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re: Pelicans unhappy....source
Posted on 5/25/17 at 4:43 pm to TigerinATL
Posted on 5/25/17 at 4:43 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
because those 2 on their own could potentially carry you to the playoffs surrounded by relatively cheap 3 and D players.
sure they can get you to the playoffs, but a team of two bigs and no wing players who can create and score on their own will never be a contender. NEVER.
If this franchise wants to compete at a championship level, they need to add a player that is capable of handling the ball and scoring down the stretch of games. Every championship team has had that guard that can do that. The exception in the last 20 years was Dallas. They used a great big man in Dirk, and Jason Terry as their "lead" scoring guard.
We have our Dirk. We have two of them. All we need is a guard who isn't afraid to take a big shot and can hit that big shot. Jrue isn't that guy. I want Jrue on this team, but the ultimate goal of this franchise over the next two years should be to find our Jason Terry from the '11 Mavs, or hopefully someone better than that. Hell a guy like Lou Williams could be that guy, if and only if, AD takes the final leap forward as an offensive force that is unstoppable in crunch time, which i think he is getting closer too. People forget how young AD still is and how much room he still has to grow and get better, which he has every year.
1
Posted on 5/25/17 at 5:04 pm to TeddyPadillac
The '11 Mavs would get rolled in these playoffs. As would the 04 Pistons. I know people love to use outliers as evidence that anything is possible, but the '11 Mavs would be destroyed
And no, the Pelicans wouldn't be a contender if Jrue walks. But guess what? They won't be if he stays either. The ONLY chance they have is if they stay flexible and land another guy. Could it blow up and Boogie leaves and the whole thing implodes? Sure. The floor is Jrue leaves is lower
Is getting a John Wall or Butler, etc in a year or two likely? Of course not. But it's possible if you can win 50+ and have the flexibility to get them when AD and Boogie ask them to come join them and win a title.
The Jrue path probably has a floor of 43 wins and a couple one and done years. Ceiling is a second round playoff team that might luck into a WCF one year if an injury happens to someone else
Non Jrue path has a floor of losing Boogie and having to trade AD and start all over. But it has a ceiling of a title if things break right
Now, neither path is a no brainier. I could see the argument for being happen to be the Hawks for 4-5 years. It would be fine. I also see the high risk/high reward path. That's the one I would take
Both sides have legit viewpoints. Neither side is wrong.
And no, the Pelicans wouldn't be a contender if Jrue walks. But guess what? They won't be if he stays either. The ONLY chance they have is if they stay flexible and land another guy. Could it blow up and Boogie leaves and the whole thing implodes? Sure. The floor is Jrue leaves is lower
Is getting a John Wall or Butler, etc in a year or two likely? Of course not. But it's possible if you can win 50+ and have the flexibility to get them when AD and Boogie ask them to come join them and win a title.
The Jrue path probably has a floor of 43 wins and a couple one and done years. Ceiling is a second round playoff team that might luck into a WCF one year if an injury happens to someone else
Non Jrue path has a floor of losing Boogie and having to trade AD and start all over. But it has a ceiling of a title if things break right
Now, neither path is a no brainier. I could see the argument for being happen to be the Hawks for 4-5 years. It would be fine. I also see the high risk/high reward path. That's the one I would take
Both sides have legit viewpoints. Neither side is wrong.
Posted on 5/25/17 at 5:23 pm to Crewz
I'm definitely more in the high risk high reward boat. I don't like being locked into a huge Jrue contract. I'm used to disappointment from the Pelicans so I don't fear everything bottoming out. I mean, I expected it to happen sooner before we got Boogie. So why not take the riskier route? We have nothing to lose
I'd rather play the uncertain future route than going a route of overpaying Jrue and knowing you've reached your absolute ceiling
I'd rather play the uncertain future route than going a route of overpaying Jrue and knowing you've reached your absolute ceiling
This post was edited on 5/25/17 at 5:25 pm
Posted on 5/25/17 at 5:44 pm to Hazelnut
And I can see the other side that says "This team is always shite, just give me playoffs for next five years and I will be happy"
Posted on 5/25/17 at 6:44 pm to Crewz
Is there really no world that one of the better starting point guards in the league is an asset that could help us land a better player down the road?
In my mind, we are a more appealing team if winning. And in my world, Jrue Holiday and a first round pick is more appealing to other teams than a first round pick and cap space.
This is why I can't stand the Omer Asik and Solomon Hill comparisons. There are a ton of teams that would love to have one of the better starting point guards in the league. You let Jrue Holiday leave, you are losing an asset. Asik, and even Hill to an extent aren't assets even at reasonable salaries.
In my mind, we are a more appealing team if winning. And in my world, Jrue Holiday and a first round pick is more appealing to other teams than a first round pick and cap space.
This is why I can't stand the Omer Asik and Solomon Hill comparisons. There are a ton of teams that would love to have one of the better starting point guards in the league. You let Jrue Holiday leave, you are losing an asset. Asik, and even Hill to an extent aren't assets even at reasonable salaries.
Posted on 5/25/17 at 7:10 pm to Jon1798
He will also be making nearly three times what they make. Again, if Eric Bledsoe were making 25-28 mil per right now. Today. And the Suns put him on the market, do you think teams would be lining up to give up something of value for him?
I highly doubt it and I think Bledsoe is better than Jrue.
I highly doubt it and I think Bledsoe is better than Jrue.
Posted on 5/25/17 at 7:13 pm to Jon1798
quote:
Is there really no world that one of the better starting point guards in the league is an asset that could help us land a better player down the road?
Holiday @ $25
Boogie @ $33
AD @ $36
That's $94 million in a $110 million cap. So even if you gut the roster to those 3 you only have $16 million in cap space. You are locking in to Holiday as your 3rd best player unless he's dumpable at $25 which I think is a questionable assumption.
Posted on 5/25/17 at 7:34 pm to Crewz
quote:
And I can see the other side that says "This team is always shite, just give me playoffs for next five years and I will be happy"
I'll take this, chances are that the Pels aren't beating the Warriors or Cavs in the next few years anyway. Give me a team that wins consistently, before I start wanting more.
Posted on 5/25/17 at 9:14 pm to TigerinATL
It really depends on which Jrue Holiday we get for $25 million. The Jrue Holiday we saw for that 1-2 month stretch heading into the all-star break is easily tradeable, even at $25 million. The Jrue we saw the rest of the season isn't.
That's what makes it so hard for me to gauge Jrue's value. He's not always the same player. Can he get back to the level he was before the trade, with Boogie on the team? If the FO thinks so, then they will probably up their offer to 4/100 or 5/120.
Dell has been guilty of taking the optimistic approach in the past, when it comes to gauging a player's value and offering that player a contract. Ex. Hill and Asik. He seems to sell himself and the fans on what a player could be or could grow into, but hopefully he won't do that this time. With a deal of this size, he can't afford to be wrong.
That's what makes it so hard for me to gauge Jrue's value. He's not always the same player. Can he get back to the level he was before the trade, with Boogie on the team? If the FO thinks so, then they will probably up their offer to 4/100 or 5/120.
Dell has been guilty of taking the optimistic approach in the past, when it comes to gauging a player's value and offering that player a contract. Ex. Hill and Asik. He seems to sell himself and the fans on what a player could be or could grow into, but hopefully he won't do that this time. With a deal of this size, he can't afford to be wrong.
Posted on 5/26/17 at 10:15 am to bayou39
There has got to be a job waiting for Fletcher with Fox Sports.
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