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Message
re: Crackpot ASOIAF Theories SPOILERS
Posted on 12/9/12 at 12:05 am to Shiftyplus1
Posted on 12/9/12 at 12:05 am to Shiftyplus1
quote:
Message Posted by Shiftyplus1 Wex told him LINK
Thanks
0
Posted on 12/9/12 at 1:14 am to Gugich22
quote:
"Winter is coming" and the series is called ASO "Ice" and "Fire". This will ultimately be about man vs The Others/White Walkers - and it will take all the Houses of Westeros united plus dragons to defeat the Wights.
The ice and fire I think is more referring to Houses Stark and Targaryen, with Jon Snow being the combination of ice and fire.
Posted on 12/9/12 at 9:18 am to Sid in Lakeshore
quote:
I have always believed this and they were put up to it by Tywin Lannister, to screw up the Stark/Frey alliance.
Seems far fetched. I know it's in the west and he has spies, but Tywin was able to get a message to people inside a castle captured by his biggest enemy in a matter of days? He didn't even know Robb had moved west.
Remember Robb is a horny 16 year old. The Freys are known for being ugly and he nearly died in battle. Makes sense he would want to sleep with a prettygirl (his nurse no less) before he might die. Likewise Jeyne is about the same age and Robb is a handsome king. Two horny kids.
Also this theory ties in much better narratively- Robb's sense of honor ruins him much the same way it did his father.
This post was edited on 12/9/12 at 10:09 am
Posted on 12/9/12 at 9:23 am to OMLandshark
quote:
The ice and fire I think is more referring to Houses Stark and Targaryen, with Jon Snow being the combination of ice and fire.
I think that's what GRRM wants you to believe. Who is going to defeat the others/wights then? The Night's Watch?
This post was edited on 12/9/12 at 9:24 am
Posted on 12/9/12 at 9:46 pm to Gugich22
I'm glad no one wants to discuss this now that I'm caught up. Ya bastards.
Posted on 12/9/12 at 10:38 pm to Gugich22
quote:
I think that's what GRRM wants you to believe. Who is going to defeat the others/wights then? The Night's Watch
I agree with you to an extent. I think the story will ultimately boil down to humans vs others (I think the children of the forest will also be antagonists but that is a different discussion). I also agree that Man's only hope is if they can shuck their petty squabbles and take up arms together as one force. I don't think that it's a coincidence that the others chose THIS TIME (a literal "world war" preceded by 15 years of peace) to attack.
"when winter comes the lone wolf dies but the pack survives)
But I think that the war ultimately hinges on the acts of one, Jon Snow. He is Azor Ahai reborn and his song is the Song of Ice and Fire.
And I can talk ASOIAF all night long
Posted on 12/9/12 at 10:43 pm to Gugich22
quote:
I just don't see how none of you guys can see that the end of this series will not be about who is sitting on the iron throne or who rules what land or resides in what castle. "Winter is coming"...
Not sure where you got the idea we don't. If it hasn't been brought up in here at all, it's probably because, well, it's obvious there ain't much about that to call "crackpot"...But-
I remember at least one of us mentioning the Harrenhal microcosm theory: All that earth and stone are meaningless without men to garrison it's walls... Of what value is the Iron Throne if noone is left to bend the knee?
As far as the title "ASoIaF" only reflecting the pending conflict, that is but one of many potential applications...interpretations not as absolute as they first seem, soon demonstrating a shared tendency to ebb and flow as you progress through the story...hence it's power.
Posted on 12/9/12 at 10:58 pm to 19
quote:
I remember at least one of us mentioning the Harrenhal microcosm theory: All that earth and stone are meaningless without men to garrison it's walls... Of what value is the Iron Throne if noone is left to bend the knee?
That is a very good point. It would be very martinish to end this tale with a "not so happy" ending.
I could also see it ending with the Iron Throne completely losing its power and Westeros reverting back to the days of the andals and the first men. I could see the seven kingdoms truly becoming seven different kingdoms at the end.
After they defeat the others and indefinitely delay the long night the survivors pick themselves back up and go home to rebuild as best as they can. Allowing each other to once again live and let live
Posted on 12/9/12 at 11:06 pm to CottonWasKing
quote:
After they defeat the others and indefinitely delay the long night the survivors pick themselves back up and go home to rebuild as best as they can. Allowing each other to once again live and let live
I think this is how the Starks will ultimately end up on top. They have been through so much in the readers eyes that they HAVE to end up in a good spot, right?
