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Started By
Message
So I want to go to Europe...
Posted on 12/9/08 at 11:33 pm
Posted on 12/9/08 at 11:33 pm
I have never been anywhere outside the US except Canada...and touring Europe is the one thing I want to do more than anything else.
The problem is that I'm a graduate student and I'm poor. I graduate in May '10 and my program is one that gives me a reasonable possibility of making at least $60k when I get out (yes I know there are no guarantees I'll find work, but I believe I will). However, I will have very significant student loan debt when I get out, but I have no CC or car loan debt as of now.
The (rough) plan is to fly to Paris, then take the trains to Brussels, Amsterdam, Frankfurt or Dusseldorf, Berlin, Auschwitz, Prague, Vienna, Munich, Interlaken and then finish in either Bordeaux or Barcelona before flying home. We think this would take about a month.
After doing research and talking to people that have been backpacking through Europe, we are under the impression that we will spend about $100/day for a total of $3k. Furthermore, flight + rail pass + cabs/buses will be another $2500. Then we'll throw in an additional $500 for a couple of nights out (honestly, drinking is not the point of this trip) and a souvenir or two. Final tally: $6k, though I'll try like hell to come in under that number
I want to take the trip as soon as I graduate. I am worried that if I don't take it at that time, it may never happen (or at least it won't be this length).
question 1) Is Europe/this trip worth it, from your personal experience?
Assume that I have $3k saved to actually drop on the trip and I put the other half on a CC with a really high limit and interest rate, then get home and transfer to a 0% introductory rate on another card to buy me time to pay it off in the next year. I am also aware CC companies will charge 3% on the balance transfer.
question 2) is this the best way for me to finance this trip?
question 3) if I waited a few years until I actually have money, what are the chances any company I work for will allow me to take all my paid vacation + unpaid time off (like a temporary leave?) to take the same trip? It seems unlikely I'll have a job with 30 vacation days per year
Sorry this is really long...but I need advice on the "worthiness" of such a trip and how to pay for it. Thanks!
The problem is that I'm a graduate student and I'm poor. I graduate in May '10 and my program is one that gives me a reasonable possibility of making at least $60k when I get out (yes I know there are no guarantees I'll find work, but I believe I will). However, I will have very significant student loan debt when I get out, but I have no CC or car loan debt as of now.
The (rough) plan is to fly to Paris, then take the trains to Brussels, Amsterdam, Frankfurt or Dusseldorf, Berlin, Auschwitz, Prague, Vienna, Munich, Interlaken and then finish in either Bordeaux or Barcelona before flying home. We think this would take about a month.
After doing research and talking to people that have been backpacking through Europe, we are under the impression that we will spend about $100/day for a total of $3k. Furthermore, flight + rail pass + cabs/buses will be another $2500. Then we'll throw in an additional $500 for a couple of nights out (honestly, drinking is not the point of this trip) and a souvenir or two. Final tally: $6k, though I'll try like hell to come in under that number
I want to take the trip as soon as I graduate. I am worried that if I don't take it at that time, it may never happen (or at least it won't be this length).
question 1) Is Europe/this trip worth it, from your personal experience?
Assume that I have $3k saved to actually drop on the trip and I put the other half on a CC with a really high limit and interest rate, then get home and transfer to a 0% introductory rate on another card to buy me time to pay it off in the next year. I am also aware CC companies will charge 3% on the balance transfer.
question 2) is this the best way for me to finance this trip?
question 3) if I waited a few years until I actually have money, what are the chances any company I work for will allow me to take all my paid vacation + unpaid time off (like a temporary leave?) to take the same trip? It seems unlikely I'll have a job with 30 vacation days per year
Sorry this is really long...but I need advice on the "worthiness" of such a trip and how to pay for it. Thanks!
11
Posted on 12/9/08 at 11:52 pm to Feed Me Popeyes
I would work and take vacation time and do it later.......
In todays economy you don't want anymore debt.
In todays economy you don't want anymore debt.
Posted on 12/9/08 at 11:52 pm to Feed Me Popeyes
quote:
1) Is Europe/this trip worth it, from your personal experience?
Europe, no - it's too developed. Go somewhere that is on the way but not there yet. South America may be more rewarding than Europe these days. Stick with the less-developed areas wherever you go - you'll find they're generally just fine anyway, are a lot cheaper and you can still tell your grandchildren. Your biggest expense should be a Canon G9.
quote:
is this [credit cards] the best way for me to finance this trip?
