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Posted on 6/4/17 at 11:39 pm to THRILLHO
Jrue is leaving. I know I know, sauces but I have had more than one conversation with someone high up in the organization that has point blank said, "Jrue isn't going to be a Pelican next year." oddly enough, and this makes 0 sense to me, he also said blake griffin would be "interesting". I almost threw up in my mouth. He also said CP would be approached.
TIFWIW, I have no reason to pull shite out of my arse.
TIFWIW, I have no reason to pull shite out of my arse.
Posted on 6/5/17 at 12:44 am to touchdownjeebus
If we can get Rubio and let jrue walk, I wouldn't hate it.
I just hate the fact it would be two years in a row we didn't get rid of assets for some value.
Gordon and Anderson were fetching picks. Jrue was worth Zach lavine at a point.
How good would we look right now if we had Rubio and lavine? Somehow pair the picks with asik and clearing his contract.
Rubio-moore-hill-davis-cousins
Lavine-crawford-cunningham-diallo-ajinca
I just hate the fact it would be two years in a row we didn't get rid of assets for some value.
Gordon and Anderson were fetching picks. Jrue was worth Zach lavine at a point.
How good would we look right now if we had Rubio and lavine? Somehow pair the picks with asik and clearing his contract.
Rubio-moore-hill-davis-cousins
Lavine-crawford-cunningham-diallo-ajinca
Posted on 6/5/17 at 5:34 am to touchdownjeebus
Blake does make zero sense and makes me question everything else your sauce said. Trade Cousins and add Blake could make sense except for the pretty well known fact that AD doesn't want to play center. Nearly every bad roster decision the last several years has been rooted in appeasing AD not wanting to play center.
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 5:36 am
Posted on 6/5/17 at 6:43 am to touchdownjeebus
Sources or sauces?
Posted on 6/5/17 at 7:16 am to TigerinATL
quote:
have an asset that continues to be worth less than they thought
seems like some Dell Demps PTSD going on here
Bledsoe is a good player on a good deal for another 2 years. as he gets closer to expiring, yes, his value will go down. but that doesn't mean he's in the "first offer gets him" pile.
this feels like we all know Demps is going to move the '18 pick and we're constructing trades that would make it worth it. and, yes, i would be happy to get Bledsoe. it doesnt feel like likely, but who knows.
we'll see what shakes out in the draft- if they get Fox at 4, then Bledsoe would seem to be out fairly quickly and maybe a future 1st is all it takes. if they take Jackson or Tatum, im not sure they are harmed by keeping him around, even if he doesn't fit their new timeline or he eventually just walks in FA.
Posted on 6/5/17 at 7:38 am to corndeaux
I wasn't thinking Pels or Demps at all when I posted that. I was thinking Denver, but it happens all the time in the league because most GMs over value their own assets. Now Denver has made use of the guys they've over valued, but I'm assuming Phoenix drafts a guard and Bledsoe is on the way out. Sitting a vet as part of a rebuild effort rarely means the vet is part of the future plans.
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 7:49 am
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:16 am to TigerinATL
I feel like I say this a lot but I also feel like I have to keep reminding people because they keep making the same false assumptions
Drafting a 19 year old does not then make the team trade guys from that position!
After Denver drafted Murray, did they turn around and unload their glut of guards and perimeter players?
The Wolves added guards on the summer after drafting Dunn and he was considered more NBA ready at the time. Heck, the Pels signed two shooting guards after drafting Hield!
"Team X will trade Y player for 60 cents on the dollar to make room for the 19 yr old"
Is the worst assumption fans make.
Drafting a 19 year old does not then make the team trade guys from that position!
After Denver drafted Murray, did they turn around and unload their glut of guards and perimeter players?
The Wolves added guards on the summer after drafting Dunn and he was considered more NBA ready at the time. Heck, the Pels signed two shooting guards after drafting Hield!
"Team X will trade Y player for 60 cents on the dollar to make room for the 19 yr old"
Is the worst assumption fans make.
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 8:20 am
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:25 am to Crewz
Certainly true.
I do think Phoenix is in a different spot than Minnesota and Denver were.
If I were McDonough and I got Fox, I'd be much more eager to trade Bledsoe for less than I think he's worth for long term building reasons.
Let Booker/Fox get tons of reps, let Chriss/Bender continue to develop all while losing enough to get another high lottery pick to add to the mix.
But that's me and I'm not the guy who may lose his job soon
I do think Phoenix is in a different spot than Minnesota and Denver were.
If I were McDonough and I got Fox, I'd be much more eager to trade Bledsoe for less than I think he's worth for long term building reasons.
Let Booker/Fox get tons of reps, let Chriss/Bender continue to develop all while losing enough to get another high lottery pick to add to the mix.
But that's me and I'm not the guy who may lose his job soon
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:29 am to TigerinATL
quote:
Sitting a vet as part of a rebuild effort rarely means the vet is part of the future plans.
Right. Hell, they sat Bledsoe for 30 games this year for tanking.
I get the logic from our perspective- tank, get a pick, be good in 4 years. Just hard to sell "Hey, we're going to dump our best player for less than he's worth to be really bad (again) so that hopefully we are good in 4 years" ownership/business office. Especially for a GM with a checkered record
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:30 am to Crewz
The Suns aren't at the stage where they are attempting to win right now though, the same can't really be said for Denver or Minnesota. Both of those teams thought that they could make the playoffs this past season. I believe the Suns are just trying to see what they have in Chriss, Bender, and whatever pick they land in this draft. They already seem to have a really good starting SG, and now they are just trying to build on that with young talent, IMO.