Posted on 12/9/12 at 11:23 pm to Gugich22
Well JoJen did prophesize that the wolves will return to Winterfell. I think they are too far gone for anyone to actually consider any outcome as a "win" for the stark household but I do think that the series will end with a Stark in Winterfell once again. However after all they've lost (and I highly doubt that we are done witnessing stark casualties) that is a very hollow victory. It would write books on the strength and perseverance of the Stark bloodline and it would no doubt inspire many a song but that will be a small condolence to Rickon Stark as he rules the north. A third son should never have to sit a throne.
Posted on 12/9/12 at 11:58 pm to CottonWasKing
quote:
I could also see it ending with the Iron Throne completely losing its power and Westeros reverting back to the days of the andals and the first men. I could see the seven kingdoms truly becoming seven different kingdoms at the end.
So Littlefinger wins in the end?
Posted on 12/10/12 at 12:05 am to OMLandshark
I don't think that that is LF's end game. He wants to bring the great houses to their knees, true enough, but he wants them to be on their knees before him or someone that is under his control. To achieve that goal he must first being anarchy and chaos to the realm but he wants to bring it back under a centralized control eventually. The realm dissolving into 7 different kingdoms for good does not achieve his goals.
Posted on 12/10/12 at 12:41 am to CottonWasKing
quote:
I don't think that that is LF's end game. He wants to bring the great houses to their knees, true enough, but he wants them to be on their knees before him or someone that is under his control. To achieve that goal he must first being anarchy and chaos to the realm but he wants to bring it back under a centralized control eventually. The realm dissolving into 7 different kingdoms for good does not achieve his goals.
I actually think OML is right about his plan. I think he's too smart to think that he could rule/get someone to rule for long. I really think he wants it to be seven different kingdoms
Posted on 12/10/12 at 1:03 am to Carson123987
I just don't see how the old ways fit his motive. He's angry at the system and the families that held him down. Why would he want to give those families even more power and create a situation in which 7 of those identical systems exist.
Posted on 12/10/12 at 1:13 am to CottonWasKing
That's what I don't know. I like how we aren't sure of his goals. Part of what makes him so interesting
Posted on 12/10/12 at 1:42 am to Carson123987
I think Littlefinger, Tyrion, and Jon are all wired cards in that we don't know where they ultimately want/will end up at the end.
Posted on 12/10/12 at 8:00 am to Gugich22
quote:
I think Littlefinger, Tyrion, and Jon are all wired cards in that we don't know where they ultimately want/will end up at the end.
I think we know more or less what Tyrion and Littlefinger want. All Tyrion wants back is his birthright and his lost love. Dany is the best way to that goal since Stannis and Cersei sure as hell aren't allow him to have that. Littlefinger wants the society that kept him from Cat to absolutely crumble. Jon is a wild card since I don't think he himself knows what he wants, especially after he rises from the dead.
Posted on 12/10/12 at 8:07 am to Carson123987
quote:
I actually think OML is right about his plan. I think he's too smart to think that he could rule/get someone to rule for long. I really think he wants it to be seven different kingdoms
I actually think he's trying to split the kingdom in two and will frick over all the ruling northern houses through Sansa, and try to work his way south.
This post was edited on 12/10/12 at 8:08 am
Posted on 12/10/12 at 8:12 am to OMLandshark
An interesting message in the prologue of DWD when six skins is relaying his teachings from Haldon. Talks about a Warg having 12 deaths, but only one true death. I'm on my second reading but not finished. Has it been discussed that maybe it was Ghost, not John that was killed. I can't wait to get to that chapter, but 700 pages stand in my way.
Posted on 12/10/12 at 8:13 am to Preys on Gumps
quote:
An interesting message in the prologue of DWD when six skins is relaying his teachings from Haldon. Talks about a Warg having 12 deaths, but only one true death. I'm on my second reading but not finished. Has it been discussed that maybe it was Ghost, not John that was killed. I can't wait to get to that chapter, but 700 pages stand in my way.
It was clearly Jon that was killed. I don't think Ghost can talk and his brothers killed him for being a talking wolf.
This post was edited on 12/10/12 at 8:14 am
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