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Zach Lowe on the Hornets rest of the year
Posted on 3/5/13 at 2:13 pm
Posted on 3/5/13 at 2:13 pm
LINK
quote:
Nothing shocking here: The Hornets need to see some very important pieces of their young nucleus mesh a bit better. New Orleans definitely put out Eric Gordon feelers at the trade deadline, but he's still around, and it's unclear how interested the team really is in moving him. It would help if Gordon could rediscover his shooting stroke and continue to develop a pick-and-roll chemistry with Anthony Davis; the two are still learning the timing of the pick-and-roll dance, and Davis projects as a devastating dive-man finisher once he gets that timing down.
Davis's shakiness on defense in space has been a bit of a surprise, and the Davis–Ryan Anderson front line has been a disaster; the Hornets have allowed 113.1 points per 100 possessions when those two share the floor, nearly 4.5 points worse than Sacramento's league-worst defense, and the worst number of any of the 40 or so New Orleans player pairs who have logged at least 275 minutes. The Hornets' defense, with a pack-the-paint emphasis nearly on par with Charlotte's, has been bad all season, and finding some synergy with the Anderson-Davis duo would be a nice coda — especially since Monty Williams appears to have (wisely) abandoned the idea of using one of them as a small forward.
The Hornets can nab max-level cap space this summer, in part because Robin Lopez's deal is only $500,000 guaranteed for next season. The team's faith in the Anderson-Davis pair will help determine how much it should spend on other back-line defenders. Continued incremental progress from Austin Rivers would also be nice, to say the least.
5
Posted on 3/5/13 at 2:25 pm to corndeaux
quote:
the Davis–Ryan Anderson front line has been a disaster; the Hornets have allowed 113.1 points per 100 possessions when those two share the floor
Any armchair McGregorstrators want to take a stab at explaining this? Is this all on Davis? Anderson + Lopez or Smith both give a rating of 103 vs. 113 with Davis. LINK /
Posted on 3/5/13 at 2:28 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
Any armchair McGregorstrators want to take a stab at explaining this?
It seems pretty obvious: neither of them are very strong, 'big' guys. Ryno is not a particularly good defender to begin with, especially down low, and Davis is a rookie that needs to put on a lot of muscle. Anyone who is physical can get the better of them right now.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 2:34 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
Davis–Ryan Anderson front line has been a disaster; the Hornets have allowed 113.1 points per 100 possessions when those two share the floor
Hopefully with Davis bulking up in the offseason, his defense will improve. Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:03 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:+1
It seems pretty obvious: neither of them are very strong, 'big' guys. Ryno is not a particularly good defender to begin with, especially down low, and Davis is a rookie that needs to put on a lot of muscle. Anyone who is physical can get the better of them right now.
Its why the folks waiting to turn Davis into a center shouldn't hold their breathes.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:05 pm to eyeran
quote:
Its why the folks waiting to turn Davis into a center shouldn't hold their breathes.
What does that mean for the future though. Is Davis and Anderson a doomed pairing?
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:10 pm to corndeaux
quote:
Davis's shakiness on defense in space has been a bit of a surprise, and the Davis–Ryan Anderson front line has been a disaster; the Hornets have allowed 113.1 points per 100 possessions when those two share the floor, nearly 4.5 points worse than Sacramento's league-worst defense, and the worst number of any of the 40 or so New Orleans player pairs who have logged at least 275 minutes
Part of our "end of the game" lineup of the future
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:12 pm to TigerinATL
Not necessarily, imo. Anderson as a sharpshooter off the bench is still really valuable. Just means they problem won't be playing 35+ minutes together.
They could also get away with it against teams without a true center. When they played Dallas a few weeks ago I thought Davis/Anderson played well together because Dallas was playing Dirk at center.
They could also get away with it against teams without a true center. When they played Dallas a few weeks ago I thought Davis/Anderson played well together because Dallas was playing Dirk at center.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:24 pm to corndeaux
quote:
40 or so New Orleans player pairs who have logged at least 275 minutes.
I wonder how this ranks...
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:27 pm to eyeran
quote:
Just means they problem won't be playing 35+ minutes together.
Is that really maximizing your talent though? Like do you see a scenario where they both get 35+ minutes without Davis moving to C?
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:32 pm to eyeran
quote:
Not necessarily, imo. Anderson as a sharpshooter off the bench is still really valuable. Just means they problem won't be playing 35+ minutes together.
They could also get away with it against teams without a true center. When they played Dallas a few weeks ago I thought Davis/Anderson played well together because Dallas was playing Dirk at center.
Like I was saying in the Vasquez thread, Anderson just doesn't fit well next to Davis, so we have to minimize their minutes together. As Davis' minutes grow, Anderson's minutes will have to drop unless one of them wakes up as a Center or SF one day, which I don't expect.
I think Davis' real value is as a PF going forward. He may log some minutes at C, but guarding bangers all game long will wear him down. For that reason, I think Anderson is, as much as I'd hate to see him go, our best trade asset. Not only is his value steadily climbing, but he is a redundancy. Sucks, but that value could be used better elsewhere.
I do think Davis can bulk up some, and I like the core of Vasquez/Davis/Anderson. I really think we need to keep those three around through the All Star Break next year to see how things shake out. We should have a better idea of Davis' future then.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:33 pm to WB504
quote:No and No.
Is that really maximizing your talent though? Like do you see a scenario where they both get 35+ minutes without Davis moving to C?
I just don't understand the need to force Davis into being the center that he's not. He has a decade+ of dominance at PF ahead of him.
