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Started By
Message
Here's how nfl.com has the top prospects ranked pre-Combine
Posted on 2/15/17 at 5:27 pm
Posted on 2/15/17 at 5:27 pm
quote:
Garrett, Myles OLB 6'5" 270 Texas A&M 7.6
Fournette, Leonard RB 6'1" 235 LSU 7.1
Thomas, Solomon DE 6'3" 273 Stanford 6.8
Allen, Jonathan DE 6'3" 291 Alabama 6.8
Hooker, Malik S 6'2" 205 Ohio St. 6.7
Trubisky, Mitch QB 6'3" 220 North Carolina 6.7
Adams, Jamal S 6'1" 213 LSU 6.6
Charlton, Taco DE 6'6" 272 Michigan 6.5
McDowell, Malik DT 6'6" 276 Michigan St. 6.5
Cook, Dalvin RB 5'11" 213 Florida St. 6.5
Lattimore, Marshon CB 6'1" 192 Ohio St. 6.5
Howard, O.J. TE 6'6" 249 Alabama 6.5
Jones, Sidney CB 6'1" 170 Washington 6.5
Foster, Reuben LB 6'1" 228 Alabama 6.4
Njoku, David TE 6'4" 245 Miami 6.4
Watson, Deshaun QB 6'3" 215 Clemson 6.3
Williams, Mike WR 6'3" 225 Clemson 6.3
LINK
This post was edited on 2/15/17 at 5:35 pm
4
Posted on 2/15/17 at 5:30 pm to L.A.
Interesting comments about LB Ruben Foster. They see him as a Will in the NFL, not a Mike. And they worry about his instincts.
quote:
LB REUBEN FOSTER ALABAMA SEC
GRADE
6.43
6'1" HEIGHT 228 LBS WEIGHT
OVERVIEW
Alabama's star inside linebacker started his ascension to elite prospect status last summer when he lost 20 pounds. His newfound speed and agility, while keeping his trademark aggression and instincts, made him a unanimous first-team All-American and All-SEC pick. Foster also won the Butkus Award as the nation's top linebacker and was a finalist for the Bednarik Award, leading the Tide with 115 tackles, 13 for which went for losses including five sacks. He won the SEC Championship MVP, as well (11 tackles, 2.5 for loss, two sacks). Foster was a starter as a junior (73 tackles, eight TFL, two sacks, nine pass break-ups) after two seasons as a key reserve MIKE linebacker and special teams ace (12 tackles in 2013; 22 tackles, two TFL in 2014).
ANALYSIS
STRENGTHS Alpha mentality with ferocious hitting style that puts offensive skill positions on alert. Outstanding athlete with springy, reactive feet. Lost 15 pounds in off-season, which gave him more speed and explosiveness. Loose hips and long stride allows him to open and chase immediately. Has elite sideline-to-sideline range. Tough as nails. Brings swagger to a linebacking corps. Never passive and always means it. Willing to take his shots downhill and into gaps. Lands strong warning blows on climbing guards early in the game. Coverage ability is an asset. Logged 10 passes defensed in 2015. Can carry long speed against running backs on wheel routes and nine routes. Has worked to improve tackling technique, which has yielded higher success rate of finishes.
WEAKNESSES Instincts are just average. Overly reliant on speed and athleticism over instincts and feel. Can be a tick slow to respond to play-action. Inconsistent defeating blocks. Too eager to take on everyone at the point of attack. Gets shoulder covered up firing into incoming blockers. Needs to improve stack and shed technique to keep himself clean. Will drop his head at times as tackler. Poor tackling technique led to "stinger" issues early in his career.
SOURCES TELL US "He's not a MIKE linebacker. I think he's a pure run-and-hit WILL linebacker with good cover talent. I'm worried about what his medicals will show because he's had some issues with stingers during his career. I have a higher grade on him than I had on Reggie Ragland. Better pro potential to me." -- NFC director of scouting
NFL COMPARISON Bobby Wagner
BOTTOM LINE Foster is a vicious hitter with elite playmaking range and an ability to toggle between 225 and 240 pounds. Athleticism gives him cover ability that former teammate Reggie Ragland never possessed. Has Pro Bowl potential as a 3-4 inside linebacker or a 4-3 weak-side linebacker, but concerns over his medical history could be a consideration, according to some teams.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 5:36 pm to L.A.
