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Started By
Message
What players on our team have the ability to get BETTER?
Posted on 1/18/11 at 10:10 am
Posted on 1/18/11 at 10:10 am
Let's start making a list, checking it twice. Guys who are on the upside? downside? and guys that may hold par another couple years?
Upside
Malcom Jenkins
Jimmy Graham
Jonathan Casillas (? off injury?)
Jabari Greer (really, holding par at best IMO?)
Tracy Porter
Patrick Robinson
Charles Brown
Matt Tennant
Chase Daniel
Adrian Arrington
Chris Ivory
Sedrick Ellis
Garret Hartley
Thomas Morestead
Downside
Darren Sharper
Roman Harper (no holding par? still young?)
Devery Henderstone
Will Smith
Alex Brown
Jeremy Shockey
Jonathan Stinchcomb
Randal Gay
Pierson Prioleu
Hold Par
Drew Brees
Jonathan Vilma
Scott Shanle
Marques Colston
Upside
Malcom Jenkins
Jimmy Graham
Jonathan Casillas (? off injury?)
Jabari Greer (really, holding par at best IMO?)
Tracy Porter
Patrick Robinson
Charles Brown
Matt Tennant
Chase Daniel
Adrian Arrington
Chris Ivory
Sedrick Ellis
Garret Hartley
Thomas Morestead
Downside
Darren Sharper
Roman Harper (no holding par? still young?)
Devery Henderstone
Will Smith
Alex Brown
Jeremy Shockey
Jonathan Stinchcomb
Randal Gay
Pierson Prioleu
Hold Par
Drew Brees
Jonathan Vilma
Scott Shanle
Marques Colston
This post was edited on 1/18/11 at 11:26 am
Posted on 1/18/11 at 10:57 am to Chad504boy
Jenkins -- upside
Vilma -- hold par
Casillas -- upside
Harper/Sharper -- downside
Porter/Greer/PRob -- upside
Graham -- huge upside
Vilma -- hold par
Casillas -- upside
Harper/Sharper -- downside
Porter/Greer/PRob -- upside
Graham -- huge upside
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:06 am to Ice Cold
cool, see above comments on few players
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:06 am to Chad504boy
Any player (Brees included) that cannot get better in some way should be cut.
JMO
ok...not breesus
JMO
ok...not breesus
This post was edited on 1/18/11 at 11:08 am
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:08 am to Chad504boy
my stock watch off the cuff report, I relate to contracts/keepability as well as performance...
UP
Graham to superstar
David Thomas steadily more significant
Charles Brown to possibly replace Bushrod
Tennant to replace Goodwin
Nicks- some think he might be better than Jahri. Affording the highest paid guards in history could be tricky tho
Jahri- not as good of a year as '09, needs to return to be on HOF track
Bushrod still can improve (he's not studly but not a terrible LT)
Strief I've wondered if he might be a better RT starter
Ivory to learn how to block and catch
Arrington might finally force his way into a role
Meachem has a role, improved, but has more potential
Lance Moore could reach all pro level beyond '08 numbers
Daniel as a continuing backup might score a draft pick in a trade one day ala Charlie Whitehurst
Brees reducing the picks back to his career average will keep him in the top 3 discussion
Ellis had his best year ever and can elevate to elite
Ayodele went from stopgap to kinda okay, still can do more
Casillias we were looking for him to be a starter
Patrick Robinson can reach a point to challenge for starting
Porter/Greer- either could elevate to all pro, might be who can stay healthy enough
Jenkins has All Pro potential at FS
Hartley showed all you need to be the kicker of the future after his return, no more slumps
Morstead will do some pro bowls before he's done
If the replacement LS can stick that's upside
DOWN
Shockey- age, injuries, and budding cheaper players mean he could be gone or back in a decreasing role renegotiated
Bushrod- could not be re-signed and replaced or moved to RT or backup if affordable
Goodwin- performance wise he still could have some miles left but the contract will determine if he's back at all
Stinch- may have had the most decline from '09 of any Saints player. Being not too spendy contract wise and a clubhouse leader might keep him employed as much as his play.