No. Get a job washing dishes. Seriously - living there gives the best reward, however you pay the bills. If you aren't working to pay the bills you aren't experiencing what it's like.
quote:
if I waited a few years until I actually have money, what are the chances any company I work for will allow me to take all my paid vacation + unpaid time off (like a temporary leave?) to take the same trip?
Be good enough that your boss will be delighted to hire you back on your return.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 12:02 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Rent "A Map for Saturday."
It's a documentary about a guy who quit his job at HBO Sports and traveled for a year.
It's a documentary about a guy who quit his job at HBO Sports and traveled for a year.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 12:33 am to L S Usetheforce
quote:Yeah this isn't going to happen. It's now or never.
I would work and take vacation time and do it later.......
quote:True. I absolutely would not fund this via credit card - there's got to be a way you can scrounge up an extra G or two. Also, I think your $6,000 budget is extravagant for a grad student. Stay in hostels, don't eat out every meal, and you should be able to come in for far less than that amount.
In todays economy you don't want anymore debt.
ETA: I disagree with the poster who said go to S. America instead. Go where you want. You sound like you really want to go to Europe and (given the cities you listed) make a "cultural tour." S. America would be awesome if you want an outdoors adventure trip, but not for a culture trip. Bottom line, if you're going to spend the money, you should do what you want to do.
This post was edited on 12/10/08 at 12:38 am
Posted on 12/10/08 at 12:39 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Go to South America. Argentina is a lot like Italy and Spain, better looking women and dirt cheap because their economy is a disaster
This post was edited on 12/10/08 at 12:40 am
Posted on 12/10/08 at 2:48 am to usc6158
Going to disagree about the South America over Europe option as well. Cheaper? Definitely. But for someone who hasnt been outside of the US and wants to get out and travel, you'll enjoy Europe much much more.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 3:49 am to Htown Tiger
I vote South America. Adventure trumps culture any day.
This post was edited on 12/10/08 at 3:51 am
Posted on 12/10/08 at 7:09 am to foshizzle
You are so right about the Cannon G9. My youngest daughter and her boyfriend are both into photography. He has a Rebel, but she wanted the G9 and she absolutely loves it.
By the way, she's taking a trip to England, Ireland and Scotland next June after she graduates from high school. One of her friends is staying over and backpacking through France and Italy with her brother.
She'll be majoring in Engineering at LSU next year and hopefully a Tiger Band Picc. Wish I had been so adventurous when I was their age.
By the way, she's taking a trip to England, Ireland and Scotland next June after she graduates from high school. One of her friends is staying over and backpacking through France and Italy with her brother.
She'll be majoring in Engineering at LSU next year and hopefully a Tiger Band Picc. Wish I had been so adventurous when I was their age.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 7:22 am to foshizzle
quote:
Your biggest expense should be a Canon G9.
What about a Nikon D90?
Posted on 12/10/08 at 7:39 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Adventure doesn't trump culture. You can have an adventure in your back yard. If you want to see Europe, see Europe. If the US devalues the dollar, seeing Europe might be possible for only the wealthy.
While in Italy use the Pensiones, a sort of boarding house for tourists/students touring 'on the cheap'. Clean beds, shower, what else do you need? There are similar hostels throughout Europe. If you speak a little French/German/Spanish/Italian it will add to your enjoyment. Talk with as many locals as possible. You will be amazed at the amount of history and local culture they can provide. If you can add Greece to your itenerary you will be glad you did. Athens for Auschwitz or Frankfurt for Crete would be a good trade off.
If you can extend your trip and find any sort of work you will get a lot more from your trip. It is the difference of hanging with locals and being on a guided tour. Americans that see Europe via a guided tours have seen little and learned less. Good luck.
While in Italy use the Pensiones, a sort of boarding house for tourists/students touring 'on the cheap'. Clean beds, shower, what else do you need? There are similar hostels throughout Europe. If you speak a little French/German/Spanish/Italian it will add to your enjoyment. Talk with as many locals as possible. You will be amazed at the amount of history and local culture they can provide. If you can add Greece to your itenerary you will be glad you did. Athens for Auschwitz or Frankfurt for Crete would be a good trade off.
If you can extend your trip and find any sort of work you will get a lot more from your trip. It is the difference of hanging with locals and being on a guided tour. Americans that see Europe via a guided tours have seen little and learned less. Good luck.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 8:27 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Go for it now, you will in all probability never get a better or more realistic chance.
