But I wish he'd fix things sooner, rather than later, when things are broken. And this offense and our QBs and WRs have been broken to some degree or another for lo unto five years now. Excluding the outlier year 2011, of course.

Great post dude. See, now we're talking.


We've all watched the same games. We all have similar complaints.

I really always try to step back and look at the big picture. I tend to think the good has outweighed the bad, while you just seem to have kind of hit your limit.

I'm expecting big things from the O next season, and I'm confident the complaints that we've all had since 1/9 are going to disappear next year the way they did after we upset Bama in 2010, setting up the great run we saw in 2011.

Before that game, things were as bleak as I've ever seen on this board with people so hung up on the OM 09 and UT 10 meltdowns, that very few of us believed that the run we were about to go on was possible.

Miles righted the ship then, and I think he'll get us back on track again.

Posts like that one will never bother me cause it's well thought out and you support your position.

It's the knee jerk simplistic and ulterior motivated reactions that I just won't ever respect.

Discussions like these are what this board should be about.