Devery seemed to lose some quickness which is his job, recurrence of his old dropsies
Will Smith and Alex Brown could be at diminishing returns age
Gay- contract, age, injuries, budding stars at CB make him unlikely to return
Prioleau GW likes but what is he 40? lol
Sharper only back if he takes Saints money offer to be backup mentor again
Kyle- an old LS that IRs can't have much left
Flat
Shanle is what he is
Dunbar and the other assorted rotating LBs ditto
Vilma defined very good player maybe not elite
Colston Mr. Steady
Harper is how he is, good pts, weak pts, I dunno if I think of him nearly as highly at bigger money
Special category for all RBs other than Ivory: I can imagine a scenario where they clean house and say let's pay somebody that can stay on the field. I can also imagine PT & Reggie (Hamilton, Hill, etc)back at affordable deals and doing better than ever. The ying yang RB dichotomy I call them.
UP
Graham to superstar
David Thomas steadily more significant
Charles Brown to possibly replace Bushrod
Tennant to replace Goodwin
Nicks- some think he might be better than Jahri. Affording the highest paid guards in history could be tricky tho
Jahri- not as good of a year as '09, needs to return to be on HOF track
Bushrod still can improve (he's not studly but not a terrible LT)
Strief I've wondered if he might be a better RT starter
Ivory to learn how to block and catch
Arrington might finally force his way into a role
Meachem has a role, improved, but has more potential
Lance Moore could reach all pro level beyond '08 numbers
Daniel as a continuing backup might score a draft pick in a trade one day ala Charlie Whitehurst
Brees reducing the picks back to his career average will keep him in the top 3 discussion
Ellis had his best year ever and can elevate to elite
Ayodele went from stopgap to kinda okay, still can do more
Casillias we were looking for him to be a starter
Patrick Robinson can reach a point to challenge for starting
Porter/Greer- either could elevate to all pro, might be who can stay healthy enough
Jenkins has All Pro potential at FS
Hartley showed all you need to be the kicker of the future after his return, no more slumps
Morstead will do some pro bowls before he's done
If the replacement LS can stick that's upside
DOWN
Shockey- age, injuries, and budding cheaper players mean he could be gone or back in a decreasing role renegotiated
Bushrod- could not be re-signed and replaced or moved to RT or backup if affordable
Goodwin- performance wise he still could have some miles left but the contract will determine if he's back at all
Stinch- may have had the most decline from '09 of any Saints player. Being not too spendy contract wise and a clubhouse leader might keep him employed as much as his play.
Devery seemed to lose some quickness which is his job, recurrence of his old dropsies
Will Smith and Alex Brown could be at diminishing returns age
Gay- contract, age, injuries, budding stars at CB make him unlikely to return
Prioleau GW likes but what is he 40? lol
Sharper only back if he takes Saints money offer to be backup mentor again
Kyle- an old LS that IRs can't have much left
Flat
Shanle is what he is
Dunbar and the other assorted rotating LBs ditto
Vilma defined very good player maybe not elite
Colston Mr. Steady
Harper is how he is, good pts, weak pts, I dunno if I think of him nearly as highly at bigger money
Special category for all RBs other than Ivory: I can imagine a scenario where they clean house and say let's pay somebody that can stay on the field. I can also imagine PT & Reggie (Hamilton, Hill, etc)back at affordable deals and doing better than ever. The ying yang RB dichotomy I call them.
This post was edited on 1/18/11 at 11:14 am
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:08 am to goatmilker
quote:
Any player (Brees included) that cannot get better in some way should be cut.
JMO
I don't see players like vilma getting better, even Colston and moore holding par.... sometimes holding par is all you can ask for at certain points of careers.
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:08 am to goatmilker
Based on this year, Brees could make better decisions, if that counts.
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:16 am to blueslover
quote:
David Thomas steadily more significant
Bushrod still can improve (he's not studly but not a terrible LT)
Strief I've wondered if he might be a better RT starter
Meachem has a role, improved, but has more potential
Lance Moore could reach all pro level beyond '08 numbers
Ayodele went from stopgap to kinda okay, still can do more
/Greer- either could elevate to all pro, might be who can stay healthy enough
I'm going to disagree with you about most of these players. I think most of these player's talent's are just about maxed out already.