Solomon Thomas
Overview
Thomas spent five years in Australia in his youth, but his return to the States allowed him to develop first into one of the top high school players in the country (top 25 recruit nationally) and then one of college's top defensive linemen. After a redshirt season, Thomas was named honorable mention All-Pac-12 in 2015 (39 tackles, 10.5 for loss, 3.5 sacks). He had four tackles, two for loss, and a sack in the Cardinal's win over Iowa in the Rose Bowl. The redshirt sophomore kicked his game up a notch in 2016, receiving multiple All-American honors and winning the Morris Trophy as the Pac-12 Defensive Player of the Year. Thomas led the team with 62 tackles, 15 for loss, while sacking the quarterback eight times. Thomas' bowl performance against North Carolina opened a lot of eyes, as he was all over the field in the Cardinal's win in a way that isn't even reflected in an impressive stat line (seven tackles, two for loss, sack)
Analysis
Strengths Angular build, well-built frame. His mother, father and uncle were all collegiate athletes. Lined up at multiple positions. Has ravenous approach to the game. Gets out of the blocks quickly and attacks with early, skilled hands. Stays hungry and wants to feast. Powerful for his size. Shows ability to win with power or quickness. Outstanding athleticism. Fluid in his play. Transitions from move to move. Unpredictable pass rush. Attacks both the edges and can crank up a bull rush. Uses swipes, rips and arm-over to unlock his rush. Hands and feet work in unison. Has lightning-quick spin move he can access to unhinge from block and find new life in his rush. Violent disengagements from blocks leave no doubt blocker is whipped. Relentless approach combined with athleticism makes block recoveries extremely difficult in run or pass. Refuses extended engagements to blockers and works himself free. Will sniff out gaps and make himself skinny into the backfield. Very good pursuit speed and range as playmaker.
Weaknesses Considered a "tweener" by scouts, who believe he could struggle to keep enough weight on his frame to play along interior. Length is below average as five-technique. Plays with inconsistent pad level. Needs to get bigger and stronger through his lower body. Tends to play taller as play rolls along and can get washed out of plays by strong down blocks. Hands are quick but need more consistent pop behind them. Overall play strength can be improved. "Big and strong" across from him causes some issues. Gets engulfed at times. Snap-count guesser with seven offsides penalties in 2016.
Sources Tell Us “He’s damn good. I don’t think he gets drafted as early as you do because he’s not big enough for inside and he’s not as long as you like on the outside. You have to figure out where you will play him, but he won’t stop. He’s going to be really productive.” -- Director of scouting for AFC team
NFL Comparison Justin Smith
Bottom Line Explosive defender who combines strength, quickness, and a muscle-car motor to drive him around the field making play after play. Has the hands and feet to be a quick-win specialist and the size to fit as a 4-3 or 3-4 defensive end who can reduce inside for pass-rush downs. He has all the athletic traits to become a high-impact player and possesses more than enough skill and talent to believe he will continue to elevate his game as a pro. Thomas has the potential to become the best defender from this draft class and a future all-pro.
Overview
Thomas spent five years in Australia in his youth, but his return to the States allowed him to develop first into one of the top high school players in the country (top 25 recruit nationally) and then one of college's top defensive linemen. After a redshirt season, Thomas was named honorable mention All-Pac-12 in 2015 (39 tackles, 10.5 for loss, 3.5 sacks). He had four tackles, two for loss, and a sack in the Cardinal's win over Iowa in the Rose Bowl. The redshirt sophomore kicked his game up a notch in 2016, receiving multiple All-American honors and winning the Morris Trophy as the Pac-12 Defensive Player of the Year. Thomas led the team with 62 tackles, 15 for loss, while sacking the quarterback eight times. Thomas' bowl performance against North Carolina opened a lot of eyes, as he was all over the field in the Cardinal's win in a way that isn't even reflected in an impressive stat line (seven tackles, two for loss, sack)
Analysis
Strengths Angular build, well-built frame. His mother, father and uncle were all collegiate athletes. Lined up at multiple positions. Has ravenous approach to the game. Gets out of the blocks quickly and attacks with early, skilled hands. Stays hungry and wants to feast. Powerful for his size. Shows ability to win with power or quickness. Outstanding athleticism. Fluid in his play. Transitions from move to move. Unpredictable pass rush. Attacks both the edges and can crank up a bull rush. Uses swipes, rips and arm-over to unlock his rush. Hands and feet work in unison. Has lightning-quick spin move he can access to unhinge from block and find new life in his rush. Violent disengagements from blocks leave no doubt blocker is whipped. Relentless approach combined with athleticism makes block recoveries extremely difficult in run or pass. Refuses extended engagements to blockers and works himself free. Will sniff out gaps and make himself skinny into the backfield. Very good pursuit speed and range as playmaker.
