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re: Spin-Off Thread: How Long Until Saints Demand New Stadium?
Posted on 1/13/16 at 6:52 pm to SirWinston
Posted on 1/13/16 at 6:52 pm to SirWinston
I dunno about Chicago being walk-able... I mean yeah the distance from the stadium to the city is technically walk-able but HOLY JESUS does it get cold in the winter. It feels like you're walking for miles when it's 3 below.
1
Posted on 1/13/16 at 6:57 pm to Laaz2750
Yeah good point and it's also segregated from the meat of the city by that 16 lane highway. Seattle is definitely the closest to the Superdome in terms of walking through the guts of downtown, 5 star hotels, great pubs and restaurants and having many pedestrian friendly paths 
This post was edited on 1/13/16 at 6:58 pm
Posted on 1/13/16 at 8:47 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
As stadiums get more and more ridiculous they will have to compete. I don't like it but it's a reality.
I think that public perception on these stadiums is starting to turn.
Not saying it won't happen, but I don't think you'll be seeing $1 billion + palaces being funded by the state
I don't think the state builds a new stadium (unless their is a structural issue that dooms the stadium), but at the end of the current lease the dome will be 50 years old. Like others said the Dome has enough square feet, and one of the best locations in the NFL. However, I do think the state is forced to get up off its pocketbook again and completely gut and renovate the Superdome. The new stadium in ATL has a capacity of 71K, the new Vikings Stadium is 67K, Levi's Stadium is 68K, and the new LA stadium is 70K. However they all have or will have more than 130 suites (Superdome currently has 153). All have the ability to expand with SRO to be able to host Super Bowls, Final Fours, and CFB national championships. I think the state does like KC and now Miami did and completely redo the inside. They take away general seating capacity and increase the number of suites and premium seats as well as expanding concourses on the upper level and improving sightlines (I wonder if they can lower the floor like other stadiums have done to improve the sightlines). I would imagine the capacity would drop to ~70K and be expandable to 72K for Super Bowls and other big events. With ~175 suites, and of course more amenities in the stadium that Benson or whomever owns the team can charge the fans for.
A major renovation like that would probably cost $300-$500million vs $1.5billion for a new stadium. Unlike the other stadiums that were replaced the Superdome has plenty of space and perfect location.
This post was edited on 1/13/16 at 8:58 pm
Posted on 1/13/16 at 9:29 pm to SirWinston
quote:
That it is still pumping as the heartbeat of NOLA's economic engine
Can you explain this?
Posted on 1/14/16 at 11:43 am to SirWinston
quote:
1. London*
2. Toronto
3. Mexico City*
4. Portland
5. Birmingham? Oklahoma City? Las Vegas? St Louis? None are close to NOLA with the Saints
Paul Allen sure as frick is not letting a Portland NFL team happen.
Toronto basically has the Bills. Don't see any team moving there.
London/Mexico City are not feasible, but London will be the "new LA", ie the cudgel they use to get new stadiums.
St Louis is twice failed. Las Vegas isn't happening, ever. Jerry Jones ain't allowing OKC to happen.
Posted on 1/14/16 at 11:48 am to Giantkiller
Never. frick you. The dome will always be my home sweet dome.
They could use high def screens though.
They could use high def screens though.
Posted on 1/14/16 at 11:58 am to Fun Bunch
For a threat to work, it has to be believable... give us a new stadium or we'll move to London is simply not believable.
Posted on 1/15/16 at 6:00 pm to Laaz2750
quote:
For a threat to work, it has to be believable... give us a new stadium or we'll move to London is simply not believable.
