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Message
Greivis Vasquez' Elite Accomplishments
Posted on 2/26/13 at 1:57 pm
Posted on 2/26/13 at 1:57 pm
I think even the Vasquez fan boys would admit he's not an elite player, but I keep seeing stats that put him in elite company like this:
Are the stats that flawed, or are we underrating him. And I'm not counting the Vasquez haters in this, but like I said I don't think even the fan boys would consider him elite.
quote:
Ben Maller ?@benmaller
Hornets Greivis Vasquez and LeBron James are ONLY two players in NBA to record at least six games of 20 points, 10 assists and five rebs
Are the stats that flawed, or are we underrating him. And I'm not counting the Vasquez haters in this, but like I said I don't think even the fan boys would consider him elite.
11
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:03 pm to TigerinATL
He's a middle-of-the-pack starting PG in this League.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:04 pm to TigerinATL
May not be 'elite' but I don't want to get rid of him. He's no CP3, but his stats speak for themselves. He's vital IMO moving forward as a core part of this team. People may flame me for saying that, but unless we could upgrade to a Kyrie/CP or the likes I see no reason in him staying here the duration of his career, unless he falls off the map of course.
Eta: IMO we just need to upgrade one position on this team and we could be a 3-4 seed in the playoffs. Oh and add a few (more) reliable bench players.
Eta: IMO we just need to upgrade one position on this team and we could be a 3-4 seed in the playoffs. Oh and add a few (more) reliable bench players.
This post was edited on 2/26/13 at 2:07 pm
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:09 pm to bddwolfpack
quote:
He's a middle-of-the-pack starting PG in this League.
worse have won a championship.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:10 pm to quail man
quote:
worse have won a championship
They also had superstars surrounding them. We currently don't have that.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:13 pm to Swagger Jacker
quote:
People may flame me for saying that, but unless we could upgrade to a Kyrie/CP or the likes I see no reason in him staying here the duration of his career, unless he falls off the map of course.
I won't flame you for that. In fact, I agree.
Vasquez is good enough and cheap enough, even if we extend him, that the upgrade we could get by replacing him is fairly insignificant compared to upgrading at other positions like the 3 or 5.
That's not even going into the argument that you don't need an elite point to win a title but, instead, elite talent at the 2 and 5.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:14 pm to Swagger Jacker
quote:
Eta: IMO we just need to upgrade one position on this team and we could be a 3-4 seed in the playoffs. Oh and add a few (more) reliable bench players.
Replace Aminu as starter with someone like Wilson Chandler or Ronnie Brewer, get better backups at the guard positions, and we're in business.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:15 pm to WB504
quote:
They also had superstars surrounding them. We currently don't have that.
Not that I think you're saying this, but not having superstars around an above-average PG doesn't mean we should upgrade the PG, it means we should upgrade what's around him.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:20 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
Are the stats that flawed, or are we underrating him
i don't think it necessarily has to be either. stats are stats. although they can be skewed to tell a story, they don't lie.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:20 pm to teke184
quote:
Replace Aminu as starter with someone like Wilson Chandler or Ronnie Brewer, get better backups at the guard positions, and we're in business.
I'm hoping Wilson Chandler or Otto Potter is our starting 3 next year.
quote:
Oh and add a few (more) reliable bench players.
I'm hoping Roberts and Rivers (well at least Rivers), can become that for us. Getting a starter caliber 3, and pushing Aminu to the bench will help too. We already have to great bench players now and Smith and Anderson, so if Rivers can devolp into a legit bench scorer, I think our bench will be good enough.
This post was edited on 2/26/13 at 2:21 pm
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:21 pm to mm2316
quote:
Not that I think you're saying this, but not having superstars around an above-average PG doesn't mean we should upgrade the PG, it means we should upgrade what's around him.
I can't find the article, but a while back Demps was asked if he thinks GV can be a championship PG, and he stated something like you need 3 allstars on your team to win. Either your PG is one and you have 2 others much like the Spurs, or you surround him with 3 allstars like the Heat.