Weaknesses Considered a "tweener" by scouts, who believe he could struggle to keep enough weight on his frame to play along interior. Length is below average as five-technique. Plays with inconsistent pad level. Needs to get bigger and stronger through his lower body. Tends to play taller as play rolls along and can get washed out of plays by strong down blocks. Hands are quick but need more consistent pop behind them. Overall play strength can be improved. "Big and strong" across from him causes some issues. Gets engulfed at times. Snap-count guesser with seven offsides penalties in 2016.
Sources Tell Us “He’s damn good. I don’t think he gets drafted as early as you do because he’s not big enough for inside and he’s not as long as you like on the outside. You have to figure out where you will play him, but he won’t stop. He’s going to be really productive.” -- Director of scouting for AFC team
NFL Comparison Justin Smith
Bottom Line Explosive defender who combines strength, quickness, and a muscle-car motor to drive him around the field making play after play. Has the hands and feet to be a quick-win specialist and the size to fit as a 4-3 or 3-4 defensive end who can reduce inside for pass-rush downs. He has all the athletic traits to become a high-impact player and possesses more than enough skill and talent to believe he will continue to elevate his game as a pro. Thomas has the potential to become the best defender from this draft class and a future all-pro.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 5:37 pm to GMoney2600
Taco Charlton
Overview
Vidauntae "Taco" Charlton continually improved during his Michigan career. The first-team All-Ohio selection "crossed the border" from Pickerington, a Columbus suburb, to play for the Wolverines (along with tight end Jake Butt). He played mostly on special teams as a true freshman (two tackles), then saw his playing time increase in 2014 (19 tackles, 5.5 for loss, 3.5 sacks, one start). Though Charlton started just three games as a junior, he was a strong contributor on passing downs (30 tackles, 8.5 for loss, 5.5 sacks). Everything came together for him in 2016, garnering first-team All-Big Ten honors after leading Michigan with 9.5 sacks among his 13 tackles for loss.
Analysis
Strengths Rare combination of size, length and athletic traits as a rusher. Long-levered frame with athletic, knotted calves. Brings freaky athletic traits to table and is still growing into his body. Flashes instant reaction time off snap and up the field thanks to his twitch. Has enough upfield juice to push offensive tackles into hasty retreat. Generates pop through speed-to-power element. Very good flexibility throughout. Able to sink and swerve around corner if he gets early lead in race to the edge. Possesses hip swivel combined with shoulder turn to slip and flip around the corner of an offensive tackle he's engaged with as a pass rusher. Rushes with forward lean that keeps his momentum downhill. Uses rip-and-stab move and an ominous spin move that could turn into a dominant rush trait in the NFL. Elongated lateral slides can open into sprint very quickly to chase run play bouncing outside. Length gives him a shot at dramatically increasing his play-making ability against the run. Hand usage is improving.
Weaknesses Despite talent and traits, production and overall play has been uneven at Michigan. Earned full-time starting nod in just his final season. Needs more weight-room work. Consistency of anchor at point of attack in question. Can be rooted out of his gap by power. Can do better job of using his length to keep blockers off of him. Doesn't make enough plays on other side of the line against run. Needs to show a nastier play demeanor at all times. Scouts question whether he has enough toughness for trench battles if bumped inside or to 5-technique. Held back by his inconsistent play speed. Excessive leaning and narrowing of his base during the play causes balance and footwork inconsistencies. Needs better readiness to take on move blockers.
Sources Tell Us "Really, really talented player. You won't always see it on every play so that is going to be a coach's job to get that out of him. Rushers with his size and athleticism are hard to find and they usually go very early in the draft." -- AFC executive
NFL Comparison Chandler Jones
Bottom Line "Inconsistent" has been the buzzword that has followed Charlton since coming to Michigan, but he began the process of shaking it during his senior season. Charlton is an ascending prospect with the size, length, athleticism and pass-rushing potential that NFL general managers dream of. What you see today might not be what you get. While his production coming out of college will be modest, he could become a substantially better player as a pro if he's committed to the weight room and willing to absorb coaching. High-impact defensive end with all-pro potential is his ceiling. His floor is solid starter.