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:33 am to Crewz
quote:
Drafting a 19 year old does not then make the team trade guys from that position!
Drafting 1 19 year old sure, but assuming Phoenix drafts a guard they'll have 2 guards and 2 bigs 20 and under. Given Sarver's cheap reputation trying to ride Bledsoe to the playoffs wouldn't be out of character, but from a rational team building perspective it would be. They will potentially have 4 future starters that need to play to get better with Booker the only one guaranteed any reasonable amount of playing time if aiming for the playoffs is the goal.
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 8:35 am
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:34 am to THRILLHO
My one gripe with the Moore for Rubio deal is you're trading a guy that can hit 3s at a decent rate for a guy who can't. Granted, Rubio can do plenty of other stuff and his mid range game is great, but it still digs a deeper hole for our 3 pt shooting
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:42 am to Hazelnut
Hill really needs to up his 3 pt rate to about 37-38%.
Posted on 6/5/17 at 8:59 am to corndeaux
Your last sentence is why all the logic that came before it gets blown up
If this is NBA 2K and you have the job as long as you want it, you ship off Bledsoe for whatever you can get and give Fox reps
But these are real men with real jobs they can lose. And it's why time and time again, fans see a team drafting a player, then they assume another at the same position will be thrown away, and it doesn't happen
If this is NBA 2K and you have the job as long as you want it, you ship off Bledsoe for whatever you can get and give Fox reps
But these are real men with real jobs they can lose. And it's why time and time again, fans see a team drafting a player, then they assume another at the same position will be thrown away, and it doesn't happen
Posted on 6/5/17 at 9:00 am to Crewz
To be clear, I think Bledsoe might very well get traded, but he won't be given away. You gotta give up something significant and/or take on a contract like Tyson
Posted on 6/5/17 at 9:18 am to Crewz
But at some point doesn't the fan pressure go from "why aren't we winning more" to "why aren't 3 top 8 picks getting more than 15 MPG?" I also wonder how much the TV money changes the pressure on GMs to win. I threw out Sarver's cheapness earlier because in the past he was the type of owner that had to be Playoffs or Bust just to make ends meet. In the new NBA you'd have to have a terrible local TV deal and nearly empty arenas to even come close to losing money.
Posted on 6/5/17 at 9:30 am to TigerinATL
quote:
"why aren't 3 top 8 picks getting more than 15 MPG?"
the guy that needs to be dumped is Brandon Knight. that deal has been a disaster for them.
you can get minutes for a 3 guard rotation of Bledsoe, Booker, Fox and still have some left over for Ulis. somewhere in the 20-25 for a rookie PG with an obvious shooting deficiency is about right.
and that's assuming they can pick Fox. if they trade back for Smith or the French pg, those guys would seem to be less ready to play those minutes.
plenty of minutes for Bender/Chriss. the thing to remember with both of those guys is how unbelievably young and raw they are. think back to Davis's rookie year and the bitching that many of us (myself included) did at times about his minutes. those guys are less gifted, less prepared, and weaker than Davis was then.
Posted on 6/5/17 at 9:32 am to TigerinATL
Fan pressure rarely, if ever, comes into a convo for GMs.
And again, we are talking about young, young kids who should still be in school. Heck, Devin Booker is still 3-4 years away from his prime, let alone Fox. There is no rush to play these guys a ton, and any coach who wants to keep his job will just make them ride the pine anyway
Not to mention the biggest factor:: If you are viewed as a team who will give away assets at a discount, you become known as that GM around the league, and teams will always try to low ball you. If you stand firm, even when teams know you want to sell, they will know they will have to come correct when they want an asset of yours in the future
There is Sooooo much more to being a GM than the move right in front of your face
And again, we are talking about young, young kids who should still be in school. Heck, Devin Booker is still 3-4 years away from his prime, let alone Fox. There is no rush to play these guys a ton, and any coach who wants to keep his job will just make them ride the pine anyway
Not to mention the biggest factor:: If you are viewed as a team who will give away assets at a discount, you become known as that GM around the league, and teams will always try to low ball you. If you stand firm, even when teams know you want to sell, they will know they will have to come correct when they want an asset of yours in the future
There is Sooooo much more to being a GM than the move right in front of your face
This post was edited on 6/5/17 at 9:34 am
Posted on 6/5/17 at 9:45 am to TigerinATL
quote:
Blake does make zero sense and makes me question everything else your sauce said. Trade Cousins and add Blake could make sense except for the pretty well known fact that AD doesn't want to play center. Nearly every bad roster decision the last several years has been rooted in appeasing AD not wanting to play center.
Let's play stupid for the sake of playing stupid. What better way to combat GSW and to a lesser extent Cleveland by going so big they literally can't handle the size.
Let's not use a traditional PG because you have two of the top 5 passing bigs in the NBA with a 3rd beginning to learn the ropes.
PG - Moore
SG - Grits
SF - Davis
PF - Griffin
C - Cousins
As stupid as it sounds, just go double or nothing, shite. Try to create the new wave. To top it off, you've cornered the big man market in that scenario. Where are you going to go if this by some miracle is a successful venture?
Davis doesn't have to put on muscle in this scenario. He can play lighter and faster at the SF position, working on his perimeter, drive/kick, and post-up game.
Again, playing stupid for playing stupid's sake. I don't think it's impossible though.
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