It will all depend on what the ownership situation and the political situation in the state in 2020-2025. If Tom Benson or Gayle still owns both the Saints and Pelicans then the threat of relocating is not much of an issue. The Bensons have alot of assets in NOLA besides the Saints and Pels and they probably wouldn't want to jeopardize them. If the Saints and/or Pels have been sold to out of town owner(s) then we might have to worry. There will be an atleast one open spot in LA, SD, or Oakland come 2025, if not more. The NFL wants a team in London and a different owner might want to make that jump. It is too far in the future and too many variables to really speculate past the internet what if stages. However, La has always worked with the team(s) and figured out a way to keep them, and I expect that to continue. I did the math in the hypothetical new stadium thread last march, and as long as the owner of the Saints puts up $$$ like the Viking's owner and Blank did and the NFL contributes with the G4 loan and we get a good deal on naming rights than the current hotel taxes will have enough money to build a $1.5billion stadium for the Saints, and if the Pelicans owner puts up money like the Bucks did they would be enough for a $500million new arena for the Pelicans. So as long as ownership wants to be here we really don't have to worry.
Here is the math from my post last year.
quote:LINK
In 2025, the Superdome will be ~50 years old it will be time to put the ole gal out to pasture then anyway. I have not idea what the Benson's or 3R's fiscal situation will be by then but they will want a new stadium and the state will need one by then or a major renovation to superdome that costs over a 100 million.
I would think $2 billion would cover buiding a state of the art stadium and new NBA arena for the Pels (the SKC is bottom of the league now) by 2025.
The NFL's fund contributes an average of $200 million
Sell the naming rights for the NFL stadium 30year deal *$10 million/yr = $300 million
PSL= the NFL average is $50 million = $50 million
So that is $550 million paid for with non state money
Sell the Arena naming rights for 30 years * $5million/ yr = $150 million
So that is $700 million in private money off the top of my head.
That leave $1.3 billion the owners and the state have to come up with. The average NBA/team owner has contributed an average of $200 million for new arenas and the NFL an average of $400 million. That drops the state total down to $700 million. The current hotel tax contributes $34 million/yr to pay for the Superdome and SKC. Since the dome has had such a productive lifetime (50 years) and the SKC was built on the cheap, a large portion of the current tax values will be available for a new stadium. Right now the state pays $26 million/yr until 2039 to pay for the dome and SKC. That leave $8million/yr for 14 years free to replace the venues (and I am sure more money could be found by refinancing and applying it to the new stadium) that is 112 million and then the whole $34 million/yr for 16 years that is $544 million so ~$650 million from current tax funding sources.
So the state would have to come up ~$50million to have the best NBA arena and NFL stadium. That would be less than $2 million a year in new funding. That sounds like a hell of a bargain for what the Saints and Pels and having state of the art venues would bring to the state.
Disclaimer: Figures assumer similar debt structure as the Vikings, Failcounts and Sacramento Kings. A sticking point could be if the owners do not want to spend any of there money. Also feel free to check my math.
Posted on 1/15/16 at 6:39 pm to WeeWee
quote:
In 2025, the Superdome will be ~50 years old it will be time to put the ole gal out to pasture then anyway
no.
I'm only ok with this if they just build another giant Dome in the same place.
Posted on 1/15/16 at 8:08 pm to SirWinston
I think it is perfect the way it is. Including the Rams/Chargers move to LA. St. Louis fans can just convert to KC or Chicago.
Posted on 1/15/16 at 8:20 pm to SirWinston
quote:
The suites have some of the worst views in the stadium
When have you even set foot in a suite in the Dome?
Posted on 1/15/16 at 8:25 pm to jcaz
The Dome is in a perfect location, but something will have to give eventually. It has nothing or little to do with how content the current fans may be. When you visit these brand new stadiums (with entertainment complexes) it becomes obvious. They may be able to use the current shell (I think it still looks great), but there will have to be a complete rebuilding of everything else. And development of the adjacent properties.
Posted on 1/16/16 at 9:43 am to Giantkiller
After Hurricane Keith hits NO in 2019.
Posted on 1/16/16 at 9:44 am to bountyhunter
quote:
When have you even set foot in a suite in the Dome?
I'd think never. I split my time between the terrace and the suites. The suites have great views.