Overview
Vidauntae "Taco" Charlton continually improved during his Michigan career. The first-team All-Ohio selection "crossed the border" from Pickerington, a Columbus suburb, to play for the Wolverines (along with tight end Jake Butt). He played mostly on special teams as a true freshman (two tackles), then saw his playing time increase in 2014 (19 tackles, 5.5 for loss, 3.5 sacks, one start). Though Charlton started just three games as a junior, he was a strong contributor on passing downs (30 tackles, 8.5 for loss, 5.5 sacks). Everything came together for him in 2016, garnering first-team All-Big Ten honors after leading Michigan with 9.5 sacks among his 13 tackles for loss.
Analysis
Strengths Rare combination of size, length and athletic traits as a rusher. Long-levered frame with athletic, knotted calves. Brings freaky athletic traits to table and is still growing into his body. Flashes instant reaction time off snap and up the field thanks to his twitch. Has enough upfield juice to push offensive tackles into hasty retreat. Generates pop through speed-to-power element. Very good flexibility throughout. Able to sink and swerve around corner if he gets early lead in race to the edge. Possesses hip swivel combined with shoulder turn to slip and flip around the corner of an offensive tackle he's engaged with as a pass rusher. Rushes with forward lean that keeps his momentum downhill. Uses rip-and-stab move and an ominous spin move that could turn into a dominant rush trait in the NFL. Elongated lateral slides can open into sprint very quickly to chase run play bouncing outside. Length gives him a shot at dramatically increasing his play-making ability against the run. Hand usage is improving.
Weaknesses Despite talent and traits, production and overall play has been uneven at Michigan. Earned full-time starting nod in just his final season. Needs more weight-room work. Consistency of anchor at point of attack in question. Can be rooted out of his gap by power. Can do better job of using his length to keep blockers off of him. Doesn't make enough plays on other side of the line against run. Needs to show a nastier play demeanor at all times. Scouts question whether he has enough toughness for trench battles if bumped inside or to 5-technique. Held back by his inconsistent play speed. Excessive leaning and narrowing of his base during the play causes balance and footwork inconsistencies. Needs better readiness to take on move blockers.
Sources Tell Us "Really, really talented player. You won't always see it on every play so that is going to be a coach's job to get that out of him. Rushers with his size and athleticism are hard to find and they usually go very early in the draft." -- AFC executive
NFL Comparison Chandler Jones
Bottom Line "Inconsistent" has been the buzzword that has followed Charlton since coming to Michigan, but he began the process of shaking it during his senior season. Charlton is an ascending prospect with the size, length, athleticism and pass-rushing potential that NFL general managers dream of. What you see today might not be what you get. While his production coming out of college will be modest, he could become a substantially better player as a pro if he's committed to the weight room and willing to absorb coaching. High-impact defensive end with all-pro potential is his ceiling. His floor is solid starter.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 5:44 pm to GMoney2600
They have Derek Barnett ranked at #22.
Overview
The defensive line talent seen in the Southeastern Conference makes it difficult to make an all-conference squad. Barnett made the honor roll three times in three years. The Nashville native was the first freshman ever to start on the line for Tennessee in 2014, making 20.5 tackles for loss (which led the SEC) and 10 sacks on the year. Barnett led the Vols with 10 more sacks in 2015, earning a spot on the Associated Press All-Bowl Team with eight tackles and a sack versus Northwestern in the Outback Bowl. In his junior year, Barnett was a first-team All-SEC pick and first-team All-American by multiple outlets with 18 tackles for loss and 12 sacks (which ranked sixth in the FBS).
Analysis
Strengths Championship hand fighter on college level. Hands are strong, fast, efficient and lethal. Punch-and-discard winner. As rusher, swats are well-timed discarding tackle's punch attempt. Attacks the edge with good forward lean and works hands and feet in harmony on road to the quarterback. Uses jab steps and lateral movement to search for the edge of the blocker. Has leverage and strength to play right through redirects. Elite production on par with former Vol and Hall of Famer Reggie White against run and as sack artist. Not content to just set the edge -- wants to make the play. Uses hand fighting and play strength to work through leverage points. Long strider who can crash down the line to challenge gap plays if unblocked. Punishing hitter. Delivers crushing tackles and sacks when given the opportunity. Hustle player who pursues the play with intent. Rag-dolls tight ends at point of attack. Plus field awareness recognizing play-action, reverses, and screens. Fluid enough to drop into space and play some zone.