I got accepted to a summer program in Dublin through NYU the summer before my senior year. Long story short- I didn't do the program because I was transferring to LSU and was losing a bunch of hours that I wanted to make up that summer. I have always regretted the decision I made, which in the grand scheme of things would have put my graduation back another 4 months (which would have also been a good thing looking back).
My dad told me right after I graduated to not hurry into finding a job too quickly because once you start working it doesn't stop for a very long time. 4 years later, it seems truer words have never been spoken. Take the damn trip- where ever you decide to go.
I got accepted to a summer program in Dublin through NYU the summer before my senior year. Long story short- I didn't do the program because I was transferring to LSU and was losing a bunch of hours that I wanted to make up that summer. I have always regretted the decision I made, which in the grand scheme of things would have put my graduation back another 4 months (which would have also been a good thing looking back).
quote:
question 3) if I waited a few years until I actually have money, what are the chances any company I work for will allow me to take all my paid vacation + unpaid time off (like a temporary leave?) to take the same trip? It seems unlikely I'll have a job with 30 vacation days per year
My dad told me right after I graduated to not hurry into finding a job too quickly because once you start working it doesn't stop for a very long time. 4 years later, it seems truer words have never been spoken. Take the damn trip- where ever you decide to go.
This post was edited on 12/10/08 at 8:28 am
Posted on 12/10/08 at 9:01 am to Feed Me Popeyes
quote:It all depends on your interests. Both in terms of the value of a $6K outlay and the sites you'd want to see.
After doing research and talking to people that have been backpacking through Europe, we are under the impression that we will spend about $100/day for a total of $3k. Furthermore, flight + rail pass + cabs/buses will be another $2500. Then we'll throw in an additional $500 for a couple of nights out (honestly, drinking is not the point of this trip) and a souvenir or two. Final tally: $6k, though I'll try like hell to come in under that number
You conspicuously left out the UK. Britain is far and away my favorite European destination, followed by France (also a great visit), Italy, Switzerland, Netherlands, Germany, Spain, East Europe in that order. Have not traveled to Greece, Scandinavia, or Western Russia.
One thing you might not have considered is a tour as opposed to "doing it on your own". The markups on travel and lodging in the EU are huge.....even in the case of hostels. Tour companies get deep discounts on lodging and take care of interlocation travel themselves.
There are many touring companies out there catering to a variety of interests. Discount College Tours (age 18-26), Cosmos Tours (ages -- all). Every one of these options will be cheaper by a large margin than equivalent travel/lodging/siteseeing you could arrange independently.
Why do it with a tour as a first time traveler?
Here's an example. We've been to the Vatican a couple of times, both on our own and with a tour. On our own, we waited in line for >4 hours after arriving at 8am midweek. Folks who arrived 11am or later supposedly didn't even get in that day. On tour we bypassed the line and went straight in. Made me sick to think we could easily have saved a half-day in line on the previous trip. Same with many other sites.
You'll see more and usually have a College Professor or equivalent as a tour guide and information source. At least look up some tour companies/itineraries and compare with what you'd do on your own.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 9:56 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Definitely worth it, although $100/day sounds kind of high. You should definitely expand to more cities, though.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 10:14 am to Tiger JJ
quote:
Definitely worth it, although $100/day sounds kind of high. You should definitely expand to more cities, though.
No, I think $100 per day sounds about right.
I would suggest skipping western europe and doing eastern. You could easily do eastern europe on $30 per day.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 10:16 am to NC_Tigah
Try a site like contiki.com or affordabletours.com
I have taken a Contiki trip before and it was a great experience. The prices are good and most of them meet in London which is usually cheaper thank other european capitals to fly into. $100 a day is a good estimate of how much you will spend, but you can definetly cut that down if you dont go out partying every night. Some of the hotels on the trip are really nice and some are almost hostels, but you it doesnt really matter because you will only see your room when are ready to go to sleep. Everyone on the tour is 18-35 and from all around the world. This also gives you a bigger group to go out with which to me was more enjoyable. The tour guides that I have had were great and they will tell you the best things to see and what you wouldnt regret skipping. You get a lot of freedom though, so dont think it is overly structured. It also saved me lots of money later on. I have since travelled to New Zealand and Australia and just stayed with friends made on the tour. Spent a month in Australia and never had to rent a hotel room. Hopefully visiting other friends in South Africa and Brazil soon. It is also fun when they come to the US and you can show them around.