I don't view GV as an allstar PG, so either we need to upgrade that position, or we keep GV and bring in an upgrade at another spot. Whichever happens first is fine with me.
This post was edited on 2/26/13 at 2:23 pm
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:23 pm to mm2316
quote:
quote:
They also had superstars surrounding them. We currently don't have that.
Not that I think you're saying this, but not having superstars around an above-average PG doesn't mean we should upgrade the PG, it means we should upgrade what's around him.
what he said.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:23 pm to mm2316
It's really just a stupid statement in general to say you don't need a good (insert position) in order to win a title. There are multiple examples of teams winning with studs at every position.
As for Vasquez, he is certainly having a great year. But for every elite stat, you can find a bad one. I would love to have him coming off the bench playing 20 MPG. Same with AFA.
If those guys were coming off the bench, this team would be well on it's way. It would mean we upgraded starters, but also have starting caliber players coming off the bench. The money won't work in the long run, but it would be awesome to have.
As for Vasquez, he is certainly having a great year. But for every elite stat, you can find a bad one. I would love to have him coming off the bench playing 20 MPG. Same with AFA.
If those guys were coming off the bench, this team would be well on it's way. It would mean we upgraded starters, but also have starting caliber players coming off the bench. The money won't work in the long run, but it would be awesome to have.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:27 pm to Swagger Jacker
quote:
People may flame me for saying that, but unless we could upgrade to a Kyrie/CP or the likes I see no reason in him staying here the duration of his career, unless he falls off the map of course.
I agree along with many on here
I also feel that people undervalue his leadership. He's without a doubt been our best leader this year on a team that has lacked plenty of it
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:33 pm to TigerinATL
he's not elite, but I think he's underrated by many on here.
...leader of the team
...leader of the team
Posted on 2/26/13 at 2:38 pm to TigerinATL
Difference being Greivis isn't scared of the dunk contest.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 3:08 pm to Chad504boy
I see GV as a guy I'd love to win a title, here or elsewhere. I just see him as good enough to be able to move to bring in quality but not high enough on the pole to be considered untouchable... that is Davis then Anderson in slots one and two at this point.
You move GV to bring in a guy that will fit in behind Anderson squarely and for the duration or if some other deal makes him redundant, thus more valuable in trade. I do not see bringing in a marginal talent upgrade as an upgrade in total.
You move GV to bring in a guy that will fit in behind Anderson squarely and for the duration or if some other deal makes him redundant, thus more valuable in trade. I do not see bringing in a marginal talent upgrade as an upgrade in total.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 3:21 pm to 42
I see him as an above-average PG that still has to improve on his decision making.
If we can get a better scoring SF (sorry AFA, you're just not it for me)
a consistent effort gordon or high caliber SG on the court (somewhat possible)
improvement with anthony davis eventually being a center (time)
I think he'll become a 15pt/5reb/11ast:3TO type of player. I think with a better scoring unit around him, his ast will jump. If you take away some of those wild shots, I think his 43% goes up to 45-47% also.
I'm fine with him, I rather upgrade at SF and get a guy that can come off the bench with ryno and score
If we can get a better scoring SF (sorry AFA, you're just not it for me)
a consistent effort gordon or high caliber SG on the court (somewhat possible)
improvement with anthony davis eventually being a center (time)
I think he'll become a 15pt/5reb/11ast:3TO type of player. I think with a better scoring unit around him, his ast will jump. If you take away some of those wild shots, I think his 43% goes up to 45-47% also.
I'm fine with him, I rather upgrade at SF and get a guy that can come off the bench with ryno and score
Posted on 2/26/13 at 4:02 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
Are the stats that flawed, or are we underrating him. And I'm not counting the Vasquez haters in this, but like I said I don't think even the fan boys would consider him elite.
People are greatly underrating him, in my opinion, but I'm pretty sure Gyno and I are fanboys 1a and 1b.
Posted on 2/26/13 at 4:04 pm to WB504
quote:
They also had superstars surrounding them. We currently don't have that.
Yeah, but we have Gravy. Why reinvent the wheel with another average PG that also won't be surrounded by superstars?
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