Weaknesses Admitted slow starter who has had issues with sluggishness to start a season. Will overthink it at times rather than just reacting. Can be undisciplined with guessing snap count and taking penalties. Change-of-direction issues typical of a broad-waisted big man. Struggles to redirect movements suddenly once momentum starts rolling downhill. Quarterbacks with pocket mobility can elude him. Substantially more twitch in hands than in feet. Feet are average. Initial burst upfield is average. Times snap count to help with his get-off. Aggressive forward charge opens him up to cut blocks. Long stride creates base inconsistencies at point of attack. Length is a concern. Can he still win without decisive, early victories with his hands? Loops to quarterback are rounded and might need a winning, inside counter move as a pro.
NFL Comparison Nick Perry
Bottom Line Strong edge presence with NFL-caliber hand usage and play strength. Barnett is one of the most productive defensive linemen to come out of the SEC in quite some time despite lacking the length and twitch that teams usually look for off the edge. His awareness and play traits should keep him near the action and he has the talent to step into a starting base end spot right away. There could be coordinators who view him as an early down, outside backer in a 3-4 with the ability to put his hand in the ground on sub packages.
Overview
The defensive line talent seen in the Southeastern Conference makes it difficult to make an all-conference squad. Barnett made the honor roll three times in three years. The Nashville native was the first freshman ever to start on the line for Tennessee in 2014, making 20.5 tackles for loss (which led the SEC) and 10 sacks on the year. Barnett led the Vols with 10 more sacks in 2015, earning a spot on the Associated Press All-Bowl Team with eight tackles and a sack versus Northwestern in the Outback Bowl. In his junior year, Barnett was a first-team All-SEC pick and first-team All-American by multiple outlets with 18 tackles for loss and 12 sacks (which ranked sixth in the FBS).
Analysis
Strengths Championship hand fighter on college level. Hands are strong, fast, efficient and lethal. Punch-and-discard winner. As rusher, swats are well-timed discarding tackle's punch attempt. Attacks the edge with good forward lean and works hands and feet in harmony on road to the quarterback. Uses jab steps and lateral movement to search for the edge of the blocker. Has leverage and strength to play right through redirects. Elite production on par with former Vol and Hall of Famer Reggie White against run and as sack artist. Not content to just set the edge -- wants to make the play. Uses hand fighting and play strength to work through leverage points. Long strider who can crash down the line to challenge gap plays if unblocked. Punishing hitter. Delivers crushing tackles and sacks when given the opportunity. Hustle player who pursues the play with intent. Rag-dolls tight ends at point of attack. Plus field awareness recognizing play-action, reverses, and screens. Fluid enough to drop into space and play some zone.
Weaknesses Admitted slow starter who has had issues with sluggishness to start a season. Will overthink it at times rather than just reacting. Can be undisciplined with guessing snap count and taking penalties. Change-of-direction issues typical of a broad-waisted big man. Struggles to redirect movements suddenly once momentum starts rolling downhill. Quarterbacks with pocket mobility can elude him. Substantially more twitch in hands than in feet. Feet are average. Initial burst upfield is average. Times snap count to help with his get-off. Aggressive forward charge opens him up to cut blocks. Long stride creates base inconsistencies at point of attack. Length is a concern. Can he still win without decisive, early victories with his hands? Loops to quarterback are rounded and might need a winning, inside counter move as a pro.
NFL Comparison Nick Perry
Bottom Line Strong edge presence with NFL-caliber hand usage and play strength. Barnett is one of the most productive defensive linemen to come out of the SEC in quite some time despite lacking the length and twitch that teams usually look for off the edge. His awareness and play traits should keep him near the action and he has the talent to step into a starting base end spot right away. There could be coordinators who view him as an early down, outside backer in a 3-4 with the ability to put his hand in the ground on sub packages.
Posted on 2/16/17 at 8:14 am to L.A.
Don't get the love for Myles Garret. Yes he is an athletic freak but he has consistently been poor against the run and doesn't have good numbers in SEC play. IMO he will be a bust
Posted on 2/16/17 at 8:20 am to L.A.
quote:
And they worry about his instincts
Yea, that write up was just one big who's who of scouting buzz words.
quote:
Alabama's star inside linebacker started his ascension to elite prospect status last summer when he lost 20 pounds. His newfound speed and agility, while keeping his trademark aggression and instincts, made him a unanimous first-team All-American and All-SEC pick.
quote:
Instincts are just average. Overly reliant on speed and athleticism over instincts and feel. Can be a tick slow to respond to play-action.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 8:10 am to L.A.