Posted on 1/16/16 at 9:57 am to Breesus
The dome is a much much better facility than what they have in Oakland, St.louis and SD. All three of those stadiums are dumps which have not been renovated in decades.
They are putting in new video boards this off season which will stretch from the banners on one side to the banners on the other.
They are putting in new video boards this off season which will stretch from the banners on one side to the banners on the other.
Posted on 1/16/16 at 4:56 pm to Breesus
quote:
I'd think never. I split my time between the terrace and the suites. The suites have great views.
I have been in a suite in Jerry world and the Superdome. The suites in AT&T are grander and more numerous than the Superdome, but at the end of the day a suite is a suite. The angle at AT&T might have been better but not noticeably so, and since when do the suite owners care about the viewing angle? They are there to enjoy the luxury, do business, and watch the game with multiple tvs for replays if they missed something so I don't believe the viewing angle of the suites is a real problem.
The Superdome has enough square footage that you can widen concourses, add more thrills and lounges, more suites etc, and all you have to do is take away from general seating capacity, but you will still have enough room to be ~70K. What will cause the Superdome to be replaced is the same thing that caused old Yankee Stadium, Miami to move to the Orange Bowl, the Oakland Coliseum, needing to be replaced. Eventually the maintenance costs, and inefficiencies of an older stadium will just get to be too much. At the end of the lease the Superdome will be 50 and that means the plumbing is 50 years old, parts of the electrical system will be 50 years old, and the structural steel and concert will be 50 years old too. Just ask anyone with an old house, old stuff breaks all the time and you have to spend a little here to fix it and little there to fix something else. In 2025, renovating and repairing might still be the best option, but that will not always be the case. At some point the ROI for a new stadium will outweigh the ROI on renovating the dome, and when that happens the current tax levels will be enough for a $1.5billion stadium if the owner puts up $$$ like all the other NFL owners have done recently. So it will all be up to the owner.
However, they do not need the area around the dome. They might have to jump over and build on the otherside of the interstate and develop the hood some, but they need to stay within walking distance of the street cars, CBD and French Quarter, and the UPT if/when the new BR-NOLA train is a thing.
Posted on 1/16/16 at 6:07 pm to WeeWee
quote:
However, they do not need the area around the dome.
Champions Square, The smoothie king center, and the parking garage?
If they ever have to build a new stadium I'd hope they tear down the dome and rebuild a super upgraded dome in the same spot. It's a national icon.
Posted on 1/16/16 at 8:23 pm to Breesus
More than just ideas about a new stadium have been tossed around.
Using the land near the river/convention center has been talked about.
People have even had the idea of having it be open air, facing the river, so a CRUISE ship could dock and sell tickets like the rooftops at Wrigley. Plenty of creative revenue ideas for a new complex NOT in the current location are out there.
These new stadiums have to be more like CITY centers, than just arenas. Incorporating the convention center, and growing the footprint near the river, would be better for the NOLA economy, than the Superdome, which doesn't even support the leases of many office buildings blocks away. People don't congregate to that area, for anything but events. It's unsustainable. Whereas a new riverside stadium and convention center development together, would see foot traffic year round. The stadium would just be the largest jewel of the new crown.
New Saints Stadium
Using the land near the river/convention center has been talked about.
People have even had the idea of having it be open air, facing the river, so a CRUISE ship could dock and sell tickets like the rooftops at Wrigley. Plenty of creative revenue ideas for a new complex NOT in the current location are out there.
These new stadiums have to be more like CITY centers, than just arenas. Incorporating the convention center, and growing the footprint near the river, would be better for the NOLA economy, than the Superdome, which doesn't even support the leases of many office buildings blocks away. People don't congregate to that area, for anything but events. It's unsustainable. Whereas a new riverside stadium and convention center development together, would see foot traffic year round. The stadium would just be the largest jewel of the new crown.
New Saints Stadium
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