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Duke Engines - for the mechanically inclined
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:13 am
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:13 am
This is a gif of a similar design..
It is an axial, valveless combustion engine, not a rotary/trilobe.
This is the Duke engine with what looks like an improvement to the one in this gif, a nutating plate and a ball & socket eccentric to convert linear to rotary force.
LINK to youtube.
It is an axial, valveless combustion engine, not a rotary/trilobe.
This is the Duke engine with what looks like an improvement to the one in this gif, a nutating plate and a ball & socket eccentric to convert linear to rotary force.
LINK to youtube.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:26 am to reverendotis
What's the advantage to this over conventional piston engine design? And how can there be no valves? No intake nor exhaust?
It looks complicated.
It looks complicated.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:29 am to reverendotis
U Joint failure I would guess as a problem
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:36 am to wallowinit
Watch the youtube vid. It is short and answers both questions. It would have about half the moving parts compared to a conventional motor and unlike a rotary, good compression.
The gif is a similar design. The one in the video has a power output section that differs significantly.
The gif is a similar design. The one in the video has a power output section that differs significantly.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:48 am to reverendotis
1) That's a lot of rotating mass.
2) How does the rotating piston assembly seal against the non-rotating headplate assembly to achieve compression and containment of gases during the power stroke? How robust is that seal?
3) I wonder how all that rotating mass enjoys suddenly stopping, for instance, when someone engages the clutch with their foot on the brake.
4) It's mechanism porn. I'll give them that.
2) How does the rotating piston assembly seal against the non-rotating headplate assembly to achieve compression and containment of gases during the power stroke? How robust is that seal?
3) I wonder how all that rotating mass enjoys suddenly stopping, for instance, when someone engages the clutch with their foot on the brake.
4) It's mechanism porn. I'll give them that.
This post was edited on 1/3/16 at 1:59 am
Posted on 1/3/16 at 2:13 am to TigerstuckinMS
I suppose the seal is a reinforced carbon assembly that runs in lubricant with the other parts. They don't say specifically.
The sudden stopping is interesting because I don't think the nutating plate would transfer force back into the motor very well. It is like a worm & wheel in that regard. I can only guess that there is some energy dissipating or slip device in the output gearing.
I gather they are going after the marine and aviation market with this thing.
The sudden stopping is interesting because I don't think the nutating plate would transfer force back into the motor very well. It is like a worm & wheel in that regard. I can only guess that there is some energy dissipating or slip device in the output gearing.
I gather they are going after the marine and aviation market with this thing.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 3:35 am to reverendotis
Felix Wankel is laughing his arse off
Posted on 1/3/16 at 5:21 am to TigerstuckinMS
I don't know exactly how it seals, but this is (roughly) just an axial swash plate pump converted into an engine. It should work.
Spinning the whole engine block is really going to do bad things to throttle response though.
Spinning the whole engine block is really going to do bad things to throttle response though.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 5:30 am to reverendotis
That'll be great until it hits 1000rpm and launches it's pistons,rods, and cylinders into the air.....
Posted on 1/3/16 at 5:49 am to reverendotis
I wish the Dynacam engine had caught on. Much more efficient design.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 7:27 am to dragginass
That shouldn't happen. We've been using swash plate pumps for decades. Why would this be much worse?
Posted on 1/3/16 at 7:47 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
I can definitely see the swasher plate coming loose and causing that whole thing to do a mylar rotation resulting in total failure of the aortic valve
Posted on 1/3/16 at 8:06 am to TigerstuckinMS
quote:
That's a lot of rotating mass.
I would think that it would tend to torque the vehicle to one side under heavy acceleration.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 9:21 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
I'm no physicist, but the rpm and displacement required for that thing to function(in a car) as an internal combustion engine on typical fuels would be ridiculous. Sure it eliminates moving parts (valves) but in doing so it takes the main rotating part(crankshaft) and attaches the combustion components to it. Laggy, low power and a frickton of weight per hp is what you get.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 9:51 am to reverendotis
So their main selling points are that the design reduces the number of total parts and allows for increased compression ratio.
As for reducing the number of parts, this is nearly irrelevant. Who cares how many parts are in the engine as long as they last. This will impress me when you can stick it in a 4runner and it won't need a rebuild until 300k miles.
As for the compression ratio, 14:1 is higher than what current gasoline engines run, but not the point of being revolutionary. In the 1960's many cars with high performance engines had compression ratios of 12:1. Fuel standards drove CR's down for a few decades, but now with direct injection engines are getting back to that point (porsche's 911 GT3 RS has a CR of 12.9:1)
Also I am not clear as to why thy claim to be able to run a higher compression without pre-ignition. What specifically about this design allows for a higher CR with no detonation? Perhaps in a 70 degree lab and no humidity, but can it be replicated in real world conditions?
As for reducing the number of parts, this is nearly irrelevant. Who cares how many parts are in the engine as long as they last. This will impress me when you can stick it in a 4runner and it won't need a rebuild until 300k miles.
As for the compression ratio, 14:1 is higher than what current gasoline engines run, but not the point of being revolutionary. In the 1960's many cars with high performance engines had compression ratios of 12:1. Fuel standards drove CR's down for a few decades, but now with direct injection engines are getting back to that point (porsche's 911 GT3 RS has a CR of 12.9:1)
Also I am not clear as to why thy claim to be able to run a higher compression without pre-ignition. What specifically about this design allows for a higher CR with no detonation? Perhaps in a 70 degree lab and no humidity, but can it be replicated in real world conditions?
Posted on 1/3/16 at 10:52 am to CptRusty
quote:
What specifically about this design allows for a higher CR with no detonation?
I'm curious about this claim as well. Dubious at best. If they just say 'Magic Radical Engine design lets us push against the laws of Thermodynamics' with no explanation as to how it pushes back against Thermodynamics, my bullshite sensor IMMEDIATELY starts blinking.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 11:34 am to TigerstuckinMS
Apparently they claim to do it with lower cylinder temps. Can it vary displacement?
Posted on 1/3/16 at 12:01 pm to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
Apparently they claim to do it with lower cylinder temps. Can it vary displacement?
I didn't see anything that looked like it could vary stroke, and it doesn't have valves for VVT that can effectively reduce the stroke. The nutating plate looks to be fixed, so its angle can't be changed to vary the stroke. They may have some method, but I don't see it.
Sure, lower cylinder temperatures are going to help, but there's no getting around the adiabatic heat of compression at higher CR.
This post was edited on 1/3/16 at 12:03 pm
Posted on 1/3/16 at 12:49 pm to TigerstuckinMS
quote:
lower cylinder temperatures are going to help, but there's no getting around the adiabatic heat of compression at higher CR.
Yep. I suppose this is why the increase in CR is minor. If they could achieve 18-20:1 they'd have something to brag on, but 14:1 is barely better than what is being done with standard gasoline engines. Yawn stretch.
Posted on 1/3/16 at 1:19 pm to CptRusty
Who says it needs to go in a car? Seems much more appropriate in other applications that would have constant rpm variations.
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