If Myles Garret is the undisputed best player in this draft, I can't imagine how high Arden Key should be rated when he comes out.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 8:22 am to GMoney2600
quote:
Derek Barnett
quote:
Struggles to redirect movements suddenly once momentum starts rolling downhill. Quarterbacks with pocket mobility can elude him. Substantially more twitch in hands than in feet. Feet are average. Initial burst upfield is average.
Watch out, here comes BigBrod to say all the info in this thread is invalid and this evaluator is clueless...
Posted on 2/18/17 at 8:47 am to cbree88
Key has to get better against the run.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 9:32 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
Watch out, here comes BigBrod to say all the info in this thread is invalid and this evaluator is clueless...
Yes, these scouting reports are always the same between sites & they are always 100 % accurate.
quote:
The best traits that Barnett illustrates are an ability to sink his hips and dip under tackles to get leverage in chasing down the quarterback. Barnett bends extremely well and has enough lower body strength to stay up with tackles pressing down on him. Barnett's hands are very good for a college player. He shows a nice ability to use his hands and feet at the same time. Tackles try to get a hold of Barnett, but he has strong hands to slap them away and get free of blocks. Once Barnett is free, he has a real burst to close and is adept at getting the quarterback to the ground.
In the ground game, Barnett is a solid defender. He has room for improvement, but isn't a liability. Barnett could wear down in the NFL and should continue to work on his strength be a run stopper as a professional.
Barnett has other areas to improve. He is a little stiff in the open field with redirection, so that is one area to get better at. Most importantly for the NFL, Barnett should work on building up a repertoire of pass-rushing moves. He needs to develop a spin move, a rip move, and maybe a club move if he adds strength. Barnett is too reliant on using speed and trying to dip under offensive tackles. In the NFL, he's going to need more than that.
LINK
This post was edited on 2/18/17 at 10:07 am
Posted on 2/18/17 at 9:46 am to Jcorye1
quote:
Key has to get better against the run.
This post was edited on 2/18/17 at 9:50 am
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:02 am to Rand AlThor
Let's look at a few of NFL.com past draft analysis on a few players.
J.J. Watt
LINK
Von Miller
Dee Ford
LINK
Danielle Hunter
LINK
Vic Beasley
LINK
These all turned out to be 100% correct, right?
J.J. Watt
quote:
WEAKNESSES
Won't consistently get the edge on tackles with his get off or quickness. Plays high at times, can be blown off the ball by the double team, but does fight hard to hold ground. Lacks some lateral mobility both rushing the passer and playing in space. Will occasionally give up outside contain.
LINK
Von Miller
quote:
WEAKNESSES
Does not have a thick lower half and at times will struggle to disengage from bigger offensive tackles in the running game. Takes poor angles at times in run support. Lacks the experience in man coverage and will not be able to cover more athletic tight ends.
Dee Ford
quote:
Weaknesses
Undersized -- thin-framed, lacks bulk and anchor strength to dig in vs. the run. Cannot convert speed to power and gets stalled if he cannot work half of a blocker. Struggles to discard blockers when locked up and gets inverted. Not comfortable moving in reverse. Has consistently been dinged with injuries and has never made it through a full season healthy. Recorded a very pedestrian 4.73-second 20-yard shuttle time at his pro day, indicative of marginal change of direction.
LINK
Danielle Hunter
quote:
Weaknesses
Relies heavily on his athleticism and motor over skill and instincts. Pass-rush production doesn't match the traits. Played 80 percent of the defensive snaps in 2014, managing just 1.5 sacks. Doesn't have the upfield burst and bend to turn the corner. Considered a "thinker" as a pass rusher rather than a naturally instinctive reactor. Must show he can effectively counter as a pass rusher. Has winning power in hands, but inconsistent with how he uses them against run and pass. Scouts want to see more competitive nastiness from him.
LINK
Vic Beasley
quote:
Weaknesses
High cut with narrow waist and thin legs. Needs to add more bulk. Unlikely to convert speed to power against NFL tackles. Wins with athleticism on majority of his sacks. Rarely transitions from speed rush to spin as an instinctual pass-rush counter. Lacks ideal arm length. Too often content to stay blocked if pass rush stalls out. Needs to shed blocks more consistently against run. Good football character, but scouts are concerned about a lack of alpha-dog tenacity.
LINK
These all turned out to be 100% correct, right?
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:12 am to WreckinRams05
quote:How did Michael Sam's awesome numbers in SEC play work out for him?