I would not get heavily in debt to go travel, but having been in your situation right after college it was well worth it for the trip. Once you join the real world it is hard to get away long enough to really explore all of europe.
South America is not always cheaper. I am currently looking for a trip to Brazil and it is actually cheaper for me to go to Africa than it is Brazil. You will have a lot of inland flights in countries like Brazil so unless you are happy with one city you will probably have to get on a plane to get around. For two weeks in Brazil and Argentina the inland flights alone were around $2k. With something like a contiki tour all of your transportation is covered once you arrive in London. The price also covers several of your meals and admission to various attractions.
I have taken a Contiki trip before and it was a great experience. The prices are good and most of them meet in London which is usually cheaper thank other european capitals to fly into. $100 a day is a good estimate of how much you will spend, but you can definetly cut that down if you dont go out partying every night. Some of the hotels on the trip are really nice and some are almost hostels, but you it doesnt really matter because you will only see your room when are ready to go to sleep. Everyone on the tour is 18-35 and from all around the world. This also gives you a bigger group to go out with which to me was more enjoyable. The tour guides that I have had were great and they will tell you the best things to see and what you wouldnt regret skipping. You get a lot of freedom though, so dont think it is overly structured. It also saved me lots of money later on. I have since travelled to New Zealand and Australia and just stayed with friends made on the tour. Spent a month in Australia and never had to rent a hotel room. Hopefully visiting other friends in South Africa and Brazil soon. It is also fun when they come to the US and you can show them around.
I would not get heavily in debt to go travel, but having been in your situation right after college it was well worth it for the trip. Once you join the real world it is hard to get away long enough to really explore all of europe.
South America is not always cheaper. I am currently looking for a trip to Brazil and it is actually cheaper for me to go to Africa than it is Brazil. You will have a lot of inland flights in countries like Brazil so unless you are happy with one city you will probably have to get on a plane to get around. For two weeks in Brazil and Argentina the inland flights alone were around $2k. With something like a contiki tour all of your transportation is covered once you arrive in London. The price also covers several of your meals and admission to various attractions.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 10:27 am to Feed Me Popeyes
I bet Greece would be really cheap right now.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 10:35 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Im leaving for my second trip to Europe on Dec. 26th. Went 3 years ago and really enjoyed it.
Highly recommended and if at all possible do it upon graduation as the future is never guaranteed, nor cheaper.
Highly recommended and if at all possible do it upon graduation as the future is never guaranteed, nor cheaper.
Posted on 12/10/08 at 11:06 am to Feed Me Popeyes
Everybody makes good points. The best thing that could happen is that you have a job offer pre-graduation and can put off starting work for 6-8 weeks post-graduation. The CC industry may be very different in 2010, ie no more teaser rates, limited credit limits, etc,so not really sure you could count on that availability for financing. I am not a fan of going into debt to travel but extended vacation time will likely be limited. Future exchange rates would be a factor as well. Just think, 6-months ago people might have projected future international air travel prices to be $3-$5k based upon fuel costs.
I love traveling in Europe, wish I had done so much earlier. Have been to France (enjoyed Paris then SE France moreso than SW (Toulouse/Bordeaux area), Italy, Ireland, England, Scotland, a good bit of Mexico, and also been to Argentina (can't beat the beef). France and Italy are my favorites, Bordeaux can be expensive and highly suggest visiting St. Emilion if in Bordeaux, it is about 40km east. The Scots are incredibly friendly. It is funny when traveling you begin to recognize Aussies fairly easily, they are very fun to hang out with. I would vote for E. or W. Europe over S. America although Patagonia might be interesting if you are an outdoors person. Good luck and have fun when you make it.
I love traveling in Europe, wish I had done so much earlier. Have been to France (enjoyed Paris then SE France moreso than SW (Toulouse/Bordeaux area), Italy, Ireland, England, Scotland, a good bit of Mexico, and also been to Argentina (can't beat the beef). France and Italy are my favorites, Bordeaux can be expensive and highly suggest visiting St. Emilion if in Bordeaux, it is about 40km east. The Scots are incredibly friendly. It is funny when traveling you begin to recognize Aussies fairly easily, they are very fun to hang out with. I would vote for E. or W. Europe over S. America although Patagonia might be interesting if you are an outdoors person. Good luck and have fun when you make it.
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