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re: So Fleener..........should we be concerned?
Posted on 8/26/16 at 9:44 am to goatmilker
Posted on 8/26/16 at 9:44 am to goatmilker
Hell, Watson didn't have over 50 yards in a game (1 game over 40) until Atlanta in week 6. He scored his first TD in week 5
As far as drop % - LINK
As far as drop % - LINK
quote:
In second spot sophomore Colt Coby Fleener tried to lessen the loss of every-down wrecking ball Dwayne Allen with some silky work as a receiver. He dropped just the one pass in the regular season, in what was something of a breakout year for him after a disappointing rookie season. By virtue of catching more balls he just finished above Zach Miller, John Carlson and Kyle Rudolph who also only dropped one pass.
This post was edited on 8/26/16 at 9:45 am
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Posted on 8/26/16 at 9:49 am to htran90
Who said anything about a top 5 producer? He just needs to be an above average TE that defenses will respect. That will open up the offense and make life easier for the other skill players. He also needs to have the occasional long explosive play he's capable of. Hopefully he can achieve what he was brought in to do.
He's a seasoned vet who was brought in to contribute immediately. You can't argue that. Anything less and he will be a huge disappointment. He is not some undrafted rookie.
He's a seasoned vet who was brought in to contribute immediately. You can't argue that. Anything less and he will be a huge disappointment. He is not some undrafted rookie.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 9:53 am to htran90
quote:
So you're expecting Graham/gronk numbers.
a healthy gronk is more of a 1300 yard receiver. Expecting Fleener to get inbetween 900-1100 IN THIS offense is far from unreasonable when no. 1 guy who's nowhere near the vertical threat fleener is coming off 825 year.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 10:09 am to Chad504boy
Weak Side Blocking: I honestly have no idea how good of a blocker he is or is supposed to be, but that is really not a concern for me.
Route Chemistry: It comes with time. I am not sure that is an issue. If he was known for having trouble picking up the playbook, that is different. He and Drew need to get more reps just like every other QB, receiver. Some need more time than others.
Drop %: Is, has repeatedly noted, very overblown with Fleener. I am not sure if he has the reputation because he had some bad timed drops or if people are reading different information, but his drops are not that high of a percentage.
I think some of our fans look for any reason to be "concerned" or "worried". I can understand the concern with the line play. I can understand concern with seeing an improved pass rush.
But these splash reports are for click bait. THey are used because they work. If the defense shuts down the offense in practice, fans are concerned that the offense is degressing. If the offensive has the better day, fans say the defense is still as bad as ever.
The point is that for the list of concerns for the season, concern over Fleener being a significant contributor to the offense is pretty far down. Probably grouped in with someone getting hurt.
Route Chemistry: It comes with time. I am not sure that is an issue. If he was known for having trouble picking up the playbook, that is different. He and Drew need to get more reps just like every other QB, receiver. Some need more time than others.
Drop %: Is, has repeatedly noted, very overblown with Fleener. I am not sure if he has the reputation because he had some bad timed drops or if people are reading different information, but his drops are not that high of a percentage.
I think some of our fans look for any reason to be "concerned" or "worried". I can understand the concern with the line play. I can understand concern with seeing an improved pass rush.
But these splash reports are for click bait. THey are used because they work. If the defense shuts down the offense in practice, fans are concerned that the offense is degressing. If the offensive has the better day, fans say the defense is still as bad as ever.
The point is that for the list of concerns for the season, concern over Fleener being a significant contributor to the offense is pretty far down. Probably grouped in with someone getting hurt.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 10:10 am to goatmilker
quote:Yeah, this seems like the logical approach. It took Drew and Watson a few games to get it going last year and they worked together for 2 years before that. The panic is unreal.
I'll wait for a few games into the season first.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 10:59 am to bonethug0108
quote:Pretty much
Larry Holder? He's turned into a baby Jeff Duncan. Always looking for a story to stir the shite.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:11 am to sicboy
Why's this shocking? He's always been incredibly inconsistent with his hands which is why I was shocked the Saints even signed this guy for what they did. He's really not that good of a TE and being around great QBs he's always been extremely hit or miss in games. He's never consistent. Always been a guy who showed great flashes at times but doesn't appear to know how to put it all together. I've seen so many times he's wide open and just drops a ball for no reason other than butter fingers. Didn't like the signing and so far this preseason doesn't sound like a good one either. If Hill is pushing him then you know he's bad.