Don't get the love for Myles Garret. Yes he is an athletic freak but he has consistently been poor against the run and doesn't have good numbers in SEC play. IMO he will be a bust
Athleticism
Production
Put yourself too deeply into either and you can be led astray. Danielle Hunter had like 3 sacks his last season at LSU, just posted 10 sacks for Minny and is turning into Khalil Mack-lite against the run.
You don't draft a player for what they did in college. It doesn't ever really matter.
quote:
These all turned out to be 100% correct, right?
But these were all accurate, according to observation anyway.
And you know what happened? They grew. They worked on their weaknesses and thanks to their hard work, their talent, and the ability of the coaching staff and resources available to the players, they overcame their flaws.
Weaknesses should never really be looked at as "This is why they'll be busts." Even if it is why some players bust.
This post was edited on 2/18/17 at 10:15 am
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:17 am to BigBrod81
I will say a few things here. The weakness pointed out may have been valid to a point. Players have to be put in situations to be successful. The thing about defensive players is that we tend to remember the "star plays". A defense will face 65-75 offensive plays most games. A top notch defender will be on the field for 40-45 of those plays. In 20-25 of those plays they are never really involved. The run goes to the opposite side or the pass come out quickly.
Point is that for all of this players they have to be really special about 4-5 times a game. If Von Miller gets 2 sacks and 2 stops behind the line then he is an All-Pro.
Point is that for all of this players they have to be really special about 4-5 times a game. If Von Miller gets 2 sacks and 2 stops behind the line then he is an All-Pro.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:18 am to BigBrod81
quote:
Von Miller
quote:
WEAKNESSES
Does not have a thick lower half and at times will struggle to disengage from bigger offensive tackles in the running game. Takes poor angles at times in run support. Lacks the experience in man coverage and will not be able to cover more athletic tight ends.
not that this is his strong suite but I immediately thought of this play.
LINK
This post was edited on 2/18/17 at 10:19 am
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:23 am to LooseCannon22282
That play it looked like they were in a zone. So Brady misread the drop.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:30 am to tigerterrace
well, right.
but nonetheless it was an interception for a player who most see as just a pure pass rusher (one dimensional player)
I've gotten to the point where reading a players strengths and weaknesses from some random/anonymous scout isn't interesting to me anymore.
but nonetheless it was an interception for a player who most see as just a pure pass rusher (one dimensional player)
I've gotten to the point where reading a players strengths and weaknesses from some random/anonymous scout isn't interesting to me anymore.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:33 am to GMoney2600
WEAKNESSES Instincts are just average. Overly reliant on speed and athleticism over instincts and feel. Can be a tick slow to respond to play-action. Inconsistent defeating blocks. Too eager to take on everyone at the point of attack. Gets shoulder covered up firing into incoming blockers. Needs to improve stack and shed technique to keep himself clean. Will drop his head at times as tackler. Poor tackling technique led to "stinger" issues early in his career.
SOURCES TELL US "He's not a MIKE linebacker. I think he's a pure run-and-hit WILL linebacker with good cover talent. I'm worried about what his medicals will show because he's had some issues with stingers during his career. I have a higher grade on him than I had on Reggie Ragland. Better pro potential to me." -- NFC director of scouting
NFL COMPARISON Bobby Wagner
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As per the other post on this board by know people know my lack of desire for Foster. As I have stated I have met the kid and he is not the brightest bulb.
Saying that I agree that he is not a MLB. Now if we somehow think we can get him to perform as the WLB I would be more open to the pick.
My fear here would be that we took Anthony 2 years ago and he played MLB under Ryan where he was able to play like Foster at Bama, but under Allen's scheme and attempt to move to WLB it has become public knowledge that he has struggled to pick up the cerebral part of the game.
I have to think that an Allen-Foster combination might yield similar results. The comparison to Wagner may be a good one, but think about how that Seahawk defense is allowed to fly around the field from every position.
Ryan/Allen it doesn't matter the Saints play defense to defend the next 10 yards of turf. The Seahawks played defense to take the ball away and push you backward.
SOURCES TELL US "He's not a MIKE linebacker. I think he's a pure run-and-hit WILL linebacker with good cover talent. I'm worried about what his medicals will show because he's had some issues with stingers during his career. I have a higher grade on him than I had on Reggie Ragland. Better pro potential to me." -- NFC director of scouting
NFL COMPARISON Bobby Wagner
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As per the other post on this board by know people know my lack of desire for Foster. As I have stated I have met the kid and he is not the brightest bulb.