Posted on 1/18/11 at 11:32 am to Chad504boy
Thomas- if it's just Graham and him then that means more
Bushrod I have on both up and down. The club will determine his fate here
Strief could start for many teams at RT if Stinch wasn't so affordable and leader he might here
Meachem was dinged for at least the first third of the season. Healthy I think he could push his '09 numbers by 30%- which would challenge for team leadership
Moore to 80+ catches isn't outrageous and a 25% in production
Ayodele definitely improved, a lotta the DT plugger types get better with age
Greer was more often stuck solo on opponents best WR, I count that as the team's vote on who is better
Bushrod I have on both up and down. The club will determine his fate here
Strief could start for many teams at RT if Stinch wasn't so affordable and leader he might here
Meachem was dinged for at least the first third of the season. Healthy I think he could push his '09 numbers by 30%- which would challenge for team leadership
Moore to 80+ catches isn't outrageous and a 25% in production
Ayodele definitely improved, a lotta the DT plugger types get better with age
Greer was more often stuck solo on opponents best WR, I count that as the team's vote on who is better
Posted on 1/19/11 at 10:48 am to blueslover
If the staff doesn't believe that Charles Brown is ready to become a starter, then we definitely need a OT in the draft. Stinch's performance went way down and he needs to be a backup next year, and Bushrod failed to make any progress from last year. We can't win with an average LT and a mediocre RT.
Posted on 1/19/11 at 2:13 pm to Chad504boy
Talking about JUST getting better, and not includinf contributing more, I'll limit it to mostly 1st or 2nd year players. So that includes:
Jenkins
Graham
Casillias
Robinson
Brown
Tennant
Daniel
Ivory
-Greer didn't have a good of a year as last year, but he's still a damn cood QB; but he's also near 30, so I don't see him getting any better.
-Porter MAY get a little better
There are some players that hold par, but may contribute more and put up better stats. To me those are:
-AA is what he is. He may put up better stats by getting more chances.
-D. Thomas is par as well. With Jimmy likely to become our main TE pass catcher next year, he'll stay in the same role with Shockey either being cut or injured.
-Moore is par. He's going to be solid for a few years, hopefully we keep him around.
-I'll go with the whole O-line as par, which means we need to start looking for another toung tackle in the draft. Bushrod and Stich were both pretty bad last year and I don't see them improving after both being in the league for as long as they have. I'd be pretty happy to see us go OT early again this year.
Harper is NOT on the downside. He got abused against Seattle, but he's still young and is going to be just as agood for a while.
Jenkins
Graham
Casillias
Robinson
Brown
Tennant
Daniel
Ivory
-Greer didn't have a good of a year as last year, but he's still a damn cood QB; but he's also near 30, so I don't see him getting any better.
-Porter MAY get a little better
There are some players that hold par, but may contribute more and put up better stats. To me those are:
-AA is what he is. He may put up better stats by getting more chances.
-D. Thomas is par as well. With Jimmy likely to become our main TE pass catcher next year, he'll stay in the same role with Shockey either being cut or injured.
-Moore is par. He's going to be solid for a few years, hopefully we keep him around.
-I'll go with the whole O-line as par, which means we need to start looking for another toung tackle in the draft. Bushrod and Stich were both pretty bad last year and I don't see them improving after both being in the league for as long as they have. I'd be pretty happy to see us go OT early again this year.
Harper is NOT on the downside. He got abused against Seattle, but he's still young and is going to be just as agood for a while.
This post was edited on 1/19/11 at 2:15 pm
Posted on 1/19/11 at 5:38 pm to Chad504boy
Call me crazy but I still think Roman Harper's best years are ahead of him
Posted on 1/19/11 at 8:35 pm to rebeltider
I wouldn't expect anyone with your sig pic to say anything else.
Posted on 1/19/11 at 8:45 pm to mm2316
I was kinda hoping Mark Barron declared if Harper would not be back. He looks even better IMO
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