This post was edited on 8/26/16 at 11:14 am
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:15 am to TigerBait1127
Is that really true? What's his drop % because I've watched the Colts and I swear in clutch time this guy drops a lot of balls. Maybe it's just the fact he drops balls when it matters the most that gives him the stigma he has bad hands. I don't pretend like I watched him every game but I have seen him play a lot because I watch a lot of football. Never thought he was a great TE just a decent one which is why I wasn't a fan of giving him the money he got.
This post was edited on 8/26/16 at 11:16 am
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:26 am to CapperVin
quote:
This regime doesn't have a good history when it comes to signing free agents.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:29 am to MSH
1 hit out of ....
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:36 am to deuce985
quote:
I don't pretend like I watched him every game but I have seen him play a lot because I watch a lot of football. Never thought he was a great TE just a decent one which is why I wasn't a fan of giving him the money he got.
Hes the 13th highest paid tight end. Pretty much average right?
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:37 am to The Pirate King
We've had some really good FA signings actually
Problem is the ones lately haven't been
Problem is the ones lately haven't been
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:39 am to TigerBait1127
Fleener has never been very good plus he's a terrible blocker. The Saints have to let Mickey go this year but it won't happen until Benson passes
Posted on 8/26/16 at 11:40 am to tzimme4
Thanks Timmy
Posted on 8/26/16 at 12:11 pm to sicboy
This was a concern for me as well. Graham had a RS season before being heavily thrust into a role here, Watson spent his career with NE and was a backup here for years before starting last year. The NOLA TE produces narrative largely centers around those 2 individuals. Not chalking this up as a bust signing but more as a fans need to caution year 1 expectations.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 12:32 pm to htran90
quote:This is the very definition of a strawman argument. Who said anything about elite top 5 producer?
Since when do you sign a TE and expect him to come in and become an elite top 5 producer?
If you're paying a guy what he's being paid, you're not doing so to ease him in as the #2 TE until year #2. With a QB like Brees throwing you passes, you should immediately be able to come in and make an impact.
quote:Well, no one said that in this thread, so this point is irrelevant.
That's more ridiculous with the expectations people have than the people worried
quote:Yes. We could put a shopping cart with a mannequin head at TE and he'd catch for 500-600 yards so it would be a waste of money when you consider what we paid Benjamin Watson, and he put up 800 yards receiving.
If he has 600-700 yards than is it still "a worry"?
Posted on 8/26/16 at 12:34 pm to partywiththelombardi
quote:They produce mostly because of how great Brees is.
Watson spent his career with NE and was a backup here for years before starting last year. The NOLA TE produces narrative largely centers around those 2 individuals
So if you can get solid production out of a cheap player like Benjamin Watson, then you upgrade by, what, probably 4-5 times the value in signing Fleener, you should expect his production to outdo Watson by a wide margin or else what was the point?
Posted on 8/26/16 at 12:41 pm to shel311
quote:
Who said anything about elite top 5 producer?
quote:
Its fair to say Fleener needs to be a 900-1200 yard receiver
Posted on 8/26/16 at 12:57 pm to sicboy
I remember, I think it was either last year or year before last, when Fleener was in Indy, there was a play where he was literally wide open going into the end zone. Luck threw a perfect pass to him and... Fleener completely whiffed on the play. The ball hit him in the hands and he couldn't haul it in. Not good. I mean, I think he's a decent TE, but plays like that give you doubt.
Posted on 8/26/16 at 1:06 pm to SaintlyTiger88
quote:
I remember, I think it was either last year or year before last, when Fleener was in Indy, there was a play where he was literally wide open going into the end zone. Luck threw a perfect pass to him and... Fleener completely whiffed on the play. The ball hit him in the hands and he couldn't haul it in. Not good. I mean, I think he's a decent TE, but plays like that give you doubt.
last year he had two dropped balls that were huge gaffs. That ball and another wide open 30-40 yarder. Before those two, he's never had issues holding onto the ball and why he gets the stigma of having issues with his hands.
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