Saying that I agree that he is not a MLB. Now if we somehow think we can get him to perform as the WLB I would be more open to the pick.
My fear here would be that we took Anthony 2 years ago and he played MLB under Ryan where he was able to play like Foster at Bama, but under Allen's scheme and attempt to move to WLB it has become public knowledge that he has struggled to pick up the cerebral part of the game.
I have to think that an Allen-Foster combination might yield similar results. The comparison to Wagner may be a good one, but think about how that Seahawk defense is allowed to fly around the field from every position.
Ryan/Allen it doesn't matter the Saints play defense to defend the next 10 yards of turf. The Seahawks played defense to take the ball away and push you backward.
Posted on 2/18/17 at 10:52 am to Eman5805
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And you know what happened? They grew. They worked on their weaknesses and thanks to their hard work, their talent, and the ability of the coaching staff and resources available to the players, they overcame their flaws.
Weaknesses should never really be looked at as "This is why they'll be busts." Even if it is why some players bust.
If you are examining any college player’s game, you will find something to nitpick about because they are not finished products. You have to be to be able to evaluate a player’s strengths then project what type of player he could be if he improves on his weaknesses.
Some people are under the impression that these scouting reports are gospel & will determine a player’s success or lack there of in the NFL. This was just a continuation from another thread from last weekend where Rand AlThor was adamant about the validity of these reports.
What you posted needed to be highlighted because it can get lost in the draft process when people focus too much on highlight reels, scouting reports & physical measurables. There's also other aspects that make great players great that can't be seen a video or read in a scouting report.
quote:
That’s not to say that there’s no room for subjective measures in evaluation — scouts still place tremendous value on intangible measures like work ethic and leadership. Each year, players see their draft stock rise based on the outcome of personal interviews and feedback from college coaches and teammates. Players’ value to the NFL goes far beyond their on-field performance — teams value the role that players have in building a strong locker room, and in contributing to the community.
LINK
Barnett for example is a player who plays with a lot of heart. He is the type of player who will leave everything on the field of play. His work ethic is well documented inside of the Vol program. He is also a natural leader of men. Those are invaluable aspects of prospects that constantly get overlooked.
quote:
"I feel like he took a big jump in his leadership from that game, and he's started to become more vocal. He let us know what we need to do and what he's going to do in order to win the game. I feel like that was a big step for him in the process."
Barnett never has been a big talker, at least when recorders and television cameras are near him, and he especially prefers not to talk about himself or his developing leadership skills.
He remains aware, though, of the impact he can have on a game and on his teammates, both in the heat of a desperate second-half rally or during the doldrums of a Tuesday afternoon practice.
"I get a sense for it, and some young guys tell me they look up to me and stuff," Barnett said. "I continue and try to do things correctly. I feel like everybody's a leader, and everybody's a leader in different ways. I'm not the only leader on the team. We have many great leaders on our team."
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The Vols knew they would be without cornerback Cameron Sutton and linebacker Darrin Kirkland Jr. going into the game, and linebacker Jalen Reeves-Maybin gave it a go before taking himself out of the game.
Those are three of Tennessee's best vocal leaders and most productive players.
quote:
Defensive coordinator Bob Shoop after the game told Bruce Feldman of Fox Sports that Barnett called out several of his teammates for not responding to coaching during a practice last week.
"That's what the alpha male is supposed to do," Shoop told Feldman. "What he did for the team this week I'll never forget. It was pretty impressive."
The most impressive part came in the second half, when Barnett had two sacks and a tackle for loss in a four-play span to end two Florida possessions.
"It was just Derek saying, 'Climb on my back, I got this,'" Shoop told Fox Sports. "I'm not sure I've ever had a player take over a game quite like he did for us."
LINK
Not only could the Saints defense use the added pass rush Barnett brings to the table but his leadership will help too. Where is that aspect of Barnett's personality, work ethic traits & leadership skills mentioned in the online scouting reports though? Scouting departments get that info from talking to college coaches & they use the interview time at the combine to verify what they have heard. Great players not only perform on the field of play but they can get others around them to elevate their play. With Rankins, Breaux, Vaccaro & the other young players on defense, there's a good nucleus already. Somebody like Barnett with bringing in added pass rush & pushing players to bring it everyday, will provide an added fire to the defense that has really been lacking for a long time.
This post was edited on 2/18/17 at 12:59 pm
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