"Worst case" scenario is Anderson is just a really good trade asset.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 3:50 pm to Jester
quote:
I think Anderson is, as much as I'd hate to see him go, our best trade asset. Not only is his value steadily climbing, but he is a redundancy. Sucks, but that value could be used better elsewhere.
He's definitely our best trade asset...He's a very good player on a good contract. He has a lot of value, but I don't want to trade him.
How is he a redundancy? His skill-set is not very common in the league or on this team.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 4:34 pm to eyeran
quote:
I just don't understand the need to force Davis into being the center that he's not. He has a decade+ of dominance at PF ahead of him.
I'm just trying to maximize our talent. If Davis is to remain at PF, which I have no problem with, then I think eventually Ryno has to be moved.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 4:47 pm to drake20
quote:
How is he a redundancy?
He can only play one position, a position where we just drafted a guy #1 overall to become our franchise player. That is redundancy. Maybe redundancy was a poor word choice, but I haven't seen anything that makes me think they can play big minutes together.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 5:20 pm to WB504
quote:Probably true.
I'm just trying to maximize our talent. If Davis is to remain at PF, which I have no problem with, then I think eventually Ryno has to be moved.
We all love Anderson, but there's no way we compromise Davis to force a fit with Anderson.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 5:38 pm to TigerinATL
Im not a big fan of 2 man #s. Aminu ranks in 5 of the top 7 lineups. I dont think that means he is a core piece.
I like the 5 man #s much more. Those still aren't great, but give a bit more context.
A super small lineup with Mason/Gordon/Vasquez and those 2 is giving up 1.51 PPP in 24 minutes according to NBA.com
With Vasquez/Aminu/Gordon its 1.04 PPP.
With Aminu/Rivers/Vasquez its .98 PPP.
Context matters. Are Ryno/Davis perfect complements? No. But they can work together if you put the right pieces around them
I like the 5 man #s much more. Those still aren't great, but give a bit more context.
A super small lineup with Mason/Gordon/Vasquez and those 2 is giving up 1.51 PPP in 24 minutes according to NBA.com
With Vasquez/Aminu/Gordon its 1.04 PPP.
With Aminu/Rivers/Vasquez its .98 PPP.
Context matters. Are Ryno/Davis perfect complements? No. But they can work together if you put the right pieces around them
This post was edited on 3/5/13 at 5:39 pm
Posted on 3/5/13 at 8:05 pm to WB504
quote:
I'm just trying to maximize our talent. If Davis is to remain at PF, which I have no problem with, then I think eventually Ryno has to be moved.
This is the bottom line, imo.
Obviously, Davis is the most important part of this team. We don't want to force him into a bad situation for a less important Anderson if it can't work.
Anderson is very valuable too though, He's our second best player right now (best, really). He's young and on a great contract.
I think he and Davis can work at PF and C. AD will not add a lot of weight, but he can add some. He WILL gain knowledge, experience, and strength. His great length and shot-blocking will compensate for getting moved by thicker players.
However, I don't think his being moved and banged up by centers is a given after a couple years of NBA experience and training (in addition to him finishing growing into a man and the amount of weight he will add).
All this talk about him getting banged up and worn down at the C position. He's going to have to bang on the boards regardless. He'll tangle with centers and power forwards (and the other positions) on the glass on both sides of the court.
From a defensive perspective, there aren't that many offensively talented centers that can "wear down" Davis. The most offensively talented centers aren't very physically imposing (Lopez). The strong/thick physically imposing bigs lack the offensive capabilities to give Davis too much trouble. Howard, Bynum and a few exceptions, but they're tough for every team.
Majority of centers listed weights are between 230-260 lbs. Guys don't gain too much weight after coming into the league, but a very young guy that's still maturing will do some gaining as he grows up (plus muscle weight from lifting). If Davis gains 10-15 lbs, he will be of similar weight to some of the top centers in the league.
I think Davis is gonna get banged up/worn down regardless of position, and I think he can handle it. He's the #1 pick. He will have to go against guys bigger and stronger than him every night for 33+ minutes whether he's playing PF or C.
JMO
KG as a 19 year old rookie...now a top C in the league.
Tyson Chandler as a 19 year old rookie.
...Noah and Bynum were pretty skinny guys at that age too, if i remember correctly.
Posted on 3/5/13 at 8:15 pm to corndeaux
quote:
The Hornets' defense, with a pack-the-paint emphasis nearly on par with Charlotte's, has been bad all season, and finding some synergy with the Anderson-Davis duo would be a nice coda — especially since Monty Williams appears to have (wisely) abandoned the idea of using one of them as a small forward.
Well there goes my whole idea of Anderson at SF. I don't want to trade Anderson, but it's a shame they can't play together.
I'm just playing devil's advocate here, but could Davis be the one they should float for trades? He would have much more value than Anderson and packaged with Gordon, oculd bring back a huge superstar (Love?).
Posted on 3/5/13 at 8:26 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
It seems pretty obvious: neither of them are very strong, 'big' guys. Ryno is not a particularly good defender to begin with, especially down low, and Davis is a rookie that needs to put on a lot of muscle. Anyone who is physical can get the better of them right now.
this is why I am kind of pulling for the Pelicans to draft Anthony Bennett...I think he can play SF in the NBA, he's a big guy and could be Brandon Bass-like - basically a bully that can beat up guys
the Pelicans have no one that can really bully people Jason Smiht is a spot up shooter, AD is a very finesse player right now, Ryno plays a lot of his game outside the paint, and Lopez is really the only guy that "bangs" down low
Bennett is the exact same height and weight as Melo was when he came out of the draft he a tough guy I think thats in part something the Pelicans are missing
anyway thats